View Poll Results: When did the United States change stop following the founding fathers vision

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  • 1790-1860

    93 35.09%
  • 1860-1900

    70 26.42%
  • 1900-1932

    57 21.51%
  • 1932-1945

    26 9.81%
  • Other (explain)

    19 7.17%
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Thread: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

  1. #51
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    can somebody explain the obsession with keeping government in America as it was 225 years ago when we were a tiny backwater coastal strip of 4 million farmers and fisherman pretty much isolated from the rest of the world?

    It would be like a 45 year old trying to fit into the outfit he wore for his third birthday.
    It's quite simple, they don't like paying taxes.


  2. #52
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    This should provide an interesting discussion.

    The question is this: can you estimate the time period where the united state stopped following the founding fathers exact vision of how the government should operate, as detailed in the federalist papers, U.S constitution, and other founding documents?

    The time periods under scrutiny are as follows:

    1. 1790-1860s. The first time frame covers the administrations of the founding fathers and goes up to the start of the civil war. This time frame assumes that the founding fathers did not adhere to a static interpration of the constitution and found it necessary to fill in the blanks with regards to practical governance.

    2.the second time frame starts in 1860 and concludes around 1900.

    3. Time frame three is set around 1900 and lasts until 1932.

    4. The fourth choice of time frame is from 1932 to 1945.

    If these options seem limited, make your own theory as a fifth option.
    Each founding father had different ideas about how to run the country. They put them all together to form a document, they all signed said document, but that doesn't even mean they all agreed with everything in it!! So, I'm not really sure how to answer these types of questions. Also the way in which this question is presented makes it seem like you are leaving out huge chunks of history, law, and the formation of our current modern day society. That being said, how else would you expect this society to push forward in the way that it did? Because what you are suggesting cannot and will not be done. What you are suggesting would be an alternative universe. And I quite like how this society has turned out so far
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  3. #53
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    anonymous polls suck



  4. #54
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Obviously the Constitution is repugnant to anyone with socialist beliefs.
    It's a work in progress. It certainly has a few flaws. At least 17 of them since ratification. Well, 15. Frankly, conservatives don't seem to have much respect for the constitution. Not as it actually is. You only seem to like parts of it and want to ignore the rest. But you like to proclaim that it means whatever you want it to mean pretty constantly. Claiming to be an "originalist" or a "strict constructionist" is just an appeal to authority, pretending that your interpretation is any better than anyone else's, instead of the ones that are actually better supported. But by all means, just take a swipe at my lean. That amounts to... something...
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  5. #55
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    It's a work in progress. It certainly has a few flaws. At least 17 of them since ratification. Well, 15. Frankly, conservatives don't seem to have much respect for the constitution. Not as it actually is. You only seem to like parts of it and want to ignore the rest. But you like to proclaim that it means whatever you want it to mean pretty constantly. Claiming to be an "originalist" or a "strict constructionist" is just an appeal to authority, pretending that your interpretation is any better than anyone else's, instead of the ones that are actually better supported. But by all means, just take a swipe at my lean. That amounts to... something...
    You don't have an iota worth of proof of anything you just said about conservatives or originalists.
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  6. #56
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Crovax View Post
    Now you are just making stuff up. The controlled substances act is authorized by article 6 of the constitution and that power couldnt [sic] be used to ban guns as stated in Reid v Covert
    Really?

    All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this Constitution, as under the Confederation.

    This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

    The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution; but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.

    I don't see it. Where is there any support in this text for the federal government to regulate “controlled substances”?

    Keep in mind that when there was a movement to ban alcohol at the national level, it was widely and correctly understood that the Constitution did not allow it, and that the only legitimate way to do so was to specifically amend the Constitution in order to establish this power, hence, the Eighteenth Amendment.
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  7. #57
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    This should provide an interesting discussion.

    The question is this: can you estimate the time period where the united state stopped following the founding fathers exact vision of how the government should operate, as detailed in the federalist papers, U.S constitution, and other founding documents?

    The time periods under scrutiny are as follows:

    1. 1790-1860s. The first time frame covers the administrations of the founding fathers and goes up to the start of the civil war. This time frame assumes that the founding fathers did not adhere to a static interpration of the constitution and found it necessary to fill in the blanks with regards to practical governance.

    2.the second time frame starts in 1860 and concludes around 1900.

    3. Time frame three is set around 1900 and lasts until 1932.

    4. The fourth choice of time frame is from 1932 to 1945.

    If these options seem limited, make your own theory as a fifth option.
    The founding father fought as to the vision and path of the Nation even before it's inception...1776.


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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    The longest lasting and most serious violations of the constitution took place during the New Deal
    And that established the precedents on which a whole plague of further violations are built. FDR did more to undermine the Constitution and to harm this nation than all other Presidents combined.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  9. #59
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    It's quite simple, they don't like paying taxes.
    Good observation. I also think they don't like lots of other things that come with 21st century civilization in the USA as well - the main one being the simple acceptance that there must be a balance between the individual and society so that both can live in harmony.
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  10. #60
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    Re: When did the United States stop following the path of the founding fathers?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Good observation. I also think they don't like lots of other things that come with 21st century civilization in the USA as well - the main one being the simple acceptance that there must be a balance between the individual and society so that both can live in harmony.
    Interesting. Would contributing to the cost of civilization in the 21st century be on of those things that allows people to live in harmony, or is it demanding others do so that brings people together?

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