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Thread: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

  1. #341
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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Ah.... no. Soviet Foreign Policy was to overthrow all non-Soviet governments in an attempt to create a worldwide Communist super-state.



    reminds me of the old paradigm - the Soviets push a lady in front of a bus, the US runs in and pushes her out of the way, and the left accuses both sides of pushing around little old ladies.

    The Soviet Union was an abusive actual Empire based on the eradication of individual and even popular rights and the aggressive expansion of power. To the extent that the US has an empire at all it is one built around trying to bring other nation-states into trade networks with us.

    You want to know what the difference is? Ask the Czechs, the Hungarians. Ask yourself how much you remember about the US invasion of France following that country's decision not to be a part of NATO.
    Good morning, cpwill.

    Your analogy about the little old lady was one of the funniest things I've ever read! Kudos! I've got to remember that one!

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Dude you just blamed the US for the Cold War. If something in the world is going badly you search back only to the point of US involvement and then declare that to somehow be the cause.
    Really now. Was there a Cold War before US involvement??? And are you suggesting as you have with Pearl Harbor, that the US was minding its own business and that the Soviet Union decided to pick a 40 year cold fight with us, is that it.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  3. #343
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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Really now. Was there a Cold War before US involvement??? And are you suggesting as you have with Pearl Harbor, that the US was minding its own business and that the Soviet Union decided to pick a 40 year cold fight with us, is that it.
    It was not the US that built the "Iron Curtain".

    Of course, had the US simply gone back to isolationism and ignored the Soviet Union, then there wouldn't have been a cold war. The Soviets would still have their empire, though, and it would be a lot bigger than it was back in the 1980s.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    It was not the US that built the "Iron Curtain".

    Of course, had the US simply gone back to isolationism and ignored the Soviet Union, then there wouldn't have been a cold war. The Soviets would still have their empire, though, and it would be a lot bigger than it was back in the 1980s.
    At the first UN assembly, with the creation of the Atomic Energy Commission, the US argued for regulation of nuclear weapons while the Soviet Union argued for universal disarmament! The US rejected that proposal, and the arms race began.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    At the first UN assembly, with the creation of the Atomic Energy Commission, the US argued for regulation of nuclear weapons while the Soviet Union argued for universal disarmament! The US rejected that proposal, and the arms race began.
    Was that before or after the Soviets developed the bomb?
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

  6. #346
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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Really now. Was there a Cold War before US involvement??? And are you suggesting as you have with Pearl Harbor, that the US was minding its own business and that the Soviet Union decided to pick a 40 year cold fight with us, is that it.
    Churchill's problem was that FDR actually trusted Stalin. Hell, we gave away half of Europe.

    Saying that there was no Cold War before US involvement is also false. The Berliners were the first victims of the Cold War, and the US became involved in order to feed them.

  7. #347
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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Was that before or after the Soviets developed the bomb?
    The Soviets had pretty good information on our program, and were also running a Bio War program that we had no idea about over the course of the entire Cold War, despite loudly stating that they didn't.

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    Was that before or after the Soviets developed the bomb?
    Three years before. The purpose of the creation of the United Nations Atomic Energy Commission was to eliminate the use of nuclear weapons, as I pointed out, the US was totally against that, and the US conducted its first test just 6 months after the end of WW2, over and under a fleet of 90 Japanese ships captured during the war. Since the US was against total disarmament, and was continuing testing and development, why wouldn't the Soviet Union then, as the other super power, rush to development. It was determined that the Soviet Union wouldn't have one developed until the mid 1950's, but they shocked the world with their first detonation in 1949.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Churchill's problem was that FDR actually trusted Stalin. Hell, we gave away half of Europe.

    Saying that there was no Cold War before US involvement is also false. The Berliners were the first victims of the Cold War, and the US became involved in order to feed them.
    The Cold War was essentially an arms race, the assurance of MAD, and multiple proxy wars. You may wish to include Berlin, but that's pretty much not related to the Cold War and arms race.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Thoughts on Presidents Speech about ISIS and US Actions?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Three years before. The purpose of the creation of the United Nations Atomic Energy Commission was to eliminate the use of nuclear weapons, as I pointed out, the US was totally against that, and the US conducted its first test just 6 months after the end of WW2, over and under a fleet of 90 Japanese ships captured during the war. Since the US was against total disarmament, and was continuing testing and development, why wouldn't the Soviet Union then, as the other super power, rush to development. It was determined that the Soviet Union wouldn't have one developed until the mid 1950's, but they shocked the world with their first detonation in 1949.
    So, the Soviets were all for nuclear disarmament before they had nukes themselves?

    That's not too surprising, now is it?

    And, had the US destroyed its nukes, could we have trusted the Soviet Union not to have made their own? Oh, right, the phrase "trusted the Soviet Union" says it all.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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