View Poll Results: Separation of Education and state

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  • Total separation from all levels of government. All education privatized.

    26 3.86%
  • Total separation except for cities.

    35 5.19%
  • Total separation except for counties.

    47 6.97%
  • Total separation except for cities and counties.

    51 7.57%
  • Total separation except for states.

    68 10.09%
  • Separation except for states and cities

    48 7.12%
  • Separation except for states and counties

    55 8.16%
  • Separation from federal government only.

    49 7.27%
  • No separation

    216 32.05%
  • Other (specify)

    79 11.72%
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Thread: Separation of Education and State

  1. #61
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Yup. They do.
    Feel free to paste in the text from the constitution that empowers them to do so.

  2. #62
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    Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    I say that because congress has no power to enact laws pertaining to how the people of the states educate their children.
    Alright but they have for decades and will continue to do. so what on earth is your point? No one cares and you won't change any minds.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  3. #63
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    Feel free to paste in the text from the constitution that empowers them to do so.
    Oh lord internet libertarians are hopeless.

    I'm glad you found some pocket guides to classical liberalism and strict constructionism, but please bring yourself back to reality.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  4. #64
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Alright but they have for decades and will continue to do. so what on earth is your point? No one cares and you won't change any minds.
    The fact that they have for decades is irrelevant to the meaning of the constitution.

    Congress has no power to enact laws pertaining to how the people of the states educate their children.

  5. #65
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Oh lord internet libertarians are hopeless.

    I'm glad you found some pocket guides to classical liberalism and strict constructionism, but please bring yourself back to reality.
    The reality is that, per the constitution for the united states of america, the government of the union was never granted any power to enact laws pertaining to how the people of the several states educate their children.

  6. #66
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    Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    The fact that they have for decades is irrelevant to the meaning of the constitution.

    Congress has no power to enact laws pertaining to how the people of the states educate their children.
    Your pontificating is meaningless. If the government has in fact violated its governing language (a point of contention) and has almost universal support from both the public and all levels of government, then there should be no contention that they have the power to do so. They may have violated the Constitution, but their actions demonstrate power. Governing language is not power without consent and/or enforcement. Your point has neither.


    Now join us back in reality please.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  7. #67
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Your pontificating is meaningless. If the government has in fact violated its governing language (a point of contention) and has almost universal support from both the public and all levels of government, then there should be no contention that they have the power to do so. They may have violated the Constitution, but their actions demonstrate power. Governing language is not power without consent and/or enforcement. Your point has neither.


    Now join us back in reality please.
    I see. So you are saying that if the law has been violated for a long time or by the powerful then the law is null and void.

    I'm not sure I agree. Per the constitution, the constitution is the supreme law of the land. The fact that the law is violated doesn't repeal the law.

    I prefer the rule of law to anarchy.

  8. #68
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    I see. So you are saying that if the law has been violated for a long time or by the powerful then the law is null and void.
    In practice, yes. You have to move where the dialogue is in order to say or do anything of worth.

    Like I said, I'm glad you have found a couple of books and some online articles, but for those of us actually interested in moving the needle one direction or another, we focus on education policy rather than meaningless blathering.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  9. #69
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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    In practice, yes. You have to move where the dialogue is in order to say or do anything of worth.

    Like I said, I'm glad you have found a couple of books and some online articles, but for those of us actually interested in moving the needle one direction or another, we focus on education policy rather than meaningless blathering.
    So just to be clear, you're saying that the constitution, the supreme law of the land, the glue that hold the several states together, should be ignored?

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    Re: Separation of Education and State

    There is a role for all levels of government in providing funding for education. It seems to me that there could be some scales of economy in creating lesson plans, computer based and track self paced learning, etc. on the federal level and make this available to local school districts, public and private.
    The best educational systems seem to be in Finland, Denmark, Australia, and New Zealand. In Finland, the Education Minister gives credit to local control of schools. In Denmark, private schools make up a good part of the program, subsidized with vouchers. Both countries have less required years than the US. So, there should be local controls, vouchers to allow more private schools, including religious based ones.

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