View Poll Results: Is it legal for the President to assume legislative power?

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  • Right Leaning, Not Legal

    22 68.75%
  • Right Leaning, Legal

    0 0%
  • Left Leaning, Not Legal

    6 18.75%
  • Left Leaning, Legal

    4 12.50%
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Thread: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

  1. #71
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    It's a more nuanced question than "can the president pass legislation with an executive order?" The answer to that is no, of course. Not literal legislation.

    However, the President can pass executive orders that fall under the authority already granted to him by Congress, which is a lot broader than most people think. As an example from my industry, the FAA has broad powers over our nation's airspace and the rules governing pilots, mechanics, airlines, etc. And highly independent authority - they don't need congressional approval to make changes to these regulations. Because Congress gave them that power, because Congress can't be arsed to sit down and look over every single little rule in the pilot's book. Few people in Congress would even understand the criteria for determining Decision Altitudes on an ILS approach, much less be able to make informed votes on changes to such a thing.

    Since the FAA is an executive branch organization, Obama is in charge of the FAA. He could theoretically order the FAA to make regulatory changes - so long as those changes fall within the FAA's granted scope.

    So the real question is, how broad is the authorization of ICE? How much power has Congress already granted the executive branch in this matter?

    **** if I know, I'm not a lawyer.
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  2. #72
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Obama completely ignores the Constitution. He should be impeached but the only problem with that is we get Biden as a replacement.
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  3. #73
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    And, if Lincoln had waited for Congress to act, our history could have been quite different don't you think?
    He didn't have to wait, he had the authority as Commander-in-Chief. It took more than Congress to pass the 13th Amendment.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    He didn't have to wait, he had the authority as Commander-in-Chief. It took more than Congress to pass the 13th Amendment.
    As commander in chief? This wasn't a foreign threat. It was about slavery.
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Regardless of the politics, is it legal for the POTUS to simply assume the ability to pass Legislation, rather than Veto / Enact it? Does our system of checks and balance of powers really grant the President the authority to do as he wishes and dare Congress to stop him?



    For those of you who are tempted to vote "yes" because you A) agree with the policy and B) think that it's a situation that needs to be fixed in a timely manner, I want you to imagine President Scott Walker (or fill in any Republican, really) making the exact same argument, but instead of Immigration Reform, it's about Entitlement Reform.


    "Our Entitlements are in danger. People are in danger. That's why I've decided through Executive Action to enact Paul Ryan's Medicare Reforms and privatize Social Security. Now, if the Congress can get me a bill that I can sign
    [ie: that I agree with], then obviously that bill will take precedence. But until then, we've got to act.



    etc. Remember, everything this guy does is setting a precedent.
    An absurd example. He is talking of directing INS to focus more on gangs and felons being deported first. He is not enacting legislation sui sponte. It is no different than your local police deciding to focus resources on bad neighborhoods.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    As commander in chief? This wasn't a foreign threat. It was about slavery.
    The Emancipation Proclamation was a war tactic. While it isn't the best source, it is accurate in this case: Emancipation Proclamation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    The Emancipation Proclamation was a war tactic. While it isn't the best source, it is accurate in this case: Emancipation Proclamation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    It certainly did spark a war, and was justified by the president as CIC, but it was an executive order. The thirteenth amendment was not ratified until after the civil war, and it seems highly unlikely it could have been passed until afterward. So, the proclamation is an example of an executive order that changed the history of the United States rather dramatically.
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    It is legal. But I agree the office of POTUS has way too much power and I am all in favor of stripping much of that power.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    It certainly did spark a war, and was justified by the president as CIC, but it was an executive order. The thirteenth amendment was not ratified until after the civil war, and it seems highly unlikely it could have been passed until afterward. So, the proclamation is an example of an executive order that changed the history of the United States rather dramatically.
    The Emancipation Proclamation was declared during the war, it did not cause it. Are you really unclear on that point? Yes, it was an executive order and one justified by Lincoln's powers as Commander-in-Chief. It did not apply to the North or even the 4 border states, just those under rebellion. Did it prompt action, probably, I never denied that. Of course the original topic is whether the President can assume legislative power which the Emancipation was not an assumption of legislative power.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by AliHajiSheik View Post
    The Emancipation Proclamation was declared during the war, it did not cause it. Are you really unclear on that point? Yes, it was an executive order and one justified by Lincoln's powers as Commander-in-Chief. It did not apply to the North or even the 4 border states, just those under rebellion. Did it prompt action, probably, I never denied that. Of course the original topic is whether the President can assume legislative power which the Emancipation was not an assumption of legislative power.
    Declaring that the slaves were now free was not an assumption of legislative power?

    And, if Obama should declare the illegals to now be legal, would that be an assumption of legislative power?
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