View Poll Results: Is America the greatest country on earth?

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  • Yes

    54 26.87%
  • No

    147 73.13%
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Thread: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

  1. #261
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Just Curious, what would be so impressive about putting a Man on the Moon in 2014 ? With all of our technological advances ?

    What's impressive about the Moon Missions is that they were done over 40 years ago with the technology of that time.

    And I wouldn't bet on other Countries successfully landing anything on the Moon either.

    They couldn't land that Space probe on that Comet successfully.

    And they had the advantage of modern Technology.
    And the beginning of the space race we had untold rockets blowing up and astronauts dying... so what? It takes time...
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  2. #262
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Never understood the French being sissies thing...

    They fought hard in Vietnam and lost, just like we did.

    They fought hard in WWI just like everybody else.

    They got an ass whooping in WWII just like everybody else did in the beginning and the only difference between them and Russia was real estate and Britain had the Channel. Without the Channel or the real estate those guys were dead too, as was Denmark, Belgium, Norway, Poland and a handful of other nations.

    They fought hard in the French and Indian Wars and decided to retire instead...

    They helped us to win in the Revolutionary War. That was nice of them....
    i think it has more to do with american chauvinism than anything
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  3. #263
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Just Curious, what would be so impressive about putting a Man on the Moon in 2014 ? With all of our technological advances ?

    What's impressive about the Moon Missions is that they were done over 40 years ago with the technology of that time.

    And I wouldn't bet on other Countries successfully landing anything on the Moon either.

    They couldn't land that Space probe on that Comet successfully.

    And they had the advantage of modern Technology.
    You're comparing landing on the moon to landing on a comet? They did pretty well with the whole comet thing.

    The comet was 310 million miles away from the Earth, moving at a speeds up to 135,000 kilometers per hour.
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  4. #264
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    You're comparing landing on the moon to landing on a comet? They did pretty well with the whole comet thing.

    The comet was 310 million miles away from the Earth, moving at a speeds up to 135,000 kilometers per hour.
    Hey, he was comparing landing on the Moon 45 years ago to landing on the Moon today.

    As if a Moon landing today would be a comparable achievement.

    And honestly the Comet was cool but it was still a unmanned probe with no danger to human life if it failed.

    Knowing that a Comet was going to be in an exact position at a predetermined time just meant they had to do a little Math

  5. #265
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Just Curious, what would be so impressive about putting a Man on the Moon in 2014 ? With all of our technological advances ?

    What's impressive about the Moon Missions is that they were done over 40 years ago with the technology of that time.

    And I wouldn't bet on other Countries successfully landing anything on the Moon either.

    They couldn't land that Space probe on that Comet successfully.

    And they had the advantage of modern Technology.
    That was my point. Once we did it no one else had the reason to. Certain country's certainly could today.

    I bet China could land a probe on a comet if they wanted to... Possibly Russia to but I'm less confident in them...

  6. #266
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by instagramsci View Post
    i think it has more to do with american chauvinism than anything
    ...and the fact that they LOVE Jerry Lewis.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by OldFatGuy View Post
    Usually a gag for wise mouthed insulting little girls. Then some good nylon rope so I can tie them up, toss them in the trunk of my car and forget about them.

  7. #267
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    This is seen as nearly axiomatic in some circles. In others, it's seen as misguided arrogance.

    I want to know whether the maxim rings true with you, and your reasoning.


    Focus specifically on these areas, if at all possible...... 1.) Freedom 2.) Diversity 3.) Opportunity
    It used to be.

    Now it may as well join the EU.

    That's what happens when ignorance is rampant. The country gets Gruberized and socialized... and since all socialist schemes die a bitter death, our demise is just around the corner.

    18TRILLION of debt, 60TRILLION of unfunded liabilities, open borders, 92 million unemployed... baby boomers retiring everyday and will for the next 14-years, people living longer... a welfare system called ObamaKare... this pyramid scheme is going to come down one day... and...

    ... if we lose status as the world's preferred currency for trade (the Chicoms and Russians are pushing it)... then we're really farked... really fast.

    America was once the land of the free, now we're like the morally bankrupt and financially bankrupt EU.

    Way to go Demokrats... it's almost all due to your socialist schemes... your idiocy.
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  8. #268
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Good, carefully thought out and civilly worded post - so let's try to do it justice.

    Quote Originally Posted by braindrain View Post
    To think that US auto makers could not build a car just as good as anything from Europe is just silly...
    Let's be accurate here. I have not claimed that a nation capable of the US's scientific and engineering achievements is incapable of building a car to equal Europe's best. I have stated (and I consider with good reason,) that US automobile manufacturers choose not to for reasons best known to them. And I agree that there is no arcane knowledge required to build a good car, but many years of experience (particularly international competition experience,) certainly does 'improve the breed'.

    Let's be honest, there is no American equivalent of a Bugatti Veyron or a Bentley Continental. Granted, they are expensive, but there is no US automotive product that incorporates that level of engineering and quality.

    Quote Originally Posted by braindrain View Post
    And it is funny that you talk about how the US auto makers eschew the world-wide market, That is funny because the best selling car in the world is a Ford...
    Actually, I was deriding the concept that US manufacturers eschew the world-wide market - it is my contention that every manufacturer would love to have impressive world-wide sales. I was pointing out that despite their best efforts, sales of US designed, engineered, and manufactured cars are minimal outside the USA.

    I also pointed out that both Ford and GM enjoy considerable sales of European designed and manufactured vehicles bearing their names, but bearing no relationship to their US counterparts. The 10 top selling cars across the world do not include one American designed and manufactured car - the number one seller, the Ford Focus was designed in Essex and Cologne under the guidance of Englishman Richard Parry-Jones.

    Quote Originally Posted by braindrain View Post
    And than you talk those cars higher quality and reliability as if that has anything to do with why more wealthy folks buy BMWs or MB. . Quality has almost nothing to do with it. If it did Buick which is rated as 6 should be more coveted than BMW or MB.
    Only by US Consumer reports. Both Benz and BMW have enviable reliability records in Europe and elsewhere - it is part of the reason so many police forces (including the British) use BMW patrol cars. My family has run Bentleys and BMWs for as long as I can remember, and I do not recall any reliability problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by braindrain View Post
    You are right that the status does not just come from price. Things like exclusivity, as well as just perceived branding have a ton to due with. A perfect example of this is the Corvette ZR1. It can pretty much dominate any other sports car outside of a very few super priced exotics. It also is known for much better reliability than your Ferrari's or Lambos that cost 100000 or so more...

    One these are sports cars and two the Ferrari is over 1 hundred thousand dollars more expensive. It is all about exclusivity and perception. It is about image.
    Valid points, except that the Corvette ZR1, whilst undeniably fast and a good track car, got terrible reviews in respect of ride, finish, and build quality from European testers. Admittedly exotics like Lamborghini and Ferrari are very expensive anywhere in the world (you gets what you pays for) but you must remember that US prices of European cars are much inflated due to a number of factors. Most Benzes and BMWs are very reasonably priced in Germany and in many parts of Europe, and as such, represent excellent value for money. By no means is image the major motivation for buying them (they are far too common on our roads to have any 'image').

    Quote Originally Posted by braindrain View Post
    Look I am not saying that US auto makers make the best cars in the world. I am just saying that your idea that because wealthy folks buy BMWs or MB has anything to do with quality is just silly.
    I understand the overall point you are making, but to hold that someone who expends a lot of money on a machine, does so with no regard for quality is equally silly. Of course exclusivity may be seen by some as desirable, but were that the case, the garages of the European wealthy would be stuffed full of Cadillacs and US Fords - they simply aren't.

    However, I understand the fact that the US is a huge market, and that American car makers tailor their product to the domestic market. This happens in many other markets.
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  9. #269
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Hey, he was comparing landing on the Moon 45 years ago to landing on the Moon today.

    As if a Moon landing today would be a comparable achievement.

    And honestly the Comet was cool but it was still a unmanned probe with no danger to human life if it failed.

    Knowing that a Comet was going to be in an exact position at a predetermined time just meant they had to do a little Math
    You're an insane person if you think landing on a comet moving 135,000 kilometers per hour while at 310 million miles away requires just "doing a little math".

    Agreed that the moon landing in '69 was crazy as well, but I don't think you want to short sell this achievement.
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  10. #270
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    Re: Is America the greatest nation on earth?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leo View Post
    Good, carefully thought out and civilly worded post - so let's try to do it justice.



    Let's be accurate here. I have not claimed that a nation capable of the US's scientific and engineering achievements is incapable of building a car to equal Europe's best. I have stated (and I consider with good reason,) that US automobile manufacturers choose not to for reasons best known to them. And I agree that there is no arcane knowledge required to build a good car, but many years of experience (particularly international competition experience,) certainly does 'improve the breed'.

    Let's be honest, there is no American equivalent of a Bugatti Veyron or a Bentley Continental. Granted, they are expensive, but there is no US automotive product that incorporates that level of engineering and quality.

    However, I understand the fact that the US is a huge market, and that American car makers tailor their product to the domestic market. This happens in many other markets.
    Sorry had to delete some of your post to fit all mine in.

    I think any unbiased person who read your last post about this would very much believe that you were implying that the US automakers can not build a car as good as Europeans. But if that is not what you meant than so be it.
    The reason that US car companies have someone outside of the US design the cars for those markets is simply good economics and business. It would make zero sense for them to have one of their local, IE US, designers work on those projects it is simply that the vast majority of their efforts are towards the US market. It is far easier and more cost effective to have the people in the markets you are trying to sell in design your product. And as to where they are built that is simply economics. It is far cheaper to have them built outside of the states. US buyers far and wide are not interested in many of the same designs that are common else where. That simple fact has more to do with why US designed cars are not that popular outside of the US.

    While I am glad that your family has had good luck with them that means little in the grand scheme of things. Consumer reports basses their reports off of a much larger sample than one family. I will take their word over your experience. And to add to that before I joined the Army I went to school and than worked as a mechanic for about 6 years. In my experience European cars have just as many problems as US cars but when something on a European car brakes or simply needs maintenance it is much much more expensive to fix. That in my opinion is where the Asian cars really shine. They are somewhat more reliable but also generally the cheapest to fix.

    As to the ZR1 several things about that. First things like ride and impression of build quality is very very subjective. For instance some folks like a very nice supple ride others prefer a more firm precise ride. The same goes with build quality. Out side of major visible errors, which is not what they are talking about, no one can really tell build quality by looking. People go off of feelings. I have heard magazine editors talk about poor build quality by the way a door sounds when you close it. That is ridicules. The design and components used to design the door change the way it sounds. My 69 GTO sounds like a solid perfectly built car when you shut the door. Every single car built today has more quality than that thing. LOL The bias that magazine or TV writers bring to comparisons like that play very heavily on what they pick as far as whats better
    As to finish I agree that the cars that can compete with the ZR1 have better finish and use better materials on the inside. Well they dam well should. Most of them cost over twice the price. You can not build a car that has the performance of a super car and have a have a Bently quaility interior and charge what they want for a Vette. The question is is having a nicer interior worth 100000 extra dollars. I would want to know why a car that costs half as much as mine just destroyed me on the track.

    I never once said that those who buy cars such as BMWs or MBs do so with zero regard for quality. It does play a part just like perceived quality which is often not actual quality. But status and exclusivity play at least as big a part if not more with many of those targeted consumers. If quality was the deciding factor than they would be buying Toyotas or Hondas or even Buicks over BMWs and MB but those are not even people in the same market. There are many wealthy customers out there who would not buy an American made car no matter what because it simply does not carry the same prestige that pulling up in a M5 does.
    President Franklin Roosevelt eulogized a fallen American Soldier by saying, “He stands in the unbroken line of patriots who have dared to die [that] freedom might live, and grow, and increase its blessings. Freedom lives, and through it he lives--in a way that humbles the undertakings of most men."

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