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Should the Report on Torture Be Released Publicly?

Should The Torture Report be Released Publicly?

  • Total voters
    90
MMC said:
Diane Feinstein and the Democrats are releasing the Torture Report this week, they are saying. They meaning the Demos, Feinstein, and the MS Media.

Foreign governments and U.S. intelligence agencies are predicting that the release of a Senate report examining the use of torture by the CIA will cause "violence and deaths" abroad. BO is backing the release of this report. Since he came out and stated we tortured some folks. Then other countries Intel services stated this will cause more violence and death to take place. This was all reported back to BO. Yet he and the Democrats are all for it.

The Republicans are disputing this report and will come out with their own report. Feinstein said she would go ahead with the release. Even after Kerry asked her to hold off with the timing.

What say ye?
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I say the democrats are lashing out over getting their asses handed to them in the midterms. And Obama hopes it will distract from the heat over obamacare and illegal immigration.
 
Navy Pride said:
If releasing these reports endangers American lives then the answer is no.
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Continuing doing the same actions and sweeping it under the rug endangers more lives. It was the immoral activity instigated under Cheney/Bush that has put American lives at risk.....not releasing the report that details their actions.
 
Sabanist said:
Thugs are doing worse without our go ahead and have been for decades.

It does work as reported by the cia today.

Its only common sense. The left says "theyll say anything to make it stop"

The reality is every source of info is cross checked. You never act on a single piece of intel. If i am waterboarding you and you tell me somethin i know is a lie, you will get it worse. The question is are you willing to roll that dice? I think not
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Alright, whether it works or not, is that the only consideration? I mean, what is it you're fighting against? What's the difference between you and your enemies?
 
Northern Light said:
Terrorists are called non-state actors, which is convenient for us because we get to invade the entire world without ever declaring war in order to get to these "terrorists".

What we are supposed to do with them? I don't know... I guess just create prisons all over the place in grey zones to dump them in indefinitely? Seems to be the status quo these days.

It doesn't matter if their own countries want them or not. They are citizens of somewhere, and somewhere should deal with them. But that's not the reason why we're detaining them. We deport other people's problem all the time, it's also our status quo. We're holding them because they know our dirty little secrets.

All this legal minutiae is pointless. We should not be torturing anyone. It's against our stated principles as a country. The least we could do is hide it better. Our government has zero shame anymore... it all just hangs out.
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OK. Non-state actors then. A label really doesn't change the underlying situation at all, really.

How exactly are we supposed to make foreign sovereign countries from where they came from, of whom they are, or at least were at one time, citizens, take them back when they don't want to take them, for fear of instability that they may bring along with them? How can it not matter if these countries want them, are willing to accept them, or not?

If we just turn them lose, as we have others of the same ilk, it's been shown that a rather high percentage of them go back to the fight and continue shooting and bombing innocent civilians and law abiding military personnel of various nations. How is that a rational and responsible course of action to take?

True, as a matter of course the US should not be torturing or performing enhanced interrogation on anyone. If lives are at stake? If the protection of the nation is at stake? Extreme circumstances such as these? I'm willing to take equally extraordinary counter measures. But certainly not a as a matter of course.

When met with a force such as this, does it not behoove us to apply an equal but opposite force?
 
eohrnberger said:
OK, so let's say they are POWs then.
Their next stop after being captured would be a POW camp.
So that'd be Gitmo.
POWs are detained until the war is over, right?
Well, the war on terrorism is still on.
So . . . . the POWs stay in the POW camp then?
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Prisoner exchanges often happen before the conflict is over. Terrorism is a method not an identifiable enemy. The war is over when the USA installs their approved government.
 
Hard Truth said:
Prisoner exchanges often happen before the conflict is over.
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True.
Hard Truth said:
Terrorism is a method not an identifiable enemy.
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Terrorism is a method, true. One who engages in that method is a terrorist.
Hard Truth said:
The war is over when the USA installs their approved government.
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Given the challenges that the US administrations have had with both the Karzai and the al-Maliki government, if these are really the US installed government, I think the US should have chosen more wisely.

Suffice it to say that in both cases it was done by vote, and not installed by the US.
 
disneydude said:
Continuing doing the same actions and sweeping it under the rug endangers more lives. It was the immoral activity instigated under Cheney/Bush that has put American lives at risk.....not releasing the report that details their actions.
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Then why did BO Peep say that Americans in certain countries would have more of risk. Why did they say they were concerned about that?

You weren't going to try and deny that this report would raise the risk of harm on Americans, were you?

Do you even know anything about warfare?
 
disneydude said:
Continuing doing the same actions and sweeping it under the rug endangers more lives. It was the immoral activity instigated under Cheney/Bush that has put American lives at risk.....not releasing the report that details their actions.
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If it was so " immoral " why didn't the Democrats in the House intelligence committee do something about it when they were thoroughly briefed by the CIA ?

Pelosi and Company were well aware that these enhanced interrogation techniques were being used .

What did they do to put a stop to them ?
 
Fenton said:
If it was so " immoral " why didn't the Democrats in the House intelligence committee do something about it when they were thoroughly briefed by the CIA ?

Pelosi and Company were well aware that these enhanced interrogation techniques were being used .

What did they do to put a stop to them ?
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Any Democrats or Republicans complicit in torture policies should be thrown out like the anti-American bums they are.
 
Amadeus said:
Any Democrats or Republicans complicit in torture policies should be thrown out like the anti-American bums they are.
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I agree.

If some of the people in the G.W. Bush mis-administration hadn't descended into barbarity as part of their response to 9/11 we wouldn't be having this conversation. :roll:

When any country (Including the USA.) violates international agreements that it has signed and tortures people it has crossed a red line.

And it shouldn't be surprised when other nations condemn its actions.
 
shrubnose said:
I agree.

If some of the people in the G.W. Bush mis-administration hadn't descended into barbarity as part of their response to 9/11 we wouldn't be having this conversation. :roll:

When any country (Including the USA.) violates international agreements that it has signed and tortures people it has crossed a red line.

And it shouldn't be surprised when other nations condemn its actions.
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When other Nations can prove they don't do the same thing.....then they can talk. Until then, the best thing they can do.....is shut their pie holes. Both ends of them.
 
ObamacareFail said:
I say the democrats are lashing out over getting their asses handed to them in the midterms. And Obama hopes it will distract from the heat over obamacare and illegal immigration.
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Well, that's exactly what they are doing. What people on the Right should do.....is swamp the MS Media, and I do mean swamp them with calls telling them to be accurate in their reporting or suffer the consequences.

This is not a Senate Committee Report......It is the One Sided Democrat Report. So that's what it should be reported as. The one sided Senate Intel Report from the Democrats.

The report by the Democrats. The Demos investigation. Reported as, this is how the Demos do things. Their usual.

Also we now have been shown by the Left they would do whatever it takes to cause harm to the country, when they have lost power and now have to take the backseat. That they would rather have Americans face more Risks of Harm and Danger all due to their politics from their party.

Lets not forget that point when showing the MS Media where they actually are on the food chain.
 
MMC said:
When other Nations can prove they don't do the same thing.....then they can talk. Until then, the best thing they can do.....is shut their pie holes. Both ends of them.
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Then America needs to STFU about being morally superior, being exceptional, or being the 'shining city on a hill'.
 
eohrnberger said:
True.

Terrorism is a method, true. One who engages in that method is a terrorist.

Given the challenges that the US administrations have had with both the Karzai and the al-Maliki government, if these are really the US installed government, I think the US should have chosen more wisely.

Suffice it to say that in both cases it was done by vote, and not installed by the US.
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IIRC, Bush had a timeline in which the Iraqis had to follow.
 
Amadeus said:
Then America needs to STFU about being morally superior, being exceptional, or being the 'shining city on a hill'.
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The US doesn't run around talking about being morally Superior.....except when the left has power. Maybe you should tell ALL those in your Party. Never to discuss morals and values. Especially since most the left has a problem with ethics while not having any Real Heart.

Yes, that would be the majority of the left. Weakness defined!!!!!
 
MMC said:
The US doesn't run around talking about being morally Superior.....except when the left has power. Maybe you should tell ALL those in your Party. Never to discuss morals and values. Especially since most the left has a problem with ethics while not having any Real Heart.
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I'm not a Democrat, or even an American, and I'll put my morals and values up against yours any day. I don't need 2000 year old book to tell me the difference between right and wrong, and I don't need Dick Cheney to tell me what constitutes torture.
 
Amadeus said:
I'm not a Democrat, or even an American, and I'll put my morals and values up against yours any day. I don't need 2000 year old book to tell me the difference between right and wrong, and I don't need Dick Cheney to tell me what constitutes torture.
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That's why you would lose.

But you did need a one sided Democrat Report to start feeling all spiffy like, huh?
 
MMC said:
But you did need a one sided Democrat Report to start feeling all spiffy like, huh?
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I haven't commented on the report, only the known use of torture authorized by the Bush Administration. You defend that, you lose the 'morals and values' argument.
 
Amadeus said:
I haven't commented on the report, only the known use of torture authorized by the Bush Administration. You defend that, you lose the 'morals and values' argument.
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Seems none of you had much to say when Bush stopped most of the Harsh tactics that were being used Under the Clinton Administration.

Now how did that BS happen?

What you can't figure out what a party's political playing looks like?
 
MMC said:
Seems none of you had much to say when Bush stopped most of the Harsh tactics that were being used Under the Clinton Administration.
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Do you ever get tired of blaming Clinton for Bush's use of torture, or Bush's decision to invade Iraq? Have some accountability. Stand up for your principles, such as they are.

Besides which, I have never defended Clinton or his administration. So you hitting the 'Clinton Did It!' button whenever you're being pressed doesn't work on me.
 
Amadeus said:
Do you ever get tired of blaming Clinton for Bush's use of torture, or Bush's decision to invade Iraq? Have some accountability. Stand up for your principles, such as they are.

Besides which, I have never defended Clinton or his administration. So you hitting the 'Clinton Did It!' button whenever you're being pressed doesn't work on me.
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No, I never get tired of using a reality check to bring out facts that leftists ignore.

Oh and if this is what you calling pressing. You will need to up that Leftist game of yours. Just sayin!

Has that part about another Report coming from the Same Intel Committee helped to put the Democrat Report into its perspective?
 
MMC said:
No, I never get tired of using a reality check to bring out facts that leftists ignore.
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The fact is that Bush invaded Iraq and Clinton didn't. The neocons tried to goad Clinton into invading Iraq, but he was at least smarter than Bush, whose administration was completely co-opted by neocons (such that nearly 20 PNAC signatories had key positions).

Oh and if this is what you calling pressing. You will need to up that Leftist game of yours. Just sayin!
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I guess you can't press someone without any morals, ethics, or sense of responsibility for their own ideology.
 
MMC said:
Diane Feinstein and the Democrats are releasing the Torture Report this week
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Your poll results show by a more than 2-to-1 vote that the report should have been released.
Let this be the beginning of the DEM reawakening on how to fight the GOP messaging war .
 
eohrnberger said:
OK. Non-state actors then. A label really doesn't change the underlying situation at all, really.

How exactly are we supposed to make foreign sovereign countries from where they came from, of whom they are, or at least were at one time, citizens, take them back when they don't want to take them, for fear of instability that they may bring along with them? How can it not matter if these countries want them, are willing to accept them, or not?

If we just turn them lose, as we have others of the same ilk, it's been shown that a rather high percentage of them go back to the fight and continue shooting and bombing innocent civilians and law abiding military personnel of various nations. How is that a rational and responsible course of action to take?

True, as a matter of course the US should not be torturing or performing enhanced interrogation on anyone. If lives are at stake? If the protection of the nation is at stake? Extreme circumstances such as these? I'm willing to take equally extraordinary counter measures. But certainly not a as a matter of course.

When met with a force such as this, does it not behoove us to apply an equal but opposite force?
Click to expand...

I know that we're in an ends justifies the means situation now, where we have to follow through with our corrupt and ridiculous plans that were already initiated. That's kind of how the government gets way with continuing to do the same old crap. "Well, we started it, now we might as well finish it." But the argument for non-state actors works both ways. We can't invade every country on earth to suss out anyone who opposes us, and terrorism is never ending. ISIS has shown us that even after our protracted theater in the Middle East, our enemies can still rebound and pose a serious threat to us. Yes perhaps Obama withdrew the troops to early, but really, the Middle East has a history of resiliency against its enemies. No war will be lengthy enough to really quell the cultural dissent, and the amount of damage we have done to their civilizations will ensure that they hate us for the foreseeable future. This is a battle that we CANNOT win, and I'm not saying that because I'm anti-war, but because I'm a pragmatist. We are bankrupting our nation trying to take water out of the ocean.

The point I'm trying to make is that there is the letter of the law, and then there is the spirit of the law. It's not like the tortures are in the spirit of the law, even though we can defend it using the precise wording of the treaty system.The human touch in our system of governance is lost when everything gets boiled down to pure semantics. But I guess that's what happens when government is made up of mostly lawyers and business people.
 
Amadeus said:
The fact is that Bush invaded Iraq and Clinton didn't. The neocons tried to goad Clinton into invading Iraq, but he was at least smarter than Bush, whose administration was completely co-opted by neocons (such that nearly 20 PNAC signatories had key positions).



I guess you can't press someone without any morals, ethics, or sense of responsibility for their own ideology.
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Now look up Fact Check. Org......so your confusion doesn't expand.

Oh were we suppose to believe that you were attempting to be moral and just......that you would know about ethics and civility and actually use it. Most of the time its Best not to preach until you can walk that walk.
 
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