View Poll Results: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/rational?

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  • NO

    179 84.43%
  • YES

    22 10.38%
  • OTHER

    11 5.19%
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Thread: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/rational?

  1. #311
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by The Baron View Post


    I was running out of room and was going to have to spread my reply over two post so I had to delete something. You weren’t saying anything coherent so I opted to delete your words instead of my own (it was, after all, my reply).

    And I did nothing dishonest. You cited a poll that showed a minority of the population support state-sponsored religion. A minority is a “small sect of the population”.



    At least you finally acknowledge that leftist murder homosexuals. Kinda makes you wonder why so many homosexuals are leftist, doesn’t it?

    Oh? Do enlighten me! I’m not aware of any laws in the United States that required the death penalty for homosexuals.

    No doubt! Most notably Islamic countries and Uganda.

    Once again, what were these laws?

    Which laws allowed this?

    Yes, I’ve heard of them!

    So exactly what did I say that you are trying to debunk?

    1. What Christians do and what Christianity dictates are often, sadly, very different things. Try to be somewhat objective when making such sweeping and damning arguments. It may help to think of it this way…while some teachers molest their students not all teachers are child molesters.

    2. Islam does kill homosexuals…and Jews…and Christians…and women…and children…and each other…so I’m not real sure what you’re point is about Islam killing people. Islam is a death cult that deifies a moon god and reveres a child molester.

    3. If you think Christians or “Christian-dominated / influenced” governments have killed more gays (or anybody else for that matter) than the Nazis or communists then you are woefully ignorant of history. I can assure you that the 20th Century is not known as “the bloodiest century in history” because of Christians.

    4. With respect to the Westboro Baptist Church, their leader, Fred Phelps, ran for public office several times…as a democrat. You can look it up for yourself.
    One third of the population is not a small sect of people, not in relation to this topic, to these sorts of issues. That is a significant minority. It is larger than most of the populations of groups in the US that we would call "minorities".

    Muslim countries, Uganda and several other countries where Christians are the majority or hold a major place in country policies. Russia is massively adopting traditional Christianity, and low and behold, they are now condemning homosexuals more and more harshly.

    10 Countries That Completely Hate Gay People - Listverse

    The Bible calls for the stoning death of homosexuals, so don't tell me that the Bible isn't violent in its reaction toward homosexuality.

    The death penalty was in place in several states in the past when we became a country. One example is Virginia, in which Thomas Jefferson actually said that the penalty should not be death but rather castration.

    History of Sodomy Laws in the United States - A Timeline History of Sodomy Laws in the United States

    The point was that religious people persecute homosexuals more than secular people, religion based governments have put to death or imprisoned many more people for homosexuality than secular based governments. Even our own government, which has had a huge amount of Christian influence that has only just recently been being done away with, imprisoned and even executed (for a part of our past) homosexuals. It wasn't until we started to dispel Christian beliefs from having significant influence in our laws that our laws lightened up against homosexuality.

    The "bloodiest century in history" is not referring to just the actions of people against homosexuals. And I never claimed it was just Christians, but Christians have played a role in it, along with many other religions.

    He ran as a Democrat because he was completely bat**** crazy. His claim to fame was fighting for civil rights, which he almost certainly did mainly because he recognized that it was going to happen. He might have been out of his gourd, but he was pretty smart when it came to the law.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #312
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    One third of the population is not a...
    How 'bout that?

    I was right all along.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/west/2...-marriage.html
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  3. #313
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by The Baron View Post
    How 'bout that?

    I was right all along.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/west/2...-marriage.html
    It was a for profit wedding chapel not a church, and the whole thing was a fabrication anyway. Anatomy of a Right-Wing Fabrication: No Threat to Idaho Wedding Chapel | Advocate.com

    So you were still wrong.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  4. #314
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Yes, in certain jurisdictions I see is as very likely.

    Using the past as reference to other areas of discrimination doesn't work. In the past, discrimination is services was not criminal. In addition, the civil punishment in the past was a lawsuit by the victim. Now the civil or criminal penalty goes to the government, giving the government a profit motive.
    Last edited by joko104; 02-26-15 at 01:21 AM.

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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    It was a for profit wedding chapel not a church, and the whole thing was a fabrication anyway. Anatomy of a Right-Wing Fabrication: No Threat to Idaho Wedding Chapel | Advocate.com

    So you were still wrong.
    No, it is not an entire fabrication. In the evolved story, to qualify for government exemption for the CRIMINAL anti-discrimination law the religion/religious person must REGISTER with the government first, obtain government permission and then - and only then - did the jurisdiction opt not to prosecute.

  6. #316
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/rational?
    no
    yes
    other

    Until equal rights was given to gays in large ways, personally, Ive never heard this argument which i consider to be completely irrational, a simple fear tactic and conspiracy theory.

    I see no rational basis for this fear based on equal rights for gays since there are rights, laws, the constitution and countless court case precedences blocking something this stupid.

    I havent met one person that thinks churches should be forced and the reality is churches already (before gay rights) legally discriminate on marriages probably in the 1000s a day in this country and always have.

    They have against straight couples, gay couples, based on race, based on religion etc etc etc
    why now, magically, will this change?
    why was it not a fear when minority rights were granted? womans rights? and its never been a fear based on religious discrimination?

    I see ZERO logic in something so absurd BUT, I'm very curious how many people fear this lunacy and thier reasonings . . . maybe im missing something completely logical. SO far I havent seen any, so please share if it happens youll get to do a big I TOLD YOU SO lol

    anyway my vote is no . . HELL NO lol

    also FYI if i ever did see it as a reasonable possibility i would fight my way to the front of the line to fight it tooth and nail!
    Nobody should be forced to be nice. Let assholes be assholes and ignore them.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  7. #317
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Nobody should be forced to be nice. Let assholes be assholes and ignore them.
    I agree 100% but Im not sure what that has to do with the topic.
    This space is currently owned by The Great Winchester, stay tuned for future messages!
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  8. #318
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, it is not an entire fabrication. In the evolved story, to qualify for government exemption for the CRIMINAL anti-discrimination law the religion/religious person must REGISTER with the government first, obtain government permission and then - and only then - did the jurisdiction opt not to prosecute.
    Please cite the federal court decision that ruled anti-discrimination laws as "CRIMINAL".
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Please cite the federal court decision that ruled anti-discrimination laws as "CRIMINAL".
    It is the local law in the OP story.

  10. #320
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    Re: Do you believe the idea of churches being forced to marry people is likely/ration

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) false
    2.) also false
    3.) government hasnt forced anybody to perform anything immoral
    4.) since 1, 2, 3 are false and lies 4 also fails
    5.) see #4

    can you make a post that can ever be backed up with facts or anything even accurate and logical


    lets look at some facts in the US:
    number of businesses forced to participate in gay marriages . . . . ZERO
    number of churches forced to do gay marriages . . . ZERO

    are you just trying to be a ass with this thread?

    i mean really?

    you can say no one was forced to "participate" but the definition of participation is where a lot of people would disagree with you.....yes?

    some of the population believes that any "participation" in a gay wedding goes against their beliefs? do you agree with that statement?

    instead of the customer taking their business elsewhere, either the customer or one of their "friends" starts the discrimination process

    so what happens to the shop owner? is he left alone? is he allowed to stay in business?

    or does the government in some form tell him either to participate, or else?

    not sure what your definition is of "force" or "coercion" but those meet mine

    maybe highly religious people shouldnt be in businesses that have marriages as part of their business

    florists, decorators, bakeries, rental halls, etc

    for some people it is no big deal.....and they welcome the business

    for others, it is a big deal.....and they would rather shut down their business than be "forced" to participate in something they find so repulsive

    it used to be that businesses were free to associate and do business with who they wanted

    for some, i understand the need for the change in the law......hospitals, public conveyance, inns & hotels, etc

    for the others, i dont.....there are more than one florist that can be used.....or one bakery

    end of rant...
    “Most of the shadows of this life are caused by standing in one's own sunshine.”

    Ralph Waldo Emerson

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