View Poll Results: Do you believe in morality?

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  • Yes

    56 38.62%
  • No

    89 61.38%
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Thread: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

  1. #21
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Sorry, but your question does not apply to me.
    How so?
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quag View Post
    How so?
    How do I answer a question like that? I don't believe in morality, so exactly how am I supposed to answer a question concerning objective morality? In any event, for morality to have any usefulness it would have to be objective or otherwise any action towards reaching those ends is undoubtedly unjustified.

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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    How do I answer a question like that? I don't believe in morality, so exactly how am I supposed to answer a question concerning objective morality? In any event, for morality to have any usefulness it would have to be objective or otherwise any action towards reaching those ends is undoubtedly unjustified.
    Ok if you don't believe in morality (you should be a politician) then explain why if morality is subjective then it doesn't exist in any meaningful way.
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  4. #24
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    That is a bit argumentative. To be a nihilist means to be the ultimate skeptic, which also means to question life as having any objective meaning, any defined purpose, or have any intrinsic value at all. By extension to engage in that level of skepticism also means to question any and all sources of ethics including self derived ethics. The reason is to be the ultimate skeptic often means to question all that humanity comes up with as standards for social behavior (or control) regardless of source. That does not mean that rejection of systems of belief (theism) equates in itself to nihilism, but it does mean that having an ethical standard and being a nihilist are opposing forces. Why would you suggest having an ethical standard, no matter the source, if nihilism is all about rejection of life having objective meaning?
    No, they aren't. Whether the universe itself cares has nothing to do with whether I do. What difference does it make to me, here on earth living my life, whether I have intrinsic value or meaning to the universe? None whatsoever.

    It doesn't need to have objective meaning. What's wrong with my constructs, if I feel they make life here on earth better, according to the wiring of humans? Nothing. Nothing in nihilism says I can't build all the constructs I want, nor does it contradict with my position that they have no objective truth to them.

    Does the universe acknowledge any of it as "correct"? Not as far as I can tell. There's nothing objective about it.

    And who cares?

    What difference does that make to how I live my life? None.

    Whether the universe cares or not, whether there is any truly objective meaning or not, that doesn't change my need to navigate my life, and it doesn't change my nature as an empathetic creature.

    I am not so insecure that I need to believe that me or my decisions are of intrinsic meaning to the universe in order to make my life seem worth living, and worth living well.

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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quag View Post
    Ok if you don't believe in morality (you should be a politician) then explain why if morality is subjective then it doesn't exist in any meaningful way.
    If morality exists and it is subjective in nature then all moral determinations of what is right and wrong have no importance outside of the person that has made those determinations. Why should I care if you find my action to be morally repugnant and why should you care if I find your action to be morally repugnant? I see no reason for either of us to care what the other finds to be morally offensive if morality is nothing more than opinion. It is completely worthless in debate and completely worthless as any sort of way to determine anything

    If morality is nothing but opinion then there is no such thing as anything being moral or immoral and thus the entirely concept is completely useless.
    Last edited by Henrin; 01-13-15 at 02:28 PM.

  6. #26
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    A few of our posters seem to think that those who have certain ideologies are moral nihilists. For example, they believe that liberals are moral nihilists and thus liberals believe that nothing is either moral or immoral.

    The definition of moral is below for purposes of this poll:

    moral: Concerned with the principles of right and wrong behavior and the goodness or badness of human character.

    So the question is, are you personally concerned with the principles of right and wrong behavior in regards to your own actions and the goodness or badness of your own character?
    Out of curiosity, if everyone gets to define right and wrong in their own terms then isn't the whole concept of a definition pretty much a waste of time?

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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Everything depends on how everything else is framed a wise man once said.


    Try to see it this way:


    -Is the shy, outwardly conservative chemical engineer who never got laid in HS or college who paid for 5-10 prostitutes up until marriage to his wife, is he a nihilist?

    -Is the extroverted, outwardly liberal attorney who bedded 87 women until marriage to his wife, is he any more a nihilist than the above guy?




    How many truly conservative people have you met who could really be called, throughout their whole life, "sexually or morally pure" if we knew their whole past? I doubt it's many at all.

  8. #28
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    If morality exists and it is subjective in nature then all moral determinations of what is right and wrong have no importance outside of the person that has made those determinations. Why should I care if you find my action to be morally repugnant and why should you care if I find your action to be morally repugnant? I see no reason for either of us to care what the other finds to be morally offensive if morality is nothing more than opinion. It is completely worthless in debate and completely worthless as any sort of way to determine anything

    If morality is nothing but opinion then there is no such thing as anything being moral or immoral and thus the entirely concept is completely useless.
    2 things.
    1 As individuals your morals can tell you and often do to consider others.
    2. Societal morals exist and are also subjective. Societal morals are those generally agreed upon by the majority of a society. So yes it is important within that society but may be different between societies.
    These change depending on where/when you are talking about. If they change they are subjective.
    This is why for example, stoning a woman for infedelity is/was moral in some societies but isnt in modern western society.
    A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.
    Winston Churchill



    A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.
    Winston Churchill

  9. #29
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    Out of curiosity, if everyone gets to define right and wrong in their own terms then isn't the whole concept of a definition pretty much a waste of time?
    Where did I argue that everyone simply gets to pick and choose their concept of right and wrong as though it were a cafeteria?
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  10. #30
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    Re: Do you have a personal concept of right and wrong?

    Starting in the early 90's, but particularly growing under Clinton, the American democratic party underwent a deliberate transformation to shed all ethics and integrity. Essentially, "right" is defined as that which serves the party, "wrong" is that which harms or goes against the party.

    I view the more partisan democrats as essentially without ethics, without a code to guide moral choices.

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