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Did the NYPD do the right thing by turning their backs on the mayor?

Did the NYPD do the right thing by turning their backs on the mayor?


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Generally bad policy to to do something that a significant partner of course considers as betraying them. Right, wrong, or indifferent, should that significant partner perceive it as such, it isn't something that you should do.
So in this, I think it's the mayor that fired the first shot, not the NYPD.



The only shot that counts is the one that gets the job done.

The rest are just a waste of ammo. :roll:
 
Hmmm interesting justification. Well when is the "greater good"?

The good for the city and it's citizens, of course, at least in this case.

Well I didnt know what it was. But what does police having going on stirke have to going to De'Blaiso's speech a month ago?

The first could very well lead to the other. If it turns into a game of chicken, it's down to who's going to blink first. If it does get to that, and I hope it doesn't, everyone's going to end up losing.

You said he somehow was a figure that lead to this attack and that the few hundred police were justified in turning their backs. Then you brought up his speech in early December in justification of these actions, yet in his speech he PRAISED the police...

He praised the police. How is that "objectionable"?

Clearly the police don't think so. I'd suggest that you ask them.

Well he hasnt done anything..

Of course he has. He has utterly failed as a leader, and the cops appear to smell that, and reject that, and him, because of it.

Why do they have to be mutually exclusive?

Yeah, it's had just superb results so far. The situation in NYC we have now is largely attributable de Blasio's left wing push. But NYC residents should have realized this when they voted for him. Oh well, guess they realize it now.

Why is their strife in the first place? The mayor did nothing wrong.....

Of course he has. He has utterly failed as a leader, and the cops appear to smell that, and reject that, and him, because of it.

So he shouldnt of spoke???

Again, you take only the very first 1/3 of that more complete thought. Try taking the entire thought in context.

RESPECT MY AUTHORITAAHHH MR MAYOR!!!

You think that if you keep going around this circle track of yours that you are actually going to get somewhere? Frankly, I tire of covering the same ground over and over.
 
The good for the city and it's citizens, of course, at least in this case.
Only when you deem them right?

The first could very well lead to the other. If it turns into a game of chicken, it's down to who's going to blink first. If it does get to that, and I hope it doesn't, everyone's going to end up losing.
So we are playing the coulda game now?


Clearly the police don't think so. I'd suggest that you ask them.
*Cough* A few hundred out of 25,000....

Of course he has. He has utterly failed as a leader, and the cops appear to smell that, and reject that, and him, because of it.
Wait I thought it doesnt matter what you think, now its somehow "he failed as a leader".....

Yeah, it's had just superb results so far. The situation in NYC we have now is largely attributable de Blasio's left wing push. But NYC residents should have realized this when they voted for him. Oh well, guess they realize it now.
You didnt answer my question.. Just tip toed around it..


Of course he has. He has utterly failed as a leader,
Again, I thought it doesnt matter what you think. Now all the sudden you do have an opinion...

and the cops appear to smell that, and reject that, and him, because of it.
*Cough* A few hundred out of 25,000...


Again, you take only the very first 1/3 of that more complete thought. Try taking the entire thought in context.
:lamo


You think that if you keep going around this circle track of yours that you are actually going to get somewhere? Frankly, I tire of covering the same ground over and over.
Well thats essentially what your saying, and I quote in post #40: "It doesn't matter what I think are the facts or are not, nor does it matter what you think the facts are or are not. What matters is what the police think the facts are or are not,"
 
Actually, it wasn't JUST the NYPD that turned their backs to de Blasio. All the LEO's visiting from near and far, and in some cases internationally, all did.

A higher class mayor wouldn't have received such treatment, but then, a higher class mayor wouldn't have thrown his own police force under the bus like the classless de Blasio did. de Blasio could have elected to say very little or nothing, and would have been better off.

You support the protesters for their chanting and calling for dead cops, yes? Yet you are against the LEOs doing the same? Expressing themselves. Interesting that inconsistency.

So, what you're saying it was a sea of blue pigs bolstering their position of the code of silence among themselves. Which is why citizens need to be extremely careful when dealing with cops, as they are not to be trusted with human life.
 
From the video footage that I saw, it wasn't a very few, I'd place it between 50 and 100 or so.

While I would agree wit you that a funeral isn't the right time and place for protest (unlike the Westboro idiots), I understand the LEOs position on this, and support that position.

What's the saddest to me is that a solemn time of a funeral, being there to honor a fallen fellow officer, there in support of that officer's family, the LEOs were put in a position where they felt that had to protest de Blasio.

We are seeming to forget that it was de Blasio's actions and words alone which has causing this tear in the relationship between the mayor and his police force.
You support cops ganging up on an unarmed citizen for selling single cigarettes out of a pack he owned, and then dying at their hands? Let me ask you, when do you believe that the police actually commit brutality? surely it can't be when a person dies at their hands for a minor offense. There will come a day when citizens will say enough is enough, we're living in a police state.
 
Well thats essentially what your saying, and I quote in post #40: "It doesn't matter what I think are the facts or are not, nor does it matter what you think the facts are or are not. What matters is what the police think the facts are or are not,"

It's true. This is going to have to be resolved by the NYPD and the mayor. The NYPD feels that it's the injured party here, at the hands of the mayor. Those two parties are going to have work it out.

It's never a good policy to piss off a major partner in running and managing a city the size of NYC. In that, de Blasio have failed as a leader of the City. I'm not seeing the controversy here. I think it's rather obvious that this is the case.

You have a counter case, one that shows how fabulous a leader he really is, bring it.
 
It really doesn't matter much what you or I think or what you or I feel about this. It matters a great deal what the cops think and what the cops feel about this. They think and feel that they've been thrown under the bus.

The cops, in unison, across the nation, and indeed across to other nations as well, react to de Basio's words that they were thrown under the bus by the mayor. This is going to poison this vitally important relationship, between of the office of the mayor and the police force, and, as makes no difference, renders this particular mayor as ineffective and incapable of properly discharging the duties of his elected office. Perhaps he should resign.

Frankly, I think he shouldn't have been showing off his progressive / liberal cred in this instance, he should have been a leader and backed up his police force, or perhaps not said anything at all. Why did he wade in, into a no win situation for him, and say what he did? Where's his gain for saying what he did? He has none that I can see. How foolish is that?

Ever been a member of the military? If so, when your commander gave you orders, or the room you were in was called to attention, did you turn your back on the commander? Ever been to a large funeral? Ever turn your back on the eulogy speech? Are you married, have a girlfriend/boyfriend? do you turn your back on them when they're speaking to you?
 
You support cops ganging up on an unarmed citizen for selling single cigarettes out of a pack he owned, and then dying at their hands? Let me ask you, when do you believe that the police actually commit brutality? surely it can't be when a person dies at their hands for a minor offense. There will come a day when citizens will say enough is enough, we're living in a police state.

No one living in the US has even an inkling what it is to live in a police state. That's a nice straw man there. Because we aren't.

Martin died because he was in ill health and resisted arrest. Had he not resisted arrest, likely he'd still be alive today.

What exactly were the orders for the cops that arrested Martin? Who issued them? And why? If they weren't explicit orders specific to sellers of lucies, why is it that all 4 or 5 of them were all on board with the arrest?

Yes, cops can, and do, commit brutality. I don't think that the arrest of Martin is one of them.
 
So, what you're saying it was a sea of blue pigs bolstering their position of the code of silence among themselves. Which is why citizens need to be extremely careful when dealing with cops, as they are not to be trusted with human life.

Your use of the term 'pigs' in reference to police officers is already telling that you probably aren't willing to give them the rights they are ensuring that you have.

You going to put wings on a few more?
 
You support cops ganging up on an unarmed citizen for selling single cigarettes out of a pack he owned, and then dying at their hands?

No. If you read what I posted, you'll see that I support the police for turning their backs on de Blasio, for

Let me ask you, when do you believe that the police actually commit brutality? surely it can't be when a person dies at their hands for a minor offense. There will come a day when citizens will say enough is enough, we're living in a police state.

I see you are advocating further violence and civil insurrection. Well, good luck with that.
 
No one living in the US has even an inkling what it is to live in a police state. That's a nice straw man there. Because we aren't.

Martin died because he was in ill health and resisted arrest. Had he not resisted arrest, likely he'd still be alive today.

What exactly were the orders for the cops that arrested Martin? Who issued them? And why? If they weren't explicit orders specific to sellers of lucies, why is it that all 4 or 5 of them were all on board with the arrest?

Yes, cops can, and do, commit brutality. I don't think that the arrest of Martin is one of them.

Oh, so he died while resisting arrest. For a minor offense. Are you a cop? I hope not.
 
Your use of the term 'pigs' in reference to police officers is already telling that you probably aren't willing to give them the rights they are ensuring that you have.

You going to put wings on a few more?

Cops give me no rights, they ensure none of my rights. But they have the right to do whatever they wish, because they have badges, and can perform homicides legally.
 
It's true.
So it was essentially, "We are the NYPD RESPECT MY AUTHORITAAHHHH"....

It's never a good policy to piss off a major partner in running and managing a city the size of NYC.
They have no reason to be pissed because the mayor did nothing wrong....
Its not like he came out and said "All cops are bastards". Its not like he said "all cops are racists". Its not like he said "the NYPD sucks". He did the EXACT opposite. He PRAISED, the NYPD.... You even posted a video where he did that!
 
No. If you read what I posted, you'll see that I support the police for turning their backs on de Blasio, for



I see you are advocating further violence and civil insurrection. Well, good luck with that.

You're now stretching, how does it feel to be a liar?
 
Why not hold the mayor to a higher standard?



I think that the Mayor has the right to hold his police force accountable for their actions. By their actions, they are showing disrespect and sending a message that they will continue to do as they please..
 
I'll say right off, I think it was a low class thing to do.

BBhgHfe.img

Of course not. They were being downright childish. No one blamed the President for insurgent attacks after his administration attempted to tackle Abu Graib and we certainly didn't see soldiers 'turning their backs' on him like petulant children. This is an analogous situation. There are problems in our major police forces across country, including the NYPD, and the Mayor was right to openly address those problems. Blaming him for the actions of a lone gunmen is ludicrous. What they are really doing is using those officers deaths as ammunition to pushback against the legitimate criticism and clarion calls that have gone out about how our police operate.
 
And I agree with you on this point, as I agreed with Kobie earlier in this thread. The funeral is in honor of the deceased, and in support of their families.

All I'm saying is that I understand the officer's position on this, and have come to realize that it's their perception of the situation that counts far more so than mine, yours, or anyone else's not directly involved. Maybe you'll have better luck with TheDemSocialist on this. He seems to not understand what I'm saying.
No. Why did they do it in such a public manner, then? Because they wanted you and I and everyone else to take notice.
 
No one living in the US has even an inkling what it is to live in a police state. That's a nice straw man there. Because we aren't.

Martin died because he was in ill health and resisted arrest. Had he not resisted arrest, likely he'd still be alive today.

What exactly were the orders for the cops that arrested Martin? Who issued them? And why? If they weren't explicit orders specific to sellers of lucies, why is it that all 4 or 5 of them were all on board with the arrest?

Yes, cops can, and do, commit brutality. I don't think that the arrest of Martin is one of them.
Had they not done whatever it is they did to him, likely he'd still be alive today, too. What's your point?

(I'm presuming you mean Garner)
 
Had they not done whatever it is they did to him, likely he'd still be alive today, too. What's your point?

(I'm presuming you mean Garner)

Yes, I did. late night typo / wrong name there.

I too find it rather incredulous that police resources are wasted on a minor offense such as selling lucies. I think this is a waste of valuable policing resources, and obviously any common sense person wouldn't bother with such unless there's something else going on, perhaps such as explicit orders to enforce that misdemeanor and arrest violators. I'm just asking what else is going on, and not just blaming the cop on the beat.
 
It's true. This is going to have to be resolved by the NYPD and the mayor. The NYPD feels that it's the injured party here, at the hands of the mayor. Those two parties are going to have work it out.

It's never a good policy to piss off a major partner in running and managing a city the size of NYC. In that, de Blasio have failed as a leader of the City. I'm not seeing the controversy here. I think it's rather obvious that this is the case.

You have a counter case, one that shows how fabulous a leader he really is, bring it.


So it was essentially, "We are the NYPD RESPECT MY AUTHORITAAHHHH"....

Surely you can do better than that.

They have no reason to be pissed because the mayor did nothing wrong....
Its not like he came out and said "All cops are bastards". Its not like he said "all cops are racists". Its not like he said "the NYPD sucks". He did the EXACT opposite. He PRAISED, the NYPD.... You even posted a video where he did that!

Well obviously that's not what they heard. Have you ever heard that good speaking skills also takes the audience into consideration? In this case, that'd be the police.

Clearly the mayor didn't do that, or at least not enough of that, 'cause the cops are pissed off.

I'm also beginning to wonder what else, out side of the public eye and reporting, is going on here. What else is it that's got the cops all up in arms. Gotta be something above and beyond this.
 
Cops give me no rights, they ensure none of my rights. But they have the right to do whatever they wish, because they have badges, and can perform homicides legally.

No, they haven't given you any rights, those human rights come from God, as the founding father's documented in the Constitution. The cops make sure that you are free to exercise those rights.

No, the cops aren't allowed to do whatever they wish. That's a false narrative. The cops are pretty constrained in how they need to respond in various situations.

Clearly you aren't a cop, and you've not studied what it is that they are charged with doing. Now, I profess no special knowledge about this, other than I know that cops are in fact constrained in what they can do by law and by their department's policies.
 
No, they haven't given you any rights, those human rights come from God, as the founding father's documented in the Constitution. The cops make sure that you are free to exercise those rights.

No, the cops aren't allowed to do whatever they wish. That's a false narrative. The cops are pretty constrained in how they need to respond in various situations.

Clearly you aren't a cop, and you've not studied what it is that they are charged with doing. Now, I profess no special knowledge about this, other than I know that cops are in fact constrained in what they can do by law and by their department's policies.
Ask yourself why cops constantly violate a US citizen's first and fourth amendments to the United States Constitution, then get back to me with something which makes sense.

First Amendment to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
He threw them under the bus, why shouldn't they do the same?
 
The targeting of cops is being fed by an irrational animus that is fed by self-serving political animals who use it for money, influence, and power. Mayor DeBlasio is one of those, and has absolutely thrown the people who have a right to expect his support under the bus, choosing to feed the animus rather than strengthen the system, with detrimental results both for the police force and the populace.

However, uniformed police officers have no business making political statements for or against. You're not going to find much love for the POTUS in the military, either, but that does not change the fact that they should avoid any public display of disrespect.
 
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