View Poll Results: When is violent protest justified?

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  • Always

    2 3.39%
  • Never

    24 40.68%
  • Under certain conditions (please explain)

    33 55.93%
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Thread: When is violent protest justified?

  1. #111
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    I agree with you but I always remember Jefferson's comment that "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure." and then his complete horror when he saw
    his remark made real during the French Revolution. Violence should be the very last resort.
    I always thought Jefferson's appeals to revolution were rightly smacked down by Madison or Adams. From time to time Jefferson fell to fanciful delusions about revolution and when he mentioned these things to some of his more even-keeled colleagues, they tempered him.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  2. #112
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    certain conditions that are only met under very special conditions which are never met in a democratic society rules by fair laws and civil rights like in the US and in just about every civilized democratic country in the western world.
    Former military man (and now babysitter of Donald Trump) John Kelly, is a big loud lying empty barrel!

  3. #113
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    I always thought Jefferson's appeals to revolution were rightly smacked down by Madison or Adams. From time to time Jefferson fell to fanciful delusions about revolution and when he mentioned these things to some of his more even-keeled colleagues, they tempered him.
    Me too. Jefferson, who I greatly admired, was something of a dreamer as Joseph Ellis makes very clear in his biography of Jefferson. He got a huge dose of reality during his stay in France.
    Last edited by Gaius46; 11-25-14 at 07:45 PM.
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  4. #114
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    From my perspective, violence has no place whatsoever in the realm of protest.

    Protest is an expression of collective ideas/ideals. Violence is an expression of brute force and often a direct expression of suppression of collective ideas/ideals. The two are mutually exclusive.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

  5. #115
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    like any other violent act... a violent protest is only justified in self defense.

    in addition, for such a protest to be fully justified, the target must be only those whom have initiated violence on the protesters and caused them to defend themselves.
    committing violence on bystanders or innocents is flat out unjustified.

    so, in my mind, none of the violence in the protests in Ferguson are justified
    Do you consider self-defense to only mean defense against an imminent threat (e.g. police officers shooting at you unprovoked) or does your definition of self-defense also include defending oneself against systemic threats (e.g. systemic abuse of police force)?

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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by CanadaJohn View Post
    From my perspective, violence has no place whatsoever in the realm of protest.

    Protest is an expression of collective ideas/ideals. Violence is an expression of brute force and often a direct expression of suppression of collective ideas/ideals. The two are mutually exclusive.
    Your second point is confusing because collective violence has historically been an expression of collective ideas/ideals. Moreover, while violence is often used as a tool of suppression, it is just as often a response to such suppression.

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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Color me cynical, but I don't that those who have indulged themselves in criminal behavior in Ferguson have asked themselves these questions.

    And being disappointed in a grand jury's decision is no excuse for violence. As noted immediately in this thread, we are are society of laws. There are ways to lawfully redress grievances.
    My comment wasn't about the specifics of Ferguson. In any case, what is the next step people should take when the lawful ways to redress grievances do not work?

  8. #118
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    Your second point is confusing because collective violence has historically been an expression of collective ideas/ideals. Moreover, while violence is often used as a tool of suppression, it is just as often a response to such suppression.
    I was strictly speaking of protests.
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." William F. Buckley Jr.

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    When is violent protest justified?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThePlayDrive View Post
    My comment wasn't about the specifics of Ferguson. In any case, what is the next step people should take when the lawful ways to redress grievances do not work?
    Keep using your legal means. Just because I am not satisfied with the way my causes have progressed, doesn't mean I should get to break the law to get my way.

    In short: suck it up, butttercup.
    Michael J Petrilli-"Is School Choice Enough?"-A response to the recent timidity of American conservatives toward education reform. https://nationalaffairs.com/publicat...-choice-enough

  10. #120
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    Re: When is violent protest justified?

    Violent protest is pointless in my opinion. If I sympathise with your point of view and you use violent protest you will loose some of that sympathy. Protest I support. Civil disobedience as in sit ins of places that are directly involved with what you are protesting I can "support" but not violence.

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