View Poll Results: Is it legal for the President to assume legislative power?

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  • Right Leaning, Not Legal

    22 68.75%
  • Right Leaning, Legal

    0 0%
  • Left Leaning, Not Legal

    6 18.75%
  • Left Leaning, Legal

    4 12.50%
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Thread: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

  1. #41
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Precedent isnt law though.


    It might not be law, but it sets up how things get done.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    Not legal, just tolerated.
    Speeding is illegal whether you get caught or punished, or not.


    Those who don't get caught and punished will probably keep speeding.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Regardless of how you feel about this issue, the question of whether executive orders are "legal" is absurd. Of course they are. Moreover, Obama is hardly unprecedented in his use of them, or even gratuitous in his use of them. In fact he has been fairly restrained in his use of them considering the financial crisis and deep recession he took office in the midst of. Point being the "president" was set long ago:
    That a simple distraction and change of topic there. Executive Orders issued to deal with Executive departments are not the issue here. Using the EO as a substitute for legislation is.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    The final cure for lawlessness by high officials is to remove their authority by impeaching and convicting them.

    I don't think impeaching President Pinocchio is out of the question. It wouldn't be wise politically now, but that may change, if Mr. Obama decides to abuse his power and insult the Constitution even more than he already has. If the final result is 54 Republican Senators, it still wouldn't be enough to convict and remove an impeached President. The Constitution purposely makes that very hard to do by requiring a two-thirds majority vote, and although Andrew Johnson survived conviction by a single vote, it has never been done yet. Even so, a substantial Republican majority in the Senate tends to make impeachment more likely, by providing greater political cover for a vote in the House to impeach.

  5. #45
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    That a simple distraction and change of topic there. Executive Orders issued to deal with Executive departments are not the issue here. Using the EO as a substitute for legislation is.
    Its a semantics argument. The executive order only pertains to departments under the executive branch. In this case Immigration.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Its a semantics argument. The executive order only pertains to departments under the executive branch. In this case Immigration.
    No, what you are doing is using semantics to distract. Executive orders may not take the place of legislation, that would cross constitutional lines. They are the executive branch's equivalent of senate or house rules. Management.

  7. #47
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    No, what you are doing is using semantics to distract. Executive orders may not take the place of legislation, that would cross constitutional lines. They are the executive branch's equivalent of senate or house rules. Management.
    He hasn't issued a broad executive order concerning immigration yet. So this is all hypothetical, if he does, and it goes beyond his constitutional authority, then it will certainly be successfully challenged in the federal courts.

    For the record, I am much more sympathetic of the mainstream Republican position on illegal immigration than I am of the Democrats position on it.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    And again, they arent complaining about executive orders, only CERTAIN ones.
    Meaning what? Ones you disagree with? That is absurd. Obama has stated he will only offer orders that are within legal bounds and only the SC can decide whether they will stand. All Presidents push their boundary's and polls show the people are surely in favor of some reform. The Republicans and THEIR threats can stick it where the sun doesn't shine.

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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    He hasn't issued a broad executive order concerning immigration yet. So this is all hypothetical, if he does, and it goes beyond his constitutional authority, then it will certainly be successfully challenged in the federal courts.

    For the record, I am much more sympathetic of the mainstream Republican position on illegal immigration than I am of the Democrats position on it.
    Then we have a case of the horse already having left the barn. Certainly you can see the difficulties that result from such a thing. Not to mention, for a POTUS to publically threaten clearly unconstitutional action (clear to all parties) is a problem in and of itself.

  10. #50
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    Re: Is it LEGAL for POTUS to "borrow" legislative power to pass immigration reform?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Regardless of the politics, is it legal for the POTUS to simply assume the ability to pass Legislation, rather than Veto / Enact it? Does our system of checks and balance of powers really grant the President the authority to do as he wishes and dare Congress to stop him?



    For those of you who are tempted to vote "yes" because you A) agree with the policy and B) think that it's a situation that needs to be fixed in a timely manner, I want you to imagine President Scott Walker (or fill in any Republican, really) making the exact same argument, but instead of Immigration Reform, it's about Entitlement Reform.


    "Our Entitlements are in danger. People are in danger. That's why I've decided through Executive Action to enact Paul Ryan's Medicare Reforms and privatize Social Security. Now, if the Congress can get me a bill that I can sign
    [ie: that I agree with], then obviously that bill will take precedence. But until then, we've got to act.



    etc. Remember, everything this guy does is setting a precedent.
    That's something that those on the wrong never properly consider. When they cheer on a corrupt wrong-wing government official claiming unprecedented and unconstitutional power to implement wrong-wing policies, what will happen later on, when that position is occupied by a right-wing official, who might now avail himself of those precedents to implement right-wing policies?
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

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