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Do you support the legalization of prostitution?

Do you support the legalization of prostitution?

  • Total voters
    120
chromium said:
They would be removed from the database/lose their 'prostitution license' in that case

I think it's a safe bet that in reputable medical offices, such as hospitals, specialists, and primary care, there are far fewer 'rogue professionals' than there are prostitutes who could be avoided under the proposed system due to having stds. No system is immune to fraud, but the point is to *minimize* it
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Agreed it would be more of the individual practices that historically have this problem. Granted it's harder and harder as information technology advances to be able to pull it off, but people keep trying, even to the point of practicing black market medicine.

And stds aren't simply a matter of 'informed consent' but a public health issue. Therefore it's appropriate to keep that form of prostitution illegal
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That's not a form of prostitution. There is no such creature as STD prostitution. But I get your point. Yet this same individual can now go out and infect others even if they do not get paid. So do we keep them on the registry or not? How much of a safety vs. privacy issue is it?
 
Hatuey said:
If you REALLY don't understand how prostitution works, then yes "corruption" is another matter. However, if you do understand it, you realize all of these problems are part of the same issue. Again, if you're going to be discussing how to help women don't start off with nonsensical ideological crap like legalization will help them get paid. The reality is that there are literally tens of thousands of women in the US who are kept subjugated by men through violence. Making prostitution legal won't make these women ask for better wages and dental plans. That's simply not how it works. As a matter of fact, it will drive forced prostitution even further underground and women will be more closely monitored. Again, this isn't something you fix with ideological slogans because there it's far more complex than that.
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Bring up your support, and don't forget to differentiate between those who are in simple domestic violence and those who are specifically hold for prostitution.
 
maquiscat said:
Do your studies show where legalization caused such situations, or are these simply situations that still exist after legalization? Has the situation improved any, even slightly or are even more people being held against their will after legalization? Links to these studies?
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I don't know, ask the prostitutes:

Human Trafficking Persists Despite Legality of Prostitution in Germany - SPIEGEL ONLINE

Alina says that she and the other women were required to pay the pimps €800 a week. She shared a bed in a sleeping room with three other women. There was no other furniture. All she saw of Germany was the Esso gas station around the corner, where she was allowed to go to buy cigarettes and snacks, but only in the company of a guard. The rest of the time, says Alina, she was kept locked up in the club.
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She says that she was hardly ever beaten, nor were the other women. "They said that they knew enough people in Romania who knew where our families lived. That was enough," says Alina. When she occasionally called her mother on her mobile phone, she would lie and tell her how nice it was in Germany. A pimp once paid Alina €600, and she managed to send the money to her family.
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Hardly a single court had heard a case involving a prostitute suing for her wages. Only 1 percent of the women surveyed said that they had signed an employment contract as a prostitute. The fact that the Ver.di union had developed a "sample employment contract in the field of sexual services" didn't change matters. In a poll conducted by Ver.di, a brothel operator said that she valued the prostitution law because it reduced the likelihood of raids. In fact, she said, the law was more advantageous for brothel operators than prostitutes.
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Don't try this ideological bs. The reality is that legalizing prostitution legitimizes pimping and puts women at risk. Not the opposite.
 
maquiscat said:
Bring up your support, and don't forget to differentiate between those who are in simple domestic violence and those who are specifically hold for prostitution.
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Forced prostitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In 2002, the US Department of State repeated an earlier CIA estimate that each year, about 50,000 women and children are brought against their will to the United States for sexual exploitation.[38][39] Former Secretary of State Colin Powell said that "[h]ere and abroad, the victims of trafficking toil under inhuman conditions -- in brothels, sweatshops, fields and even in private homes."[40] In addition to internationally trafficked victims, American citizens are also forced into prostitution. According to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, "100,000 to 293,000 children are in danger of becoming sexual commodities."[41]
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:roll:
 
tres borrachos said:
I didn't know I was talking about Germany.
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Germany has been used in this thread over and over again as a case study on how prostitution ends up after it is legalized. We're definitely not talking about marriage.
 
Hatuey said:
Germany has been used in this thread over and over again as a case study on how prostitution ends up after it is legalized. We're definitely not talking about marriage.
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I didn't mention Germany once, so why would you think I was talking about Germany because other people were?

I didn't say we were talking about marriage. I was following your lead when you talked about women being beaten and held against their will. Women are beaten and held against their will even when they aren't prostitutes. What does that have to do with legalizing prostitution?
 
tres borrachos said:
I didn't mention Germany once
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Irrelevant, the thread is about prostitution and Germany has been used to illustrate examples of just why legalizing it fails. Now, do you have anything to add in regards to prostitution or not? Or do you want to derail it with your ridiculous equivalency of conditions surrounding prostitution and marriage?
 
Hatuey said:
Irrelevant, the thread is about prostitution and Germany has been used to illustrate examples of just why legalizing it fails. Now, do you have anything to add in regards to prostitution or not? Or do you want to derail it with your ridiculous equivalency of conditions surrounding prostitution and marriage?
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So I can't have a valid opinion on the concept of legalizing prostitution because of Germany. Interesting. Irrelevant to me, but if it's meaningful to you, then that's good for you.

Yes, I have something to add. Same thing I said earlier. Prostitution should be legal for anyone of legal age, and it should be regulated and taxed, too.

Why do you keep mentioning marriage?
 
tres borrachos said:
So I can't have a valid opinion
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You can't have a valid opinion because your arguments fail. Women are being trafficking across borders, beaten into submission and then beaten into becoming prostitutes. That fact has remained constant whether prostitution is legal or illegal. If the case is that legalizing it will protect women from such abuses, then it fails as illegal trafficking has simply been driven deeper underground and women are seen as even bigger commodities than before. So then what reason is there for legalizing? Taxation? As if the local gangs/pimps in the US bringing in $33K a week will simply start filing taxes once prostitution is legal. Again, if your arguments were based on something valid, they'd be acceptable. However, the reality is that prostitution brings far more oversight than traffickers are willing to put up with and they'll simply go deeper underground. This has already been demonstrated to happen. :shrug:
 
maquiscat said:
That's not a form of prostitution. There is no such creature as STD prostitution. But I get your point. Yet this same individual can now go out and infect others even if they do not get paid. So do we keep them on the registry or not? How much of a safety vs. privacy issue is it?
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It would be voluntary, so not a privacy issue. Unlike a lot of right wingers, my concern is out of safety and moral grandstanding. If they want a 'license' to prostitute, they'd have to prove std free. If they couldn't prove that, their choices would be another line or work, fewer customers, or prison if caught.
 
Hatuey said:
You can't have a valid opinion because your arguments fail. Women are being trafficking across borders, beaten into submission and then beaten into becoming prostitutes. That fact has remained constant whether prostitution is legal or illegal. If the case is that legalizing it will protect women from such abuses, then it fails as illegal trafficking has simply been driven deeper underground and women are seen as even bigger commodities than before. So then what reason is there for legalizing? Taxation? As if the local gangs/pimps in the US bringing in $33K a week will simply start filing taxes once prostitution is legal. Again, if your arguments were based on something valid, they'd be acceptable. However, the reality is that prostitution brings far more oversight than traffickers are willing to put up with and they'll simply go deeper underground. This has already been demonstrated to happen. :shrug:
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My arguments don't "fail" because I haven't posted any arguments on why it should be legalized. I've posted my opinion, which is that I think it should be legalized, taxed and regulated. That isn't an argument. I haven't made any arguments in this thread.
 
tres borrachos said:
My arguments don't "fail" because I haven't posted any arguments on why it should be legalized.
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Nobody discussed your arguments for legalization, what were discussed were your arguments against keeping it illegal. Like these ones:

There is a large number of women who are being held by their husbands against their will and beaten too.
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Not all prostitutes are being kept in a house against their will and beaten if they don't work.
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These are absurd arguments I was discussing earlier. If you really tried to make a convincing argument against keeping prostitution illegal by comparing domestic violence to women who are being trafficked, you've SERIOUSLY lost credibility in this discussion. The fact that you tried to argue against keeping it illegal by pointing out that some aren't beaten just shows how little concern you have for the safety of these women. The conditions are nowhere near the same or for that matter even somewhat analogous. It's like saying slavery should be legal because some masters don't beat their slaves and some people are free. :roll:
 
Hatuey said:
Nobody discussed your arguments for legalization, what were discussed were your arguments against keeping it illegal. Like these ones:





These are absurd arguments I was discussing earlier. If you really tried to make a convincing argument against keeping prostitution illegal by comparing domestic violence to women who are being trafficked, you've SERIOUSLY lost credibility in this discussion. The fact that you tried to argue against keeping it illegal by pointing out that some aren't beaten just shows how little concern you have for the safety of these women. The conditions are nowhere near the same or for that matter even somewhat analogous. It's like saying slavery should be legal because some masters don't beat their slaves and some people are free. :roll:
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I have no concern over the safety of women in bad situations. Okay, now you're stretching, but if it makes you feel better, go ahead. I enjoy reading sanctimonious posts. They make me laugh.

I think prostitution should be legalized. You don't. I'm not "arguing against keeping it illegal". I posted my opinion on if I think it should be legalized.

By the way, I'm not looking for "credibility" on an anonymous message board. Is that why you post here - to get credibility? This is a place to post opinions and argue your case. But it's anonymous, so there is no credibility between anyone but me & myself.
 
tres borrachos said:
Nice snipping of my post.
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If the safety of women isn't important, then legalization of prostitution will only legitimize forced prostitution. As such keeping prostitution illegal won't change much. Do you disagree? :shrug:
 
Hatuey said:
If the safety of women isn't important, then legalization of prostitution will only legitimize forced prostitution. As such keeping prostitution illegal won't change much. Do you disagree? :shrug:
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Find someone who said the safety of women isn't important to discuss that with. I never said it, and never implied it, and your dishonest snipping of my post doesn't change that. I'm finished here, thanks.
 
Hatuey said:
You mean this person?



I wonder who said that?
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I said that in the post you snipped. You left out this part:

I have no concern over the safety of women in bad situations. Okay, now you're stretching, but if it makes you feel better, go ahead.

And of course, I never said or implied that I don't care about women's safety, and of course you already knew that. My posts are all in this thread.

I thought you were better than troll posts. Guess I was wrong. Your posts are trolling posts, and you know it. Carry on. No interest in playing this game with the storm coming in here, sorry.
 
Absolutely.

With the caveat that some provisions for the health and safety of the prostitutes are included.

Would be faaaaaar better than the current situation.
 
Hatuey said:
I don't know, ask the prostitutes:

Human Trafficking Persists Despite Legality of Prostitution in Germany - SPIEGEL ONLINE







Don't try this ideological bs. The reality is that legalizing prostitution legitimizes pimping and puts women at risk. Not the opposite.
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It is stunning how many people want government to go into the pimping business with fees/taxes/regulations and want the government to legitimate pimping. They are lost in naive views of reality believing their have enlightened views on sexuality, when it is no such thing and the exact opposite.
 
joko104 said:
It is stunning how many people want government to go into the pimping business with fees/taxes/regulations and want the government to legitimate pimping. They are lost in naive views of reality believing their have enlightened views on sexuality, when it is no such thing and the exact opposite.
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I expect human trafficking will exist despite legalized prostitution, some persons have sexual interests which are unacceptable to most.

Like children, harming and/or killing their sexual partner, etc.
 
The Mark said:
I expect human trafficking will exist despite legalized prostitution, some persons have sexual interests which are unacceptable to most.

Like children, harming and/or killing their sexual partner, etc.
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Do you see a distinction between simply decriminalizing and the government regulating prostitution?

Do you believe legalizing prostitution then also must also legalize pimping? There are countries that have decriminalized prostitute but kept pimping illegal.
 
joko104 said:
It is stunning how many people want government to go into the pimping business with fees/taxes/regulations and want the government to legitimate pimping. They are lost in naive views of reality believing their have enlightened views on sexuality, when it is no such thing and the exact opposite.
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We already hving them pimping plumbing and electrical and medical and so many other things, at least by your definition of pimping, so adding prostitution to the list is no big deal.

Again, and maybe you can actually answer this time, why do you want prostitutes to be treated better than other workers instead of equal to other workers, which is a step up from their current situtation?
 
joko104 said:
Do you see a distinction between simply decriminalizing and the government regulating prostitution?

Do you believe legalizing prostitution then also must also legalize pimping? There are countries that have decriminalized prostitute but kept pimping illegal.
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I consider pimping unacceptable because in my mind pimping requires coercion of some sort.

So I tend to support legalized prostitution but am opposed to legalizing pimping.
 
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