View Poll Results: Is the MSM (main stream media) unbiased, reliable and trustworthy?

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  • YES!

    207 58.31%
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    56 15.77%
  • OTHER, please explain.

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Thread: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

  1. #1
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    War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    http://www.informationclearinghouse....ticle40389.htm
    War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda
    By John Pilger
    "Why are young journalists not taught to understand media agendas and to challenge the high claims and low purpose of fake objectivity? And why are they not taught that the essence of so much of what's called the mainstream media is not information, but power? These are urgent questions. The world is facing the prospect of major war, perhaps nuclear war - with the United States clearly determined to isolate and provoke Russia and eventually China. This truth is being turned upside down and inside out by journalists, including those who promoted the lies that led to the bloodbath in Iraq in 2003. The times we live in are so dangerous and so distorted in public perception that propaganda is no longer, as Edward Bernays called it, an "invisible government". It is the government. It rules directly without fear of contradiction and its principal aim is the conquest of us: our sense of the world, our ability to separate truth from lies."..snip "In 2003, I filmed an interview in Washington with Charles Lewis, the distinguished American investigative journalist. We discussed the invasion of Iraq a few months earlier. I asked him, "What if the freest media in the world had seriously challenged George Bush and Donald Rumsfeld and investigated their claims, instead of channeling what turned out to be crude propaganda?" He replied that if we journalists had done our job "there is a very, very good chance we would have not gone to war in Iraq." That's a shocking statement, and one supported by other famous journalists to whom I put the same question. Dan Rather, formerly of CBS, gave me the same answer. David Rose of the Observer and senior journalists and producers in the BBC, who wished to remain anonymous, gave me the same answer. In other words, had journalists done their job, had they questioned and investigated the propaganda instead of amplifying it, hundreds of thousands of men, women and children might be alive today; and millions might not have fled their homes; the sectarian war between Sunni and Shia might not have ignited, and the infamous Islamic State might not now exist. Even now, despite the millions who took to the streets in protest, most of the public in western countries have little idea of the sheer scale of the crime committed by our governments in Iraq. Even fewer are aware that, in the 12 years before the invasion, the US and British governments set in motion a holocaust by denying the civilian population of Iraq a means to live."...
    snip"
    Rupert Murdoch is said to be the godfather of the media mob, and no one should doubt the augmented power of his newspapers - all 127 of them, with a combined circulation of 40 million, and his Fox network. But the influence of Murdoch's empire is no greater than its reflection of the wider media. The most effective propaganda is found not in the Sun or on Fox News - but beneath a liberal halo. When the New York Times published claims that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, its fake evidence was believed, because it wasn't Fox News; it was the New York Times. The same is true of the Washington Post and the Guardian, both of which have played a critical role in conditioning their readers to accept a new and dangerous cold war. All three liberal newspapers have misrepresented events in Ukraine as a malign act by Russia - when, in fact, the fascist led coup in Ukraine was the work of the United States, aided by Germany and Nato. This inversion of reality is so pervasive that Washington's military encirclement and intimidation of Russia is not contentious. It's not even news, but suppressed behind a smear and scare campaign of the kind I grew up with during the first cold war."
    http://www.informationclearinghouse....ticle40389.htm

    Does this ring true?

    Is our Main Stream Media distorted?

    Is our MSM bought and sold?

    Is our MSM infiltrated by intelligence agencies?

    Do independent reports investigate or do they accept gov't media handouts?

    Does MSM seem "agenda oriented?"

    Poll Question
    Is the MSM (main stream media) unbiased, reliable and trustworthy?
    Last edited by DaveFagan; 12-07-14 at 10:08 AM.

  2. #2
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    ** War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda** :* Information Clearing House - ICH
    War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda
    By John Pilger
    "Why are young journalists not taught to understand media agendas and to challenge the high claims and low purpose of fake objectivity? And why are they not taught that the essence of so much of what's called the mainstream media is not information, but power? These are urgent questions. The world is facing the prospect of major war, perhaps nuclear war - with the United States clearly determined to isolate and provoke Russia and eventually China. This truth is being turned upside down and inside out by journalists, including those who promoted the lies that led to the bloodbath in Iraq in 2003. The times we live in are so dangerous and so distorted in public perception that propaganda is no longer, as Edward Bernays called it, an "invisible government". It is the government. It rules directly without fear of contradiction and its principal aim is the conquest of us: our sense of the world, our ability to separate truth from lies."..snip "In 2003, I filmed an interview in Washington with Charles Lewis, the distinguished American investigative journalist. We discussed the invasion of Iraq a few months earlier. I asked him, "What if the freest media in the world had seriously challenged George Bush and Donald Rumsfeld and investigated their claims, instead of channeling what turned out to be crude propaganda?" He replied that if we journalists had done our job "there is a very, very good chance we would have not gone to war in Iraq." That's a shocking statement, and one supported by other famous journalists to whom I put the same question. Dan Rather, formerly of CBS, gave me the same answer. David Rose of the Observer and senior journalists and producers in the BBC, who wished to remain anonymous, gave me the same answer. In other words, had journalists done their job, had they questioned and investigated the propaganda instead of amplifying it, hundreds of thousands of men, women and children might be alive today; and millions might not have fled their homes; the sectarian war between Sunni and Shia might not have ignited, and the infamous Islamic State might not now exist. Even now, despite the millions who took to the streets in protest, most of the public in western countries have little idea of the sheer scale of the crime committed by our governments in Iraq. Even fewer are aware that, in the 12 years before the invasion, the US and British governments set in motion a holocaust by denying the civilian population of Iraq a means to live."...
    snip"
    Rupert Murdoch is said to be the godfather of the media mob, and no one should doubt the augmented power of his newspapers - all 127 of them, with a combined circulation of 40 million, and his Fox network. But the influence of Murdoch's empire is no greater than its reflection of the wider media. The most effective propaganda is found not in the Sun or on Fox News - but beneath a liberal halo. When the New York Times published claims that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, its fake evidence was believed, because it wasn't Fox News; it was the New York Times. The same is true of the Washington Post and the Guardian, both of which have played a critical role in conditioning their readers to accept a new and dangerous cold war. All three liberal newspapers have misrepresented events in Ukraine as a malign act by Russia - when, in fact, the fascist led coup in Ukraine was the work of the United States, aided by Germany and Nato. This inversion of reality is so pervasive that Washington's military encirclement and intimidation of Russia is not contentious. It's not even news, but suppressed behind a smear and scare campaign of the kind I grew up with during the first cold war."
    ** War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda** :* Information Clearing House - ICH

    Does this ring true?

    Is our Main Stream Media distorted?

    Is our MSM bought and sold?

    Is our MSM infiltrated by intelligence agencies?

    Do independent reports investigate or do they accept gov't media handouts?

    Does MSM seem "agenda oriented?"

    Poll Question
    Is the MSM (main stream media) unbiased, reliable and trustworthy?
    No offense, but any time I see such a loaded question for a title, I'm inclined to always roll my eyes and just pick other. Is our media perfect? No, but neither is anyone else's. However, if you shop around, which most do anyways, you are able to get a more complete picture. Do news outlet's today have some biases, sure, but part of that is necessary. There's a lot of news that happens, especially in today's digital age. And one station isn't going to be able to cover them all.

  3. #3
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    I don't automatically believe any of them, as virtually all of them appear to have bias.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

  4. #4
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    I don't automatically believe any of them, as virtually all of them appear to have bias.
    Skepticism is always a healthy approach when it comes to news, especially in today's age. Hell, look at all the trouble Rolling Stones magazine is in when the supposed rape story blew up in their face, especially when they found out that pledges don't even happened in the fall.

  5. #5
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Does this ring true?
    Yes, but with a serious fault. There has never been a time where media was completely independent of political lean, it's ownership having political lean, or otherwise.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Is our Main Stream Media distorted?
    Of course it is, always has been.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Is our MSM bought and sold?
    Yes, and it has to be that way else you get government ran media. Which is far worse in both the propaganda and control departments. Shuffle on over to North Korea if you are not buying what I am saying.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Is our MSM infiltrated by intelligence agencies?
    Doubt it. They do not need to.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Do independent reports investigate or do they accept gov't media handouts?
    Depends on who is doing the investigating. I.E. what the lean of the "independent" reports was vs. the lean of the reporter questioning the results. At the end of the day there is no such thing as independent reporting, we all have leans to deal with. It may be mild, but it is there in some respect. Just a fact of life, no one can be completely robotic in reporting what they see.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Does MSM seem "agenda oriented?"
    Of course, again... always has been and always will be.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    Is the MSM (main stream media) unbiased, reliable and trustworthy?
    Voted "Other."

    It comes down to a basic understanding of the media. Since they are all biased in some regard the smart money suggests reading as many sources as you can obtain (agree with and not agree with) on a matter then making an informed opinion based on it all. Where we go wrong is only listening to / watching / reading what we agree with and dismissing all others as monumentally wrong because of their lean. The former is a product of wanting as much information as possible and leads to reasoned discussion, the latter is intellectual laziness regurgitating what one was told by someone else.
    "Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people." - Penn Jillette.

  6. #6
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    It comes down to a basic understanding of the media. Since they are all biased in some regard the smart money suggests reading as many sources as you can obtain (agree with and not agree with) on a matter then making an informed opinion based on it all. Where we go wrong is only listening to / watching / reading what we agree with and dismissing all others as monumentally wrong because of their lean. The former is a product of wanting as much information as possible and leads to reasoned discussion, the latter is intellectual laziness regurgitating what one was told by someone else.
    In general, I don't believe news outlets lie so much, as they don't tell the whole story most of the time.

  7. #7
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    In general, I don't believe news outlets lie so much, as they don't tell the whole story most of the time.
    That is a very fine line there when considering major events we see the media report on, I may even go so far as to say in some cases on major news stories omission is lying.
    "Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people." - Penn Jillette.

  8. #8
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    That is a very fine line there when considering major events we see the media report on, I may even go so far as to say in some cases on major news stories omission is lying.
    Their not lying, just not providing the proper context. There certainly doing a disservice to their viewers, but they're still not lying. It's very similar to how politicians speak. Like when Obama talks about how far deficits have dropped during his administration, like "largest deficit reduction since the second world war" is something that floats around. What he neglects to point out is how it has skyrocketed under his administrations to levels never before seen.

    Context matters.

  9. #9
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    Yes, but with a serious fault. There has never been a time where media was completely independent of political lean, it's ownership having political lean, or otherwise.



    Of course it is, always has been.



    Yes, and it has to be that way else you get government ran media. Which is far worse in both the propaganda and control departments. Shuffle on over to North Korea if you are not buying what I am saying.



    Doubt it. They do not need to.



    Depends on who is doing the investigating. I.E. what the lean of the "independent" reports was vs. the lean of the reporter questioning the results. At the end of the day there is no such thing as independent reporting, we all have leans to deal with. It may be mild, but it is there in some respect. Just a fact of life, no one can be completely robotic in reporting what they see.



    Of course, again... always has been and always will be.



    Voted "Other."

    It comes down to a basic understanding of the media. Since they are all biased in some regard the smart money suggests reading as many sources as you can obtain (agree with and not agree with) on a matter then making an informed opinion based on it all. Where we go wrong is only listening to / watching / reading what we agree with and dismissing all others as monumentally wrong because of their lean. The former is a product of wanting as much information as possible and leads to reasoned discussion, the latter is intellectual laziness regurgitating what one was told by someone else.

    refers to link made red by me
    The Church Committee found 400 CIA assets/agents in US media in 1977. The CIA has grown remarkedly since then , ergo so has infiltration in MEDIA. 400 agents concentrated in one industry suggests a covert plan to influence that industry.

  10. #10
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    Re: War by Media and the Triumph of Propaganda

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamster Buddha View Post
    Skepticism is always a healthy approach when it comes to news, especially in today's age. Hell, look at all the trouble Rolling Stones magazine is in when the supposed rape story blew up in their face, especially when they found out that pledges don't even happened in the fall.
    And I actually used to like Rolling Stone mag. They ran a short series of articles about the financial crisis, back around the time that it became so apparent, and I thought they did a pretty good job, but this most recent scandal has pretty much destroyed any respect I had for them. When you start trying to create the news, as you wish it to be, rather than reporting stories in their reality, you've lost all credibility with me.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

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