View Poll Results: What should be done to battle income inequality in the USA?

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  • Do not intervene

    47 51.09%
  • Yes, do intervene

    45 48.91%
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Thread: Income Inequality

  1. #741
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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfoot 88 View Post
    I think the most important thing policy makers need to do is identify government policies that have created inequality, and then change or abolish them so that they no longer cause it. Others would say we need to go down the Marxist path of mass redistribution of wealth, but that would not only be incredibly destructive (economically and ethically), it would also ignore real things we should do to eliminate special advantages which have been establishment by government force.

    I also think it is important to recognize that income inequality as a concept is not a problem. It's the stagnation of a group of people economically that is the problem. If everyone's standard of living increases amid inequality, then there is no problem unless you give the concept of absolute equality moral credence (I don't).
    Incomes are going to be unequal simply because skills offered by some are deemed more valuable than skills by another.

    What I have yet to figure out is how someone who has the same skills today that it took to do the same job 50 years ago can expect anything but stagnant wages. That's why I have a problem with the concept of a living wage. It operates under paying someone based on existence rather than what they offer. If someone's standard of living doesn't increase because they offer so little in the way of marketable skills, the problem isn't with the one doing the paying but the one doing the offering of skills. A high school dropout is a prime example. I taught high school for many years. The dropout rate where I lived was around 25%. Many who dropped out were in the 9th grade for the 3rd time. That means they had the equivalent of an 8th grade education. Skills garnered at that level aren't worth much to an employer.

  2. #742
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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    It is usual for those entrenched in the phobia to view it as normal.
    Yeah, right.

  3. #743
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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative65 View Post
    Incomes are going to be unequal simply because skills offered by some are deemed more valuable than skills by another.
    That isn't the argument at hand, the argument is that wages have declined in real terms for the lowest quintile since 1980, have barely risen for the rest while the top quintiles have seen very large income gains.

    This is the result of various policies.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  4. #744
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    Re: Income Inequality

    When should growing inequality concern us? This is a moral and political question. It is also an economic one. It is increasingly recognised that, beyond a certain point, inequality will be a source of significant economic ills.

    The US – both the most important high-income economy and much the most unequal – is providing a test bed for the economic impact of inequality. The results are worrying.
    This realisation has now spread to institutions that would not normally be accused of socialism. A report written by the chief US economist of Standard & Poor’s, and another from Morgan Stanley, agree that inequality is not only rising but having damaging effects on the US economy.
    According to the Federal Reserve, the upper 3 per cent of the income distribution received 30.5 per cent of total incomes in 2013. The next 7 per cent received just 16.8 per cent. This left barely over half of total incomes to the remaining 90 per cent. The upper 3 per cent was also the only group to have enjoyed a rising share in incomes since the early 1990s. Since 2010, median family incomes fell, while the mean rose. Inequality keeps rising. The Morgan Stanley study lists among causes of the rise in inequality: the growing proportion of poorly paid and insecure low-skilled jobs; the rising wage premium for educated people; and the fact that tax and spending policies are less redistributive than they used to be a few decades ago.
    Thus, in 2012, says the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development, the US ranked highest among the high-income countries in the share of relatively low-paying jobs. Moreover, the bottom quintile of the income distribution received only 36 per cent of federal transfer payments in 2010, down from 54 per cent in 1979.

    Regressive payroll taxes, which cost the poor proportionally more than the rich, are projected to raise 32 per cent of federal revenue in fiscal year 2015, against 46 per cent for federal income tax, the burden of which falls more on higher earners.
    Also important are huge increases in the relative pay of executives, together with the shift in incomes from labour to capital. The Federal Reserve’s policies have also benefited the relatively well off; it is trying to raise the prices of assets which are overwhelmingly owned by the rich.
    These reports bring out two economic consequences of rising inequality: weak demand and lagging progress in raising educational levels.
    The argument on demand is that, up to the time of the crisis, many of those who were not enjoying rising real incomes borrowed instead. Rising house prices made this possible. By late 2007, debt peaked at 135 per cent of disposable incomes.

    Then came the crash. Left with huge debts and unable to borrow more, people on low incomes have been forced to spend less. Withdrawal of mortgage equity, financed by borrowing, has collapsed. The result has been an exceptionally weak recovery of consumption.



    American education has also deteriorated. It is the only high-income country whose 25-34 year olds are no better educated than its 55-64 year olds. This is partly because other countries have caught up on the US, which pioneered mass college education. It is also because children from poor backgrounds are handicapped in completing college.
    The S&P report notes that for the poorest households college graduation rates increased by only about 4 percentage points between the generation born in the early 1960s and that born in the early 1980s. The graduation rate for the wealthiest households increased by almost 20 percentage points over the same period. Yet, without a college degree, the chances of upward mobility are now quite limited. As a result, children of prosperous families are likely to stay well-off and children of poor families likely to remain poor.


    http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/8b41d...#axzz3EqFDdMtR
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Income Inequality

    Talk about fraudulent posting man look in the mirror.

    I have a great net worth, but have made less then a line worker at McDonalds in income; and that's fine since it helps me to avoid your beloved theft called taxes! Screw all of those who want to take what I've built up and give it too low life scum of the earth that can't bother to try because their too busy playing xbox.

    You clearly have no clue about income / wealth and illustrate it proudly with your "liberal" lean to the radical left. It is ignorance like yours that puts our nation and the lives of a lot of people at risk for one day you will truly run out of "high wage earners" to tax and redistribute from. I can't wait for that to happen to be honest and watch it all burn thanks to the likes of YOU.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    My asking you "where do you think wealth comes from?" is equating income to wealth?

    Let me help your ignorance, wealth is the accumulation of income.

    I "advocated" (for) killing the wealthy? When I warned that high levels of inequality leads to revolution...and I wanted less inequality and greater social stability?

    Is reading really that tough?

    Is it even tougher to quote what I actually said?

    FFS, your fraudulent posting is so sad.

  6. #746
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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Where in the United States? Where in Sweden? There are scores of places to live in both countries. My background is Swedish and I visited there not long ago and still have friends living in Malmo and Stockholm..

    Swedish Welfare State Collapses as Immigrants Wage War

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85Vwl2LyX0M


    The discussion evolved from a Swede lecturing Americans, so you contribute to the ongoing irony, and this is a tiresome habit the majority of western Europeans fall into. In fact I've never met a more tiresome bunch.

    LMAO @ your sources. I don't believe you've ever even been to Sweden.

    I'm from Vasteras originally, most of my family live in Stockholm.

    The United States will collapse long before Sweden does.

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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative65 View Post
    Much of the argument in favor of increasing the minimum wage centers around other countries having much higher minimium wage rates. In fact, Sweden is often used as one of them by supporters of making minimum wage $15/hour. If you want to look at a childish argument, look at that one. Someone that argues the U.S. should do such a thing because others do it argue from the intellectual level of a 5 year old. It's like little Johnny saying he should get to do something simply because little Jimmy does.
    Plenty of rational and reasonable arguments can be made against raising the minimum wage. For one thing, what works in Sweden might not work in a country 20 times as large with many more global responsibilities, built on a different economic model.

    However, to say that Sweden is falling apart is ignorant and doesn't reflect real life. Sweden is a very nice country. Likewise, to say that someone's argument is wrong just because they're an "annoying European" is childish in that it fails to address the actual argument that person is making and simply seeks to put them in a box, based solely on their nationality, where nothing they say could ever be correct.

    I think we should all strive for free and open debate, for freedom of expression and ideas, and may the best ideas win based on their own merit. We should not base our opinions based on prejudices we might have against certain nationalities.

  8. #748
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    Re: Income Inequality

    1. Globalization has allowed the winners to win on a much larger playing field, with greatly enhanced rewards. Almost all countries in the OECD have experienced the increase in inequality.
    2. Not sure that there are any serious long term consequences. I am not a fan of inherited wealth and hope that we have inheritance laws that restrict the founding of dynasties such as the Kennedy, Rockefeller, etc. Hopefully the wealthy will follow the lead of Warren Buffett and Gates and donate almost all of their wealth.
    3. Don't know how you could adjust course. A case in point is Denmark which has one of the lowest ("best") GINI coefficients in terms of income inequality but ranks next to the US as the worst in terms of wealth inequality. Some people save better than others and will always be wealthier. But, as Obama has stated, at some point you have enough money. The important thing is that everyone has the bottom 2 rungs of Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs satisfied-Physiological and Safety-met. Generally all the populations of the OECD countries have these needs met. The higher needs are not money related-Love, Esteem, Self-Actualization and can not be provided by society anyway.
    Last edited by Eric7216; 09-30-14 at 09:23 PM.

  9. #749
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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    It's indisputable fact that income inequality in the United States has grown substantially in the past few decades.

    Median nominal incomes, adjusted for inflation, have not gone up in the USA since the 50's. (Median is the halfway point, so we are talking about the middle-earner). In contrast, the per capita GDP has risen quite dramatically, due to the increased purchasing power of the upper echelon.


    I pose three questions to you:

    1.) What has caused this phenomenon
    2.) What are the long term implications if the trend is allowed to continue
    3.) What, if anything, should be done to adjust our course


    Thanks

    I think that if someone was really concerned about income inequality of Americans then the first thing they would want to do is crack down on illegal immigration and if needed restrict legal immigration. Because if there is a long line of people ready to replace you at a moment's notice then you become less valuable to your employer. When the labor pool is over flowing employers can offer lower wages, no raises or any other benefits. When the labor pool is not over flowing you not only have a better chance of getting a job your employer will offer you better pay, raises and other benefits. The law of supply and demand also applies to the labor market.

    Another thing someone can do about income inequlity is pull out of harmful trade treaties that cost Americans their jobs. I realize that many checked pants republicans have their lips for firmly wrapped around the cocks of business owners in order to get that money. But most other Americans realize that America should make its own things and not be at the mercy of other countries to make our things. There is also the fact that buying all those foreign made goods like the pockets of those foreign governments which aids in increasing their military might and thus becoming a potential threat to our country.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Income Inequality

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    Nothing should be done, that isn't already being done. Income equality is a reality, because people aren't all equal in intelligence, drive, ingenuity, and just plain old luck. I strongly support reward for efforts, education, and industriousness, and I strongly dislike paying people for doing nothing.
    all those do-nothings stimulate our consumer economy. What would we do without them?

    lol Rebuild and start over.

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