View Poll Results: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

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  • Yes for violent and or lethal force if the non-violent suspect is not cooperating.

    2 4.76%
  • Yes for violent force if the non-violent suspect is not cooperating.

    5 11.90%
  • No regardless if the non-violent suspect is or isn't cooperating.

    29 69.05%
  • Other

    4 9.52%
  • Maybe/I do not know.

    2 4.76%
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Thread: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

  1. #51
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by twixie1 View Post
    Clever man!!..
    I've practiced the fine art of not pissing off cops or game wardens for much of my life. It keeps one out of lots of unnecessary trouble.
    "Have the courage to have your wisdom regarded as stupidity. Be fools for Christ. And have the courage to suffer the contempt of the sophisticated world." - Antonin Scalia

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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    I've practiced the fine art of not pissing off cops or game wardens for much of my life. It keeps one out of lots of unnecessary trouble.
    I am going to have to ask..(I'm a woman!)..

    Why game wardens..do you hunt?

  3. #53
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by What if...? View Post
    A LOT of this starts when the cop first opens his mouth nowadays. The bullyboy demeanor. Especially if the "suspect" in question didn't do anything or anything serious. Because that demeanor is taught is some forces. They are trained to dominate at all times. And most people don't like to be treated that way.

    It you atent allowed to not like the way cops treat you. Its "yes sir" or you're in trouble. Even if the cop is treating you like a child molester for some minor offense. Talking to you in a way THEY wouldn't tolerate.

    And its natural to "resist" when some cop starts grabbing you to handcuff you for a traffic stop or some other infraction. Pulling away. Jail is serious. Frightening. Overwhelming. They know this, or should. Bit they don't or don't care.

    I blame all this on the drug war. It caused this escalation. Made cops jobs more dangerous and the current cop culture was born out of this.

    It needs to be addressed. It sucks to have to teach male kids I know that cops are a threat to their lives. That normal adolescent defiance can lead to getting shot. But that's how it is now.
    This is not how most cops are though. You have no evidence that "they are trained to dominate at all times" in the manor you are describing. That simply isn't true. It is what you believe.

    Cops are only a major threat realistically speaking if the person is doing something wrong. Statistically, there are many more people, including your doctor, who are a bigger threat to you than police officers. Reckless driving, speeding, those such things are a much bigger threat to those young men than being shot by a cop, especially shot by a cop for doing absolutely nothing wrong or even just a minor incident.

    How many people do you think have been killed by police when the "kid", guy, person was doing absolutely nothing wrong? I guarantee that number is very low, even if you look at those killed that didn't do something involving a major crime perpetrated by the person.

    Random gun violence is far more likely to get a man killed than interactions with the police. Road rage is more likely to get a person killed than being killed due to a police officer simply not liking something you do.
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  4. #54
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by twixie1 View Post
    I am going to have to ask..(I'm a woman!)..

    Why game wardens..do you hunt?
    And fish....GW are one of the most powerful law enforcement. I play by the rules.
    "Have the courage to have your wisdom regarded as stupidity. Be fools for Christ. And have the courage to suffer the contempt of the sophisticated world." - Antonin Scalia

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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    And fish....GW are one of the most powerful law enforcement. I play by the rules.
    We have to buy a license if we are fishing for Salmon or trout..the rest is called ''coarse fishing''..pike..perch..dace..

    It's a sport..I wouldn't want to eat them..

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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    F
    Quote Originally Posted by twixie1 View Post
    We have to buy a license if we are fishing for Salmon or trout..the rest is called ''coarse fishing''..pike..perch..dace..

    It's a sport..I wouldn't want to eat them..
    We eat some but, only occasionally. I do eat every animal I hunt.
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Overwhelming evidence against which cop? The one in the Garner case? There was easily both questionable actions from the cop but also some resistance by Garner, which was what led to the confrontation. Had Garner been cooperating fully with the police, and still been taken down that way, there would have been no question about the cops being wrong. However, Garner wasn't cooperating and even said he wasn't going to in the video. That is resistance. It is exactly what I am talking about. You fight back in court, not with the cops, even if it is just passive resistance or attempts at it.
    I agree with all of that except for one thing... choke holds. They should be illegal in every case except if a police officer is fighting for their life.
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Now, as to an overenthusiastic cop just up and beating the crap out of you "for no reason".... well that would be rare but I'm not going to say Never.
    It should be so rare it comes to us as a shock. but alas it's not, and while anecdotal, there shouldn't be new videos almost every day showing an officer crossing the line, but there is.


    Like I tell my son.... if the cops are in the wrong, don't fight it on the side of the road, fight it in COURT. Be smart. Don't give them an excuse to beat your ass or kill you.

    100% right,
    You should try to remember, ideas are conveyed by researching information, vetting sources, and confirming said information. Not by regurgitating talking points given to you by your "news" station.
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Well, nobody is violent... until they are. You can't punish someone for something they might do. But by then, it might be too late.

    Tough call.
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  10. #60
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    Re: Should violent and or lethal force be allowed in detaining a non-violent suspect?

    Cop shows are hardly the best evidence, but American cops seem to be very keen to throw someone to the floor, handcuff and kneel on them before starting a conversation! That's an exaggeration, but in comparison, British cops will take all sorts of BS, evasions and insults before they (I almost said "are provoked") are forced into physical restraint. Don't get me wrong, when tye do, they go in hard and effectively, but everyone knows the line. Come at them swinging, and you're decked forthwith. They will also handcuff to the front, and might even allow a prisoner a smoke before the van arrives to take them to the cop shop. There just seems to be more latitude for angry, upset, whatever people to vent their spleen before or during their arrest. Maybe it's down to the "Policing by Consent" concept.

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