View Poll Results: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement

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  • Yes, I still feel the same.

    30 50.00%
  • It's complicated.

    17 28.33%
  • No, I have switched my thoughts.

    5 8.33%
  • The whole thing makes my head hurt.

    8 13.33%
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Thread: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

  1. #321
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    What was illegal about the 2003 invasion of Iraq? The fact that Iraq did not present a clear and present danger to America.
    I love your sense of humor! Where in the Constitution do you find a requirement that Congress declare war only if there is a clear and present danger? Congress can declare war for any reason or for no reason at all.

    Not only that, but what happened to those who pointed out the faults and fallacies in the Bush administration's claims about WMD's?
    Who cares? All of the intelligence agencies were deceived. It happens. It is my opinion that we were deceived because Hussain was deceived. Very few people wanted their wives tossed alive into a wood chipper or their kids sent to Saddam's rape rooms. So they made it up.

    The Downing Street Memo proves that the Bush administration had been informed that its intel was flawed, but that they were determined to go to war anyway.
    Who cares. There are many opinions about intelligence work. Not every one of my assessments was accepted by decision makers. It happens.

  2. #322
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    What was illegal about the 2003 invasion of Iraq? The fact that Iraq did not present a clear and present danger to America. Not only that, but what happened to those who pointed out the faults and fallacies in the Bush administration's claims about WMD's? The Downing Street Memo proves that the Bush administration had been informed that its intel was flawed, but that they were determined to go to war anyway.
    You have not pointed out a single illegality. Just opinions. Try again.

    And if you read my other comments with Jack, you'll see that I do not begrudge Bush remaining in that 'boutique squadron', nor do I begrudge his dad making sure he stayed there. But that doesn't mean that Bush the Younger was any more qualified to lead the nation.
    However you are still describing Bush's assignment based on your own partisan hatred of Bush. Bush did not ask for any special consideration and Bush Sr did not pull any strings for him. And there is no such thing as a boutique squadron in the Air National Guard. During Vietnam, it was quite common for pilots to be rotated to combat assignments. The Air National Guard is the last place anyone seeking to avoid Vietnam would go. And again Bush did attempt to volunteer for Vietnam. He was turned down because the plane he was trained to fly was not much in service at that point in the War......and the War was beginning to wind down at that point.

    You really should learn to be as cynical of your own people as you are of Dems...and to be as understanding of Dems as you are of your own people.
    Who are you claiming are "my own people"? I am not a republican. I defend Bush where a line of partisan driven bull is being told about him and I criticize him where I believe he was wrong......for instance when he attempted to pass a comprehensive immigration bill without securing the borders first.

  3. #323
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by MadLib View Post
    I agree that we should be more frugal about defense money, but I disagree with raising taxes for everyone. I think our military can see drastic spending cuts once we leave Afghanistan and still be able to accomplish our goals overseas - well-trained Special Forces and a powerful Navy and Air Force will be much more useful in the 21st century than a large standing army. Further, we should tax excess profits for defense contractors. It would also be a good idea to end the War on Drugs, slash funding for the prison system, and free those convicted of drug offenses, so that we have more money to work with.
    i agree with most of your post. i believe, though, that when we are at war, everyone should have to chip in. then we will choose our wars more carefully, because the general public does not want to pay higher tax rates.

  4. #324
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i agree with most of your post. i believe, though, that when we are at war, everyone should have to chip in. then we will choose our wars more carefully, because the general public does not want to pay higher tax rates.
    Higher tax rates make sense if we're planning on engaging on an occupation or a conventional war (like Iraq). Lately, military conflicts have only needed a few airstrikes and/or arming and training proxy troops, and I see no reason to raise taxes in those situations unless they become more expensive; it's just not the same level of commitment.
    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Hah. If someone put me in their sig, I'd never know. I have sigs off.

  5. #325
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i agree with most of your post. i believe, though, that when we are at war, everyone should have to chip in. because the general public does not want to pay higher tax rates.
    Everyone who pays taxes is already chipping in.

    then we will choose our wars more carefully,
    Actually what's important is that if we do get into a war, we should treat it as one and turn the military loose to win it. When we do that, wars do not drag on and on and on.

  6. #326
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by MadLib View Post
    Higher tax rates make sense if we're planning on engaging on an occupation or a conventional war (like Iraq). Lately, military conflicts have only needed a few airstrikes and/or arming and training proxy troops, and I see no reason to raise taxes in those situations unless they become more expensive; it's just not the same level of commitment.
    taxes should go up during any military action. this will make us think twice about entering a war.

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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by ObamacareFail View Post
    Everyone who pays taxes is already chipping in.



    Actually what's important is that if we do get into a war, we should treat it as one and turn the military loose to win it. When we do that, wars do not drag on and on and on.
    i would be more comfortable if there were no military actions without a declaration of war. war is war, not a "police action." this would also be another step between peace and war, and i think that it's appropriate for multiple branches of government to weigh in.

  8. #328
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I didn't speak to Afghanistan. Perhaps you should learn about Al Qaeda in Iraq.

    Tanzim Qaidat al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Do you realize that if you claim AQ was the enemy in Iraq then you are an ally of Dick Cheney?
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  9. #329
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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by Helix View Post
    i would be more comfortable if there were no military actions without a declaration of war. war is war, not a "police action." this would also be another step between peace and war, and i think that it's appropriate for multiple branches of government to weigh in.
    That depends on what you mean by military action. When Reagan bombed Libya over the disco bombing. It was all over in a few hours. I don't think a declaration should be needed for that. The same with Grenada...it was over in just a few days. Both actions were pin prick. I agree that any large scale invasion like Iraq, Afghanistan, Korea, Vietnam, etc should be a declared war. We need to get back to that. Perhaps then wars will less likely be politicized. And the objectives will not be in doubt.

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    Re: Do you still feel the same now about our middle east involvement...

    Quote Originally Posted by ObamacareFail View Post
    That depends on what you mean by military action. When Reagan bombed Libya over the disco bombing. It was all over in a few hours. I don't think a declaration should be needed for that. The same with Grenada...it was over in just a few days. Both actions were pin prick. I agree that any large scale invasion like Iraq, Afghanistan, Korea, Vietnam, etc should be a declared war. We need to get back to that. Perhaps then wars will less likely be politicized. And the objectives will not be in doubt.
    the current war is not likely to be completed in hours. the US will most likely be mired down for years, looking for an exit strategy. either that, or we will just bomb and drone a bunch of places, and then gradually ease out of it.

    it's the job of the regional hegemons, such as Saudi Arabia and Iran. not the US.

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