View Poll Results: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

Voters
76. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    29 38.16%
  • No

    43 56.58%
  • Other

    4 5.26%
Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 910111213 LastLast
Results 101 to 110 of 129

Thread: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

  1. #101
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Last Seen
    01-17-16 @ 05:09 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    9,122

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    I agree that, especially nowadays with the internet, there should be easy and cheap ways for outspent candidates to nonetheless widely communicate to their voters what they're about. No one should be getting their candidate information from advertisements anyway. Campaign ads are by and large pure unadulterated garbage. Not the least bit convincing or intelligent. And if we as a people are too stupid to turn off the ****ing TV and investigate candidates directly and intentionally, then how is Congress going to save us from that?

    Up here for example, I do not favor Mark Begich at all, his politics or his party, never have had any intention of voting for him, but it's clear there are some enormous, national-level pots of money fueling the incessant deluge of propaganda ads about him to take him down. Every single YouTube video you watch within Alaska's boundaries right now starts with a 15-20 second hit piece on Begich. Every single one. Not so much having anything to do with Begich, but just because his seat in Congress is valuable to some very powerful and rich people somewhere. Does that make me want to vote for Begich's main opponent? No. The obnoxious ads make me more skeptical of his opponent than if there were no such ads.

    The ads should be completely ineffective at swaying public opinion. They certainly are for me. It's so easy to just get online and find non-biased or at least significantly less-biased analyses of candidates' positions, voting records, etc.

    I don't think we can trust federal politicians to write laws that protect people from their own utter ignorance. It's up to them to not be ignorant. And if you're letting a TV ad convince you who gets your vote, you're ignorant, and your ignorance weakens the country -- no way around it. The answer to Citizens United and Congressional corruption is not to ask Congress to police how people are spending money to fund their own campaigns. The answer is for the American people to use the tools at the fingertips and do their own homework and stop being idiots. If we can't figure out how to stop being idiots, then we deserve all the corruption and bad leadership that's in store for us.
    I agree about voter's responsibility to do their homework, but the fact is many people are lazy and/or busy. That is why I want to put the information in their faces by putting it on prime time TV. In some cases, getting info on cadidates beyond the brief voter pamphlet description is hard. I live in a small town near a larger city. Our major reagional newspapers give almost no coverage of our local races and we no longer have an accessible local paper, using the internet is required to be an informed voter.

  2. #102
    Sage

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 04:21 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    8,180

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    I agree about voter's responsibility to do their homework, but the fact is many people are lazy and/or busy. That is why I want to put the information in their faces by putting it on prime time TV. In some cases, getting info on cadidates beyond the brief voter pamphlet description is hard. I live in a small town near a larger city. Our major reagional newspapers give almost no coverage of our local races and we no longer have an accessible local paper, using the internet is required to be an informed voter.
    To the bold, exactly. People have to actively shun advertising, intentionally ignore or avoid it and do their own homework. I see no way to get good outcomes if people are brainless lazy passive recipients of TV ad propaganda, regardless of the Citizens United decision.

  3. #103
    Guru

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:52 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    3,206

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    It is freedom of speech for the electorate to decide on election laws. If they want to limit the amount if money a candidate can receive from all individuals to limit powerful special interests from having an advantage and rob freedom from society as a whole, I have no problem with it.

  4. #104
    Sage
    Bodhisattva's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Zealand
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:26 AM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    63,859

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by newpublius View Post
    NY Times clearly engages in 'more' speech than me in practically every conceivable measure of course.
    The speech they practice is independent of the money that they spend.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  5. #105
    Sage
    mpg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Milford, CT
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:13 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,769

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by laska View Post
    It is freedom of speech for the electorate to decide on election laws. If they want to limit the amount if money a candidate can receive from all individuals to limit powerful special interests from having an advantage and rob freedom from society as a whole, I have no problem with it.
    limiting someone else's speech =/= freedom of speech
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  6. #106
    Sage
    mpg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Milford, CT
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:13 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,769

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    The speech they practice is independent of the money that they spend.
    uhh, what?
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  7. #107
    Guru

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:52 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    3,206

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    limiting someone else's speech =/= freedom of speech
    Society chooses to give power to government to curtail the freedom of commercial plants that pollute the air and water. It is common sense that the owner's freedom negatively effects everyone else's freedom to have clean air and water. If the few with massive money have negative effects on everyone else's freedom through corporate welfare, etc, society should have the right to create wise election laws that protect their freedoms.

  8. #108
    Sage
    Bodhisattva's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    New Zealand
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:26 AM
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    63,859

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    uhh, what?
    Money is not speech nor an extension of speech. Money is nothing more than a tool that people use to promote their speech.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have pooped in public, even in public neighborhoods.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  9. #109
    Sage
    mpg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Milford, CT
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:13 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,769

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by laska View Post
    Society chooses to give power to government to curtail the freedom of commercial plants that pollute the air and water. It is common sense that the owner's freedom negatively effects everyone else's freedom to have clean air and water. If the few with massive money have negative effects on everyone else's freedom through corporate welfare, etc, society should have the right to create wise election laws that protect their freedom.
    What if those election laws violate 1A?
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  10. #110
    Sage
    mpg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Milford, CT
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 06:13 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    7,769

    Re: Do You Personally Believe Spending Money is Speech?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Money is not speech nor an extension of speech. Money is nothing more than a tool that people use to promote their speech.
    If money is a tool that people use to promote their speech, then the speech they practice can't be independent of the money that they spend.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

Page 11 of 13 FirstFirst ... 910111213 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •