View Poll Results: What will you do?

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127. You may not vote on this poll
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    5 3.94%
  • Vote for Clinton

    38 29.92%
  • Vote for Bush

    42 33.07%
  • Undecided

    6 4.72%
  • Other

    36 28.35%
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Thread: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

  1. #91
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Set aside his family and explain what it is that you dislike about Jeb Bush. Everything negative I hear about him is either standard "He's a conservative, therefore I hate him." or "He's a Bush, therefore I hate him." Set aside the rhetoric and preconceived notions and look at the man and let us know what issues you have with him.
    he's a politician. Do i need another reason?

  2. #92
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by polgara View Post
    It's not letting me give you a "like" on this post, so I'm doing it this way for all your hard work!
    It's not hard work, it is work of joy. I love messing with politics, it is right up my line. I love history and I love making predictions, both work in conjunction with the other. If it wasn't fun, I wouldn't do it.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  3. #93
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Cool, I've seen that before, was that you that posted it?
    It probably was. I have all sorts of things like that I keep track of. Usually I post this thing to show the dissatisfaction of the electorate with both parties. It is sad when both parties unfavorables are 60% or more. But even if one hates both parties, what is one going to do on election day? Stay home? I didn't and have voted third party in five of the last six elections.

    The problem is the Democrats and the Republicans have a monopoly on our election system. Both parties write the election laws as a mutual protection act and those special interests etc. who donate their millions upon million donate only to the two major parties. So any third party is starting about a billion dollars or more behind the big two.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  4. #94
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    It probably was. I have all sorts of things like that I keep track of. Usually I post this thing to show the dissatisfaction of the electorate with both parties. It is sad when both parties unfavorables are 60% or more. But even if one hates both parties, what is one going to do on election day? Stay home? I didn't and have voted third party in five of the last six elections.

    The problem is the Democrats and the Republicans have a monopoly on our election system. Both parties write the election laws as a mutual protection act and those special interests etc. who donate their millions upon million donate only to the two major parties. So any third party is starting about a billion dollars or more behind the big two.
    I totally agree.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  5. #95
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I totally agree.
    Actually thinking about it, when it comes to the big two they just aren't that big anymore. Oh, they are because of our election laws and money, but as for those who identify with them, they aren't. Independents is real close to 50% of the electorate. Look at it this way, the major parties have been on the down hill of things. From 1930 to 1960, 80% or more Americans identified themselves with the two major parties. By 1990 that was down below 70% and in 2011 the two party strength fell to below 60%. I would be a bit surprise if by 2016 their strength is below 50%.

    Yet there is no alternative the way our system is. Both parties put up bum candidates and expect us to like it and to vote for them. Like fools, most of us do. So we have only ourselves to blame for the current situation. We have received exactly what we deserve.
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  6. #96
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Perotista View Post
    George Wallace while running as the American Independent Party back in 1968 said, "There's not a dimes worth of difference between the two parties."

    Actually according to Gallup, as of 7 September of this year the party affiliation is broken down 26% identify or affiliate themselves with the Democratic Party, 25% with the Republican Party and 47% profess to be independents. Of those 47% who say they are independents, 16% lean towards the Democrats, 22% towards the Republicans and 9% are classified as true independent. Here is the history of Party affiliation since 1935, just in case you are interested.

    Here is a list of party affiliation from 1935 to present. I find it quite interesting that the Republican Party has never been higher than 35% of the electorate and that occurred in both 1945 and 1955. Truman had replaced FDR in 1945 and WWII had come to an end. In 1955 Eisenhower was president and was popular with both parties. Everyone liked IKE. Whereas the Democrats have been as high as 52%, 1965 a year after the Goldwater debacle and passage of the civil rights act of 1964 and as low as 30% which the Democrats registered in 2011 and 2013. The Republicans all time low was 21% the year after Nixon resigned from office in 1975 because of Watergate. Today’s mark of 26% for the Democrats ties their record low which was recorded on August 14th of 2011.


    Pew Research for the 1935-2000 numbers/Gallup for 2005-Today

    Year…Dem…Rep…Ind…Ind.Lean.Dem….Ind.Lean.Rep…..True .Ind
    1935…51……30……19
    1940…50……32……18
    1945…47……35…..18
    1950…48……32…..20
    1955…47……35…..18
    1960…51……29…..20
    1965…52……24….24
    1970…47……27…..26
    1975…51……21…..28
    1980…45……27…..28
    1985…40……32…...28
    1990…38……30…..32
    1995…32……32…..36
    2000…34……30…..36
    2005…34……33……30………..14…………………....8…………………8
    2010…32……33…..34………..12……………………15…………………7
    2011…30……27…..42………..18……………………15…………………9
    2012…35……30…..33………..16……………………12…………………5
    2013…30……24….44………..14…………………..18………………..13
    2014…26……25….47………..16…………………..22………………….9…..As of September 7, 2014
    It's truly worth noting that George Wallace said this in large part because the leadership of both the Republican and Democratic parties rejected Wallace's continued advocacy for segregation. His political party was formed with the explicit purpose of pushing his segregationist agenda after it was rejected by the Democratic party in the preceding years.

    His opinion on this might be, ah, colored.

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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    It's truly worth noting that George Wallace said this in large part because the leadership of both the Republican and Democratic parties rejected Wallace's continued advocacy for segregation. His political party was formed with the explicit purpose of pushing his segregationist agenda after it was rejected by the Democratic party in the preceding years.

    His opinion on this might be, ah, colored.
    Cute way of putting it. But I think when one steps back, puts cotton in their ears or puts on some ear plugs to stop the rhetoric of both parties and just watches how they govern, you will see little difference. There is another saying that I am unsure who said it, but it goes, "There is only one political party in the United States, but it has two wings. The Republican Wing and the Democratic Wing."
    This Reform Party member thinks it is high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first and their political party further down the line. But for way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

  8. #98
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Insanity: repeating the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

    As long as there's an alternative to voting for an R or a D, I'll chose the alternative.

  9. #99
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    I'd probably vote Libertarian on that one... but to be totally honest I probably will regardless who the two mainstream candidates are.
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  10. #100
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    Re: 2016 - if it comes down to Clinton vs. Bush

    Quote Originally Posted by OrphanSlug View Post
    No, I would say that is a fantastic argument against and concern about aristocracy. It does not matter if we are talking about a 3rd Bush in office or a 2nd Clinton, there must be somoene out there that does not represent the polarization these families clearly bring to the table. Capabilities of course comes into play, not necessarily all one or the other but it would be moronic to not see the condition we are setting ourselves up for with political family dynasty after dynasty. In a way that also applies to the Kennedy's and several other families that have found a way that through family have a foot in the door to the political scene.
    So you could have the most qualified person in the world running for office and if she was part of a "dynasty", you wouldn't vote for her??
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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