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Should the USA and Canada be one country?

Should the USA and Canada be one country?

  • Yes, the benefits for both countries is too much to pass up

    Votes: 12 16.4%

  • No, leave well enough alone eh?

    Votes: 61 83.6%
  • Total voters
    73
Grand Mal said:
Ohferfvcksakes.
When did your brow get so lower?
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we can trade you some rappers for Neil Young and Gordon Lightfoot as well as Geddy, Neal and Alex
 
Grand Mal said:
Never. You could never get more than a handful of lunatic Canadians to agree to such a stupid proposal. If you seriously think you could sell this hallucination to a measurable group of Canucks you've never been north of the border. Canadians don't want to be Americans. You might be surprised to find that most people in the developed world don't want to be Americans. Sorry, but you brought it up...
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Woah there, snarky. You'll recall, I opened up my OP with these fighting words... "I'm pretty sure the majority of Americans and Canadians will be against this idea.... however I'd like to put it out there for discussion."

So you're not telling me anything I don't already know, most people will be against the idea.

The debate is a polemic designed to draw attention to a more serious discussion of the merits of European-style border reform and greater economic integration between our two countries.

Yeesh. Touchy.
 
Carjosse said:
The thing about that is, Quebec would require French to be recognized at a Federal level. Unlike Spanish speaking immigrants which are expected to learn English, Quebec parle seulment Francais. Francophones in Canada have a right to speak French and receive all government (federal, state, whatever) services in French. The U.S. government would have to recognize the French language and provide services in that language. There is also the fact that anti-Americanism is strongest in Quebec.
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The US government doesn't provide services in any language. That's done at the state level. We're not as federalized as Canada.
 
Grand Mal said:
So this hypothetical country is just the US, doubled in size? Decisions that Canadian provinces usually make are now in the hands of, who?
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I would expect a structure similar to the United Kingdom, where you have the nations of Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland, but all fall under one umbrella.

The US would be like England in this scenario, I imagine.

The other option would be for Canada to just be annexed, like Texas and California were back in the day. Then your provinces would become US states.

Here's an interesting read by a Canadian academic, who dives in to the topic: http://www.amazon.com/Merger-Centur...iewpoints=0&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending
 
Peter Grimm said:
Woah there, snarky. You'll recall, I opened up my OP with these fighting words... "I'm pretty sure the majority of Americans and Canadians will be against this idea.... however I'd like to put it out there for discussion."

So you're not telling me anything I don't already know, most people will be against the idea.

The debate is a polemic designed to draw attention to a more serious discussion of the merits of European-style border reform and greater economic integration between our two countries.

Yeesh. Touchy.
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Your thread title says, well, you know what it says and the title is meant to open controversy so don't back off, waving your hands and saying, "Whoah there" when the controversy happens.
 
Then where will Americans go to when they get fed up? :mrgreen:
 
Peter Grimm said:
I would expect a structure similar to the United Kingdom, where you have the nations of Scotland, England, Wales, Northern Ireland, but all fall under one umbrella.

The US would be like England in this scenario, I imagine.

The other option would be for Canada to just be annexed, like Texas and California were back in the day. Then your provinces would become US states.

Here's an interesting read by a Canadian academic, who dives in to the topic: Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: Merger of the Century: Why Canada and America Should Become One Country
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Okay, you're trolling. Had a long day, that's my only excuse.
Hasta la vista.
 
clownboy said:
Then where will Americans go to when they get fed up? :mrgreen:
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Exactly! If Canada and the U.S. merged I'd have to find a new place to threaten to move to every four years.
 
The US is incompatible with a Monarchy.
 
Peter Grimm said:
I'm pretty sure the majority of Americans and Canadians will be against this idea.... however I'd like to put it out there for discussion.

Unless you're living under a rock, you know that there exists such a thing as the European Union. In it, several European countries have come together to form a bloc in which they share a common currency, certain branches of government, in which there is a free flow of people, and they are working toward a mutual defense system.


I will lay out a case why I think such a union between the United States and Canada could be beneficial to both parties, and could work better than even the EU.


1.) Cultural similarities - Both countries speak English as their first language. The way they talk are virtually indistinguishable from one another. Vancouver and Seattle have more in common with each other, culturally, than either one does with Birmingham Alabama, for example. Toronto and Buffalo have more in common than either has with Dallas.

This is not the case in the EU, and their union still works. USA and Canada are a natural cultural fit.


2.) National Defense - Today, we have NORAD (North American Aerospace Defense Command) which essentially serves to link up the United States and Canada as one unit when it comes to the defense of our continent from foreign invasions. Canada benefits from the US' huge military providing security, and the US benefits from the early warning and defense from the north by, potentially, the Russians or others.

The EU has no such defense agreement, but their union still works. Norad has existed and worked well for both countries since 1956.


3.) Alaska - The only way to get to Alaska is to drive through or fly over Canada. It helps to be able to get to and access your own territories freely.


4.) Economy - Canada is extremely blessed with natural resources. At least equal to that of the United States. Russia is more blessed than either one. The only way Canada or the US can match the Russians is to combine forces.

Here's a breakdown:

CANADA -

Proven oil reserves: 173.9 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 70 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 7.8 billion tons

Energy portfolio... total value: $20.2 trillion



Metal and ore reserves... $1 trillion

Reserves composition (value):

79% Potash
6% Iron ore
5% Nickel
3% Gold
3% Copper
1% Zinc
1% Platinum (PGM)

Years of production: 56




UNITED STATES -

Proven oil reserves: 35 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 300 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 237 billion tons

Energy portfolio.... total value: $28.5 trillion


Metal and ore reserves... $613 billion

Reserves composition (value):

20% Copper
19% Iron Ore
12% Gold
5% Platinum (PGM)
4% Zinc
3% Potash

Years of production: 44



RUSSIA -

Proven oil reserves: 87 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 1,163 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 157 billion tons

Energy portfolio.... total value: $40.7 trillion


Metal and ore reserves... $1.63 trillion

Reserves composition (value):

49% Iron ore
20% Potash
14% Platinum (PGM)
8% Gold
5% Nickel
4% Copper

Years of production: 99



So you can see, the only way the US or Canada can match Russia as far as resources go is to combine forces, in which case we surpass the Russians.

So this benefits the Americans on the global stage. On the other hand, the US is blessed with a large, educated, and industrial population and we have the largest GDP in the world by a long shot. Canada could benefit greatly from free American investment minus all the legal and currency hurdles that exist today.



5.) We get Burger King back, and two types of bacon > one type of bacon.




What do you think? Would you be in favor of the USA and Canada joining forces, or is it better to continue as is?
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It would be fantastic and mutually beneficial. I'd be an enthusiastic supporter. I suppose we could just conquer them, wouldn't be that hard.
 
I use to advocate for a North American union under the U.S. constitution but watching Mexican TV and how cheesy it is, I've been having second thoughts on Mexico.
 
Peter Grimm said:
5.) We get Burger King back, and two types of bacon > one type of bacon.
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Those other godzillion issues make no sense!

But yes I think you should join so as to get "Burger King" back! Anything for getting Burger King back!
 
Despite favorable positions in these last posts, the statistics in this OP are majorly against it for now.
 
Some comments and questions.

The EU isn't really one big country though.
What's wrong with just trading currency?
What's wrong with just having defense treaties?
Why not just have open travel without becoming one country? Not too long ago I could re-enter the US from Mexico without a passport.
Is there a like button that can take away some of DaveFagan's likes?

I wouldn't want there to be any kind of union that is as "official" as the EU. I don't think Canada can handle all of the butthurt they'd have over it. They wouldn't even be butthurt because of the numbers in politics. They'd just be all upset because Canadians are more "nyeh I hate Americuhhhh and like, war?" like your average rebellious teenager in the US is. The whole, "BUT MY TAX SUBSIDIZED HEALTH CARE MIGHT DISAPPEAR EVEN THOUGH IT WON'T" too.

Peter Grimm said:
the reason it won't happen anytime soon is because of rural, rightwing Americans. Canadians are so much smarter. The Christian Heritage party doesn't exist and the western bloc party never did. Trailer Park Boys and the Red Green show are actually about Americans in America. Yeah, let's recognize Alaska for being a bunch of crazy mountain folk and Eskimos but Nunavut, NWT, Yukon, Newfoundland, the entire country, just a bunch of affluent well-to-do liberals.
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wutevr.gif

^ and everything Ganesh said about how 300,000,000+ people are just ducking bullets whizzing by in every direction every waking moment of their short shot to death lives. Canadians have guns too and messed up super crazy wild west Vermont and New Hampshire have fewer gun deaths than Canada.

I don't care if I'm strawmaning. I can read between the lines. I got the subtext of what y'all meant.
 
Peter Grimm said:
I'm pretty sure the majority of Americans and Canadians will be against this idea.... however I'd like to put it out there for discussion.

Unless you're living under a rock, you know that there exists such a thing as the European Union. In it, several European countries have come together to form a bloc in which they share a common currency, certain branches of government, in which there is a free flow of people, and they are working toward a mutual defense system.


I will lay out a case why I think such a union between the United States and Canada could be beneficial to both parties, and could work better than even the EU.


1.) Cultural similarities - Both countries speak English as their first language. The way they talk are virtually indistinguishable from one another. Vancouver and Seattle have more in common with each other, culturally, than either one does with Birmingham Alabama, for example. Toronto and Buffalo have more in common than either has with Dallas.

This is not the case in the EU, and their union still works. USA and Canada are a natural cultural fit.


2.) National Defense - Today, we have NORAD (North American Aerospace Defense Command) which essentially serves to link up the United States and Canada as one unit when it comes to the defense of our continent from foreign invasions. Canada benefits from the US' huge military providing security, and the US benefits from the early warning and defense from the north by, potentially, the Russians or others.

The EU has no such defense agreement, but their union still works. Norad has existed and worked well for both countries since 1956.


3.) Alaska - The only way to get to Alaska is to drive through or fly over Canada. It helps to be able to get to and access your own territories freely.


4.) Economy - Canada is extremely blessed with natural resources. At least equal to that of the United States. Russia is more blessed than either one. The only way Canada or the US can match the Russians is to combine forces.

Here's a breakdown:

CANADA -

Proven oil reserves: 173.9 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 70 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 7.8 billion tons

Energy portfolio... total value: $20.2 trillion



Metal and ore reserves... $1 trillion

Reserves composition (value):

79% Potash
6% Iron ore
5% Nickel
3% Gold
3% Copper
1% Zinc
1% Platinum (PGM)

Years of production: 56




UNITED STATES -

Proven oil reserves: 35 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 300 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 237 billion tons

Energy portfolio.... total value: $28.5 trillion


Metal and ore reserves... $613 billion

Reserves composition (value):

20% Copper
19% Iron Ore
12% Gold
5% Platinum (PGM)
4% Zinc
3% Potash

Years of production: 44



RUSSIA -

Proven oil reserves: 87 billion barrels
Proven gas reserves: 1,163 trillion cubic feet
Proven coal reserves: 157 billion tons

Energy portfolio.... total value: $40.7 trillion


Metal and ore reserves... $1.63 trillion

Reserves composition (value):

49% Iron ore
20% Potash
14% Platinum (PGM)
8% Gold
5% Nickel
4% Copper

Years of production: 99



So you can see, the only way the US or Canada can match Russia as far as resources go is to combine forces, in which case we surpass the Russians.

So this benefits the Americans on the global stage. On the other hand, the US is blessed with a large, educated, and industrial population and we have the largest GDP in the world by a long shot. Canada could benefit greatly from free American investment minus all the legal and currency hurdles that exist today.



5.) We get Burger King back, and two types of bacon > one type of bacon.




What do you think? Would you be in favor of the USA and Canada joining forces, or is it better to continue as is?
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I'm not worried about oil or any of that.

How do we convince Canadians to accept our healthcare, pistol carry permits and not to mention our declaired seporation from the Crown as their own?
 
What is in it for Canada...a much higher murder rate and more terrorism?

Sure America gets all those natural resources and only has to take on an additional 35 million people to get them.

What on Earth does Canada get out of it?
 
Should the USA and Canada be one country?

No.

But I do appreciate that they gave the world hockey.
 
Peter Grimm said:
I'm pretty sure the majority of Americans and Canadians will be against this idea.... however I'd like to put it out there for discussion.
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The United States was founded in defiance and violent rebellion against a horrendous tyrant.

Canada was founded in cowering and grovelling before this same tyrant.

More than two centuries later, deep and irreconcilable cultural differences remain, defined by this difference in origins of the two nations.

To suggest that the two nations are similar enough to make sense of such a union is a deep insult to any American.
 
Bob Blaylock said:
The United States was founded in defiance and violent rebellion against a horrendous tyrant.

Canada was founded in cowering and grovelling before this same tyrant.

More than two centuries later, deep and irreconcilable cultural differences remain, defined by this difference in origins of the two nations.

To suggest that the two nations are similar enough to make sense of such a union is a deep insult to any American.
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Oh, get over it. Not like you were alive back then.

What the **** kind of "irreconcilable cultural differences" do we have with CANADA, for ****'s sake? It's not like they're cannibals or they behead people.

Stop acting like you were throwing tea in the harbor. Anyone who had anything to do with founding either country has been dead for quite some time.
 
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Kobie said:
Oh, get over it. Not like you were alive back then.
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So what? It's an important part of my heritage as an American, and as a descendant of some of the great men who participated in that conflict. It is part of the history that has shaped and defined the culture in which I live today, and which makes this culture different from the other culture to the north, which was founded on cowardice and treason.
 
Bob Blaylock said:
So what? It's an important part of my heritage as an American, and as a descendant of some of the great men who participated in that conflict. It is part of the history that has shaped and defined the culture in which I live today, and which makes this culture different from the other culture to the north, which was founded on cowardice and treason.
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Wow, you're a descendant of Revolutionary War fighters? So am I. I don't act like I had something to do with it.

What are these "irreconcilable differences"? I'm not advocating the OP's premise, but I find your opinion ridiculous.
 
I don't see this happening, but I suppose I could see a province or two break off from Canada and apply to be a state. I'm assuming this is possible in Canada since Quebec threatens independence every few decades.

I generally like Canada and the only thing I truly hate there is buying gas. Two conversions--very bad.
 
AliHajiSheik said:
I don't see this happening, but I suppose I could see a province or two break off from Canada and apply to be a state. I'm assuming this is possible in Canada since Quebec threatens independence every few decades.

I generally like Canada and the only thing I truly hate there is buying gas. Two conversions--very bad.
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Driving in Ontario is awful. They generally will give you plenty of room to merge, which is great, but they expect it back to such a degree that they will cut you off with nary a blinker.
 
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