View Poll Results: Is SS Marriage a Reason for the decline.

Voters
78. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    3 3.85%
  • No

    68 87.18%
  • Other

    7 8.97%
Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 138

Thread: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marriage?

  1. #111
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    I cannot become pregnant like a woman can. That is unequal and no law can make us equal. Of course, one can blow hot air and claim equality. But only the stupid believe it.
    That isn't because of the laws though, but because of nature. No law is preventing you from becoming pregnant.

    Marriage however is part of the laws. And no marriage laws require either spouse in a marriage to become pregnant. That is the difference. You have yet to show how the law is treating you unequally somehow or how the laws of marriage require that spouses be of two different sexes due to how those laws function, not just because some people want the two people to be of two different sexes.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  2. #112
    Uncanny
    Paschendale's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    New York City
    Last Seen
    03-31-16 @ 04:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    12,510

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    You didn't try at all to explain just where you think what I said about the point of constitutional law I was discussing is inaccurate. In fact you can't, and your condescending remark is a lame, transparent attempt to hide that.
    What a shame. You're not going to be any fun. Read post 89. It'll answer all of your questions. Likewise, the court just refused to review the circuit court decisions, many of which did discuss higher levels of scrutiny. According to Deuce, some even applied those higher levels. Those are now the binding precedents. And while you're correct that Romer and Windsor didn't apply higher levels of scrutiny, Lawrence did. It applied a level that sits somewhere between intermediate and strict scrutiny, sometimes referred to as "heightened" scrutiny. Cases dealing with DADT also discussed applying this standard to protections for gays.

    Meanwhile, you don't actually distinguish same sex marriage from interracial marriage. The reasons for preventing them are literally the same ones (tradition and religious objections) and the prohibition is equally arbitrary. Loving provides a fundamental right to marry, governed by strict scrutiny. You have to make an argument as to why that shouldn't apply to homosexuals, and "gayness and race aren't the same thing" doesn't address that.

    I'm surprised you don't know what Brown is, since we already talked about separate but equal. Brown v Board of Education (the only case commonly given the shorthand name of "Brown") is where the court held that having a separate classification is, no matter how equal they seem to be, inherently unequal and a violation of the constitution. Again, they did not limit this decision to matters of race. That is why the lesser status of civil union, no matter how identical on paper, is an unacceptable and unconstitutional solution to same sex rights.

    These are exactly the same kinds of arguments that circuit court judges have been making for years, and they are the binding arguments. Did you even read Perry? That is, Hollingsworth v Perry, the case that overturned Proposition 8? That's the informative ruling for the whole country right now, and it uses many of these exact arguments. The only thing it doesn't do is determine a constitutional standard. It does, however, show why higher ones are more appropriate without reaching a final conclusion. All you have are assertions, and if you supposedly made a decent distinguishing argument, you could at least link it. But I imagine it's not nearly as good as you claim.

    And as to why you need to argue against yourself... you need to account for all the things your opponent will bring up. If you want to make a compelling legal argument, you can't simply just bring your part and let your opponent bring theirs and hope that yours is more compelling. You have to answer what your opponent will discuss. That's literally something covered in the first semester in a law school.

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    Treating two naturally unequal people as were they equals is frequently stupid and often grossly unfair. Think of a handicap.
    The treatment of femininity as a handicap is pretty much the reason that heterosexual marriage is declining.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

  3. #113
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Los Angeles area
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 01:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    9,868

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Lawrence did. It applied a level that sits somewhere between intermediate and strict scrutiny, sometimes referred to as "heightened" scrutiny.
    Prove it. Cite specific language from the majority's decision in Lawrence v. Texas that shows it was applying any form of heightened scrutiny in invalidating the Texas sodomy law.

    You are pretending to know what you don't. Strict scrutiny IS heightened scrutiny--the most common form. The Court has also used another form of heightened scrutiny that's usually called "intermediate." There is no level of heightened scrutiny sitting between the two called "heightened scrutiny."

  4. #114
    Outer space potato man

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:17 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    51,776

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Observe this claim that you originally responded to:



    If, in fact, I am correct and SSM is indeed a symptom of the same root issues that have also caused our increasing inability to form and sustain successful marriages, then we will see adoption of SSM correlate with reductions in heterosexual marriage and reductions in marriage overall. The adoption of SSM does not, then, signify a "stemming of the tide" (as you have suggested), but rather an continued acceleration along a glide path of marriage failure across society.

    If your argument basically boils down to "If you discount all the bad results, then the results are great!", then all you have done is predetermined your result by perverse input selection.
    So, "number of marriages" isn't your measuring stick then? What is?
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  5. #115
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,774

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    Gay "marriage" is a sick, disgusting abomination.
    No, that would be Christianity.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  6. #116
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,774

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by Paleocon View Post
    Because it condones that which is not natural.
    Neither is living in a house or driving a car. I'm sure you do both, hypocrite.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  7. #117
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:20 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,105

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    So, "number of marriages" isn't your measuring stick then? What is?
    See that word in your post, "percentages" ?

    100 successful marriages out of a population of (say) 210 adults is pretty good.

    100 successful marraiges out of a population of 2100 adults is not.

  8. #118
    Outer space potato man

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:17 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    51,776

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    See that word in your post, "percentages" ?

    100 successful marriages out of a population of (say) 210 adults is pretty good.

    100 successful marraiges out of a population of 2100 adults is not.
    Right, but I'm using the entire population, from which a percentage of people are currently artificially excluded by laws against getting married to their partner. You, for some reason, are choosing to exclude that population up until they do have the option to get married. I guess they just don't count as part of society and culture until then?
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  9. #119
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    See that word in your post, "percentages" ?

    100 successful marriages out of a population of (say) 210 adults is pretty good.

    100 successful marraiges out of a population of 2100 adults is not.
    A "successful" marriage though is subjective. And there is nothing truly wrong or harmful about people just getting divorced, ending their marriages. Unless there are other issues, then that in itself is just the ending of a personal relationship that truly has no affect on you.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  10. #120
    Uncanny
    Paschendale's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    New York City
    Last Seen
    03-31-16 @ 04:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    12,510

    Re: Is the legalization of SS marriage a cause for the decline of heterosexual marria

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Prove it. Cite specific language from the majority's decision in Lawrence v. Texas that shows it was applying any form of heightened scrutiny in invalidating the Texas sodomy law.

    You are pretending to know what you don't. Strict scrutiny IS heightened scrutiny--the most common form. The Court has also used another form of heightened scrutiny that's usually called "intermediate." There is no level of heightened scrutiny sitting between the two called "heightened scrutiny."
    Hence, limited understanding.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •