View Poll Results: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

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Thread: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

  1. #1
    Dungeon Master
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    Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    This is a spin off question about when violent "protest" is justified and the responses seem to fall along the lines of "only as a last resort". My thought was immediately whether violent "protest" ever actually made any situation better or made people more likely to sympathize with whatever the protesters are mad about or is more likely to set people against them? I think it's the latter. I do think there is a case, sometimes, for civil disobedience but that's not the same as saying that violence is justified and/or effective as a means of protest.
    Last edited by X Factor; 11-25-14 at 07:52 PM.
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    This is a spin off question about when violent "protest" is justified and the responses seem to fall along the lines of "only as a last resort". My thought was immediately whether violent "protest" ever actually made any situation better or made people more likely to sympathize with whatever the protesters are mad about or is more likely to set people against them? I think it's the latter. I do think there is a case, sometimes, for civil disobedience but that's not the same as saying that violence is justified and/or effective as a means of protest.
    Violence is not protest, nor is it "civil disobedience." The people rioting and looting just are using the Brown case as an excuse to riot and loot. They're mostly just hurting local businesses, probably mostly owned by blacks.
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    Dungeon Master
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Violence is not protest, nor is it "civil disobedience." The people rioting and looting just are using the Brown case as an excuse to riot and loot. They're mostly just hurting local businesses, probably mostly owned by blacks.
    I agree. I think that's what kind of struck me about that other thread, this notion that violent "protest" meant success where other methods have failed. I think that's backwards.
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    I'm assuming the context from which this question comes is Ferguson.

    The real answer to your question is very complex because violent protest can be effective depending on what the ultimate goal is.

    There was some violence involved in Burkina Faso protests but they ultimately brought down a dictator of 28 years... was that justified and effective... I think most would agree yes.

    Ferguson though is not a "violent protest", it's individuals, taking advantage of a temporary situation of relative lawlessness to steal, it will effect nothing at all, it doesn't bring Michael Brown back and it does nothing to address any potential issues with Police using lethal force (thought there did not appear to be an issue in this case).

    Ultimately the question shouldn't be whether violent protest is effective, it should be when is it justified.

    If people in position of authority (police, politicians etc.) have gone out of their way to cause harm to the people under their protection, it can be somewhat understandable that violence would take place, though when it's justified can always be a tricky line.

    But destroying ones own community because you're angry with police actions is not justified or effective and will and should be met with the full force of law.

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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I'm assuming the context from which this question comes is Ferguson.

    The real answer to your question is very complex because violent protest can be effective depending on what the ultimate goal is.

    There was some violence involved in Burkina Faso protests but they ultimately brought down a dictator of 28 years... was that justified and effective... I think most would agree yes.

    Ferguson though is not a "violent protest", it's individuals, taking advantage of a temporary situation of relative lawlessness to steal, it will effect nothing at all, it doesn't bring Michael Brown back and it does nothing to address any potential issues with Police using lethal force (thought there did not appear to be an issue in this case).

    Ultimately the question shouldn't be whether violent protest is effective, it should be when is it justified.
    There is already a thread asking that very question, though that thread did inspire my question. I probably should have tailored my question to ask if it was effective in the US because, sure, in some places violence is probably the only answer but the I'd think that becomes more a question of civil war rather than mere protest.

    If people in position of authority (police, politicians etc.) have gone out of their way to cause harm to the people under their protection, it can be somewhat understandable that violence would take place, though when it's justified can always be a tricky line.

    But destroying ones own community because you're angry with police actions is not justified or effective and will and should be met with the full force of law.
    Interesting, so you are saying that you could see violence as being a legit response as long as people are targeting communities other than their own? It's not the violence you object to but, rather, simply where it's located. Would looting/burning other parts of the city be more justified/effective?

    Sincere questions based on your response.
    Last edited by X Factor; 11-25-14 at 08:49 PM.
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    I said sometimes/possibly but I dont think this justifies using it. The violent protest might open dialog but I believe that dialog could have been opened without it. The violent protestors just didnt give it time.

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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Are violent protests effective? No I don't think so. Revolution, insurgency etc can be effective but that goes beyond what I'd normally consider a "protest"
    Last edited by Gaius46; 11-25-14 at 08:50 PM.
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amandi View Post
    I said sometimes/possibly but I dont think this justifies using it. The violent protest might open dialog but I believe that dialog could have been opened without it. The violent protestors just didnt give it time.
    But the dialogue is usually along the lines of how to squash the violence and what assholes the "protestors" are.
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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    This is a spin off question about when violent "protest" is justified and the responses seem to fall along the lines of "only as a last resort". My thought was immediately whether violent "protest" ever actually made any situation better or made people more likely to sympathize with whatever the protesters are mad about or is more likely to set people against them? I think it's the latter. I do think there is a case, sometimes, for civil disobedience but that's not the same as saying that violence is justified and/or effective as a means of protest.
    I almost always the weirdo. I'll probably be the only one to vote yes. Many cops all across American have re-adjusted their mentality when dealing with black citizens because of the violence in Missouri. Just as cops changed their attitude because of the L.A. riots in 1992.

    Good or bad was not your question. Effective or non-effective was your question. Did I understand you right?

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    Re: Is Violent "Protest" Effective?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    was that justified and effective
    Justified and effective are not the same thing. This question was about effectiveness. To vote 'no' on this question means that violent protest has a net neutral effect or pretty close to a net neutral impact. That is highly unlikely in my opinion. A severe negative impact can be a result of effective actions. A severe positive impact can be a result of effective actions.

    To imply that violence yields neutral results is silly. If someone punched you in the face every time that you looked at them with your left eye then you would stop opening your left eye when that person was around.

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