View Poll Results: Is there a moral obligation to repay money you borrow?

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  • If you borrow money, you are morally obligated to repay it.

    110 34.48%
  • I feel no moral obligation to repay loans I've taken out

    209 65.52%
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Thread: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

  1. #311
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Because it is keeping your word. Do you think it is moral to say you will pay someone back and never do so?

    Obviously situations can make you break your word, but if you never intended to pay the loan back then you deceived the lender into believing you would.
    [emphasis added by bubba to make the point immediately below]

    what you have described is a prima facie instance of fraud
    hopefully, there is no one on these boards who believes fraud is a moral act
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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  2. #312
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    well, i wouldn't automatically consider a person immoral for defaulting on a loan....but those whom fraudulently take the loan out, or purposefully default even though they have the ability to pay... yeah.. i'd say those were bad people with bad characters... immoral.

    I am actually surprised that it's the more left leaning among us who are arguing their is no moral component in this type of business.
    which is kinda making me wonder what other types of business are bereft of a moral component... or it is simply "business" as a whole that is amoral.
    meh... maybe there's a limit... maybe there's not...... but this has all been an interesting conversation.
    [emphasis added by bubba]

    here's an indicator to evaluate whether the transaction is a business agreement or one subject to morality: was there a signed promissory note. that note definitizes the agreement, legally compelling payment of the debt, subjecting the debtor to collection efforts if there is a default, should the lender chose to exercise that legal process
    if there is not one, then the expectation of repayment is solely based on the morality of the debtor who accepted the loan
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  3. #313
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Liberals have long argued that business men are immoral and at the same time that business is amoral. The human part of the equation somehow affects business and at the same time doesn't affect business. Liberals are not well known for coherent logic and this thread is a good example of it.
    [emphasis added by bubba]

    weak straw man
    that one owns a business enterprise does not then cause him/her to be found immoral
    however, being active within a business, engaged in commerce, does provide that owner with numerous opportunities to display their immorality by their own actions
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  4. #314
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I've been posting on boards like this since '98, and throughout all that time liberals online have been very clear on their belief that businessmen are immoral and only care about profits. The whole they just want to pay you as little as possible and don't care if you strave to death, and hell, if child labor wasn't illegal they would hire them too because they like cheap labor.

    As a businessman I can't help but take it somewhat personally. I pay my workers well with great benefits and I don't much care for how liberals treat me.
    i believe what you are seeing is an element within our population who found the consumer to be at a distinct disadvantage when dealing with some businesses, especially within the financial sector
    which is why those disproportionately of the progressive side of politics, such as Elizabeth Warren, advocated and created the U.S. Consumer Financial Protection Bureau in an effort to try to level the playing field for all parties relative to financial transactions
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    You leave yourself open to violation when you assign morality to something that is amoral.

  6. #316
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    You sign a promise to repay (usually with interest). You gave your word*. You then feel no obligation to uphold your word, AND you feel no guilt whatsoever about it.

    I think we've stumbled upon what's wrong with society.

    Attachment 67179398

    *- Unforeseen dire circumstances not included.
    And it is widespread. This thread tells me that an inordinate amount of people don't consider it important to keep their word or fulfill obligations they accept. Their word means nothing and they cannot be trusted. It is all about integrity and character and this thread indicates that political lean is a good clue about those things.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Nope. Banks use customer's money to enact debt on the consumer. It isn't their money.
    "Don't care. I don't care about polar bears, and I don't care about people who think our policies should be dictated by the effects on polar bears. Polar bears are basically Ice Monsters. Like that thing in the second Star Wars movie. **** em. And anything with more than four legs." -Deuce

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    Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    By the way. If this thread doesn't explain why banks want LARGE down payments, nothing does. There are obviously so many people that feel no moral obligation to pay back their loans that it is extremely risky to loan money to people without enough secured collateral to cover the loan and all the court and administration costs required to recover the losses from these deadbeats.

    Remember that the next time we bitch that banks are too tight with their loan conditions or that the government needs to make home ownership "more accessible" to everyone. Taxpayers shouldn't be on the hook for deadbeats defaulting any more than banks should.

    My belief that people are, basically honest and good, is something I am going to have to reconsider.
    Last edited by Papa bull; 01-24-15 at 09:09 AM.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  9. #319
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    If you borrow money, do you feel there is a moral obligation to repay the money you borrowed?
    Of course, there is that moral obligation. And trust is a wonderful thing.

    But it is better to have good laws, strong contracts, close monitoring and swift, robust and harsh enforcement.

  10. #320
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    Of course, there is that moral obligation. And trust is a wonderful thing.

    But it is better to have good laws, strong contracts, close monitoring and swift, robust and harsh enforcement.
    Clearly, anyone who thinks you can do business on a handshake and expect people to do what's right because it's right is going to get burned. It's just not smart to trust people freely because too many have no character.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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