• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

What do you think the future of the USA will be like ?

What do you think the future of the USA will be like ?

  • Total voters
    47
Libertie76 said:
Well I'm glad you've added such a rational economic response to what I was saying the negative effects of inflation is, then you added the rolling of the eyes like I have no idea what I'm talking about. Please explain to me the best way you can why he american economy will not collapse
Click to expand...

As long as we keep producing goods and services, our economy will not collapse. Of course that doesn't mean that our economy can't collapse, it certain could, if we stopped producing goods and services.
 
imagep said:
Nope.
Click to expand...

It's owned by the banks in the federal reserve system, and it has stock but it's considered a "non profit" system, it's in a sense a firm of banks monopolizing a single money supply idk how you don't understand this
 
shrubnose said:
Productivity in the USA continues to increase.
Click to expand...

... Wow way to misquote my initial point. The research and development of certain technologies has been slowed down due to the faulty information we receive in market procedure due to the actual research and data falsities inflation creates in the market
 
shrubnose said:
Productivity in the USA continues to increase.
Click to expand...

Yup.

And aside from some sort of huge natural disaster, or nuclear war, or all our wealth aggregating into the hands of a few, I can't come up with a scenario in which our productivity wouldn't continue to increase.

People keep hollaring that "it's the federal debt", but I scarcely see how that effects the production of goods and services in the US. There's simply no connection.
 
imagep said:
As long as we keep producing goods and services, our economy will not collapse. Of course that doesn't mean that our economy can't collapse, it certain could, if we stopped producing goods and services.
Click to expand...

To have an economy you need to have an organized method of resource distribution correct? If the value of the dollar inflates to a level where it is no longer valuable by any means on the world market, then there will be no actual point in working, because working will be waste. This is how an economy collapses. Then, when that happens, the banks will buy up the debt of the failed American economy this isn't that hard to understand
 
Libertie76 said:
It's owned by the banks in the federal reserve system, and it has stock but it's considered a "non profit" system, it's in a sense a firm of banks monopolizing a single money supply idk how you don't understand this
Click to expand...

The fed makes a lot of money. And they turn over those profits to the treasury.

Now how many privately owned businesses turn over 100% of their profits to the treasury?

Those stocks don't represent ownership and they can't be privately traded. It's just a requirment to form a bank.
 
imagep said:
The fed makes a lot of money. And they turn over those profits to the treasury.

Now how many privately owned businesses turn over 100% of their profits to the treasury?

Those stocks don't represent ownership and they can't be privately traded. It's just a requirment to form a bank.
Click to expand...

* “The Federal Reserve’s income is derived primarily from the interest on U.S. government securities that it has acquired through open market operations. . . . After paying its expenses, the Federal Reserve turns the rest of its earnings over to the U.S. Treasury.”5

From the federal reserve website. We don't know how much money they pay themselves because we've never audited them

You have to buy in to the federal reserve system in order to be a bank, do you understand this? If you're a prominent banking owner you have to join the firm. Or the monopolized banking industry, the firm being the federal reserve system. It's not a business like you think it's a monopolized firm
 
Libertie76 said:
Well I'm glad you've added such a rational economic response to what I was saying the negative effects of inflation is, then you added the rolling of the eyes like I have no idea what I'm talking about.
Please explain to me the best way you can why he american economy will not collapse
Click to expand...
Click to expand...



The USA will survive because of its citizens hard work and its politicians BS.
 
Libertie76 said:
To have an economy you need to have an organized method of resource distribution correct?
Click to expand...

Yup.

If the value of the dollar inflates to a level where it is no longer valuable by any means on the world market, then there will be no actual point in working, because working will be waste.
Click to expand...

I have to assume that you meant deflate", not inflate. Yes, if the dollar no longer had enough value to be accepted, then it would be valueless. If you have a legitmate concern that your dollars are valueless, you are more than welcome to send them to me. They aren't valueless to me, and as long as Walmart accepts them, then they have plenty enough value to me.

This is how an economy collapses. Then, when that happens, the banks will buy up the debt of the failed American economy this isn't that hard to understand
Click to expand...

The part where you are basically insisting that hyperinflation is just around the corner. I've been hearing that ever since I was about 10 or 12 years old. It hasn't happened yet, and today is my 50th birthday.

Fortunately, we have mechanisms in our system which prevent hyperinflation.

If the simple loss of purchasing power over a period of time could collapse our economy, then why hasn't our economy already collapsed (the dollar has lost 98% of it's value during the past 100 years)?
 
shrubnose said:
The USA will survive because of its citizens hard work and its politicians BS.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying the USA won't survive I'm saying is the underlying crisis of our future
 
Libertie76 said:
I'm not saying the USA won't survive I'm saying is the underlying crisis of our future
Click to expand...

I still don't understand what this crisis is.

You make it sound like it is inflation, yet we have already deflated the value of our dollar by 98%, and our economy is one of the strongest in the world, so apparently inflation doesn't make for a crises.
 
imagep said:
Yup.



I have to assume that you meant deflate", not inflate. Yes, if the dollar no longer had enough value to be accepted, then it would be valueless. If you have a legitmate concern that your dollars are valueless, you are more than welcome to send them to me. They aren't valueless to me, and as long as Walmart accepts them, then they have plenty enough value to me.



The part where you are basically insisting that hyperinflation is just around the corner. I've been hearing that ever since I was about 10 or 12 years old. It hasn't happened yet, and today is my 50th birthday.

Fortunately, we have mechanisms in our system which prevent hyperinflation.

If the simple loss of purchasing power over a period of time could collapse our economy, then why hasn't our economy already collapsed (the dollar has lost 98% of it's value during the past 100 years)?
Click to expand...

1. Inflation means devaluing the dollar, idk where you get deflation in this

2. Theyre valueless in the sense that there is no inherent backing to it besides the promise it's worth something

3. We've been experiencing hyper inflation. 40 years and the prices considered by CPI has went from 40 to around 230. That's hyperinflation

4. Mechanisms in our system such as government becoming involved in the economy?

5. Because we keep inflating the dollar. That's why it hasn't collapsed. But this reaction inly prolongs it and makes it worse
 
imagep said:
I still don't understand what this crisis is.

You make it sound like it is inflation, yet we have already deflated the value of our dollar by 98%, and our economy is one of the strongest in the world, so apparently inflation doesn't make for a crises.
Click to expand...

You have no idea what inflation and deflation is do you
 
Libertie76 said:
1. Inflation means devaluing the dollar, idk where you get deflation in this
Click to expand...
you said "If the value of the dollar inflates to a level" If the value of the dollar inflates, that means that it becomes more valuable, and thus we would have deflation. I don't think that's what you intended to imply

2. Theyre valueless in the sense that there is no inherent backing to it besides the promise it's worth something
Click to expand...
Sure, and they are backed by everything that I can buy with them. When was the last time that I couldn't purchase something or pay a bill with US dollars? Hell, if I want to, I can even exchange my dollars for GOLD.

3. We've been experiencing hyper inflation. 40 years and the prices considered by CPI has went from 40 to around 230. That's hyperinflation
Click to expand...

No qualified economist would ever consider that to be hyperinflation. But to any extent that you think it's hyperinflation, they why hasn't our economy already collapsed, seeing how we have been having hyperinflation for 40 years.

4. Mechanisms in our system such as government becoming involved in the economy?
Click to expand...
Our government has been involved in our economy as long as we have had a government, but yes.

5. Because we keep inflating the dollar. That's why it hasn't collapsed. But this reaction inly prolongs it and makes it worse
Click to expand...

No, when we have inflation, the value of the dollar is being deflated. Are you trying to play some sort of Tea Party opposite day game?
 
Libertie76 said:
You have no idea what inflation and deflation is do you
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I don't accept the backwards tea party definition. I accept the widely accepted definitions.

When we have inflation, prices in general rise, and the purchasing power of the dollar is reduced. So inflation causes deflation of the value of the dollar.

I realize that in whacked out tea party la la land you guys call increasing the money supply "inflation", but that's just inflation of the money supply, it's not the same thing that we generally refer to as inflation, and it's not the same thing as inflating the value of the dollar (your words) because if we inflated the value of the dollar, then prices would be lower, and that would be called deflation.
 
Libertie76 said:
You have no idea what inflation and deflation is do you
Click to expand...

Well I would to say that both of you are incorrect as inflation and deflation refer to price levels. The words you want are appreciate and depreciate. A depreciating currency causes inflation (in a classical sense).
 
imagep said:
Sorry, but I don't accept the backwards tea party definition. I accept the widely accepted definitions.

When we have inflation, prices in general rise, and the purchasing power of the dollar is reduced. So inflation causes deflation of the value of the dollar.
Click to expand...

It is a depreciation in the value of the dollar, not a deflation.
 
Carjosse said:
Well I would to say that both of you are incorrect as inflation and deflation refer to price levels. The words you want are appreciate and depreciate. A depreciating currency causes inflation (in a classical sense).
Click to expand...

Thanks, those terms make more sense.
 
Carjosse said:
My Intro to Macroeconomics course was rather useful in helping understanding the jargon of the economics world.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, these tea party types didn't take econ in college, they just "learned" about economics at the barber shop and on facebook. Of course most of that is disinformation.
 
imagep said:
you said "If the value of the dollar inflates to a level" If the value of the dollar inflates, that means that it becomes more valuable, and thus we would have deflation. I don't think that's what you intended to imply


Sure, and they are backed by everything that I can buy with them. When was the last time that I couldn't purchase something or pay a bill with US dollars? Hell, if I want to, I can even exchange my dollars for GOLD.



No qualified economist would ever consider that to be hyperinflation. But to any extent that you think it's hyperinflation, they why hasn't our economy already collapsed, seeing how we have been having hyperinflation for 40 years.

Our government has been involved in our economy as long as we have had a government, but yes.



No, when we have inflation, the value of the dollar is being deflated. Are you trying to play some sort of Tea Party opposite day game?
Click to expand...

1. Think of it like this, inflation is the inflating of the financial bubble. The more money there is the value is less, or he more air you blow into a balloon the rarity of the air molecules depreciates. Causing inflation

2. You could buy gold, but you can't use it as legal tender. They're not backed by everything you can buy with them, they're backed on the amount of money held in reserve. Or the amount the federal reserve and participating banks hold as security reserves

3.ˌhʌɪpərɪnˈfleɪʃ(ə)n/
noun
monetary inflation occurring at a very high rate. That's the definition of hyperinflation, idk any economist that would disagree with me

4. State governments controlling the production of tender is different then government monopolizing industry after industry

5. Ok you mean devalue it's a common mistake, please from now on think of my bubble analogy
 
imagep said:
Unfortunately, these tea party types didn't take econ in college, they just learned about economics at the barber shop and on facebook.
Click to expand...

I also learned the actual theories behind Classical and Keynesian economics, I can know laugh at some people's understanding and criticism of them.
 
Carjosse said:
Well I would to say that both of you are incorrect as inflation and deflation refer to price levels. The words you want are appreciate and depreciate. A depreciating currency causes inflation (in a classical sense).
Click to expand...

That's an argument amongst economists, and you mean neo-classical sense, however Austrians suggest that inflation of currency causes depreciation not the other way around
 
Carjosse said:
I also learned the actual theories behind Classical and Keynesian economics, I can know laugh at some people's understanding and criticism of them.
Click to expand...

Again you mean Austrians view of the actual praxeology of the market
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom