View Poll Results: What of the following does the best for eliminating poverty in the world?

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  • Private property.

    55 5.48%
  • Unions.

    315 31.41%
  • Personal liberty.

    69 6.88%
  • Entitlements.

    403 40.18%
  • Taxation

    463 46.16%
  • Freedom from coercion/association.

    52 5.18%
  • Government programs/policies.

    410 40.88%
  • The free market.

    79 7.88%
  • Class struggle.

    14 1.40%
  • Working for oneself.

    59 5.88%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: How is poverty best eliminated?

  1. #451
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Where is the option that poverty will never be eliminated?
    A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    How do you determine that so many are spam votes? And why are non registered members of a forum able to vote in a poll?
    click on the numbers-you will see the names of those who voted all other votes are non members or dishonest members who logged out and voted more than once



  3. #453
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    A leftist thing? No. Poverty is caused by not having money ... that's it.

    The cure for poverty is, would you believe it, ensuring that everyone has wealth. Obviously poverty is then complicated and entrenched by how the lack of wealth causes instability in the affected communities and families; and how it likewise destabilizes individuals' lives (e.g. not being able to afford healthcare = higher susceptibility to disease / work disabilities ) which leads to the cyclical effect of poverty.

    Regardless options in the poll like "personal liberty" or "freedom from coercion/association" or "free markets" while being vitally important for our freedoms, have absolutely nothing to do with eliminating poverty, because they don't address the root cause of poverty: the lack of wealth.
    as a libertarian, what is your solution



  4. #454
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    A leftist thing? No. Poverty is caused by not having money ... that's it.

    The cure for poverty is, would you believe it, ensuring that everyone has wealth. Obviously poverty is then complicated and entrenched by how the lack of wealth causes instability in the affected communities and families; and how it likewise destabilizes individuals' lives (e.g. not being able to afford healthcare = higher susceptibility to disease / work disabilities ) which leads to the cyclical effect of poverty.

    Regardless options in the poll like "personal liberty" or "freedom from coercion/association" or "free markets" while being vitally important for our freedoms, have absolutely nothing to do with eliminating poverty, because they don't address the root cause of poverty: the lack of wealth.
    William Bradford wrote in "Of Plymouth Colony"--a not-all-that-popular account of history--stating how the first colonists were organized on a communal farm. Everybody would work for the colony and everybody would share and share alike in the produce. But for two and a half years there was massive starvation and want because even back then nobody was willing to work and be the sucker when others worked less and received as much. So before the entire colony was wiped out, Bradford saw the error of that plan and reorganized the colonists so that each family was given its own plot of land to work and would keep whatever they grew there. Within one season the farms were flourishing and each family produced more than it needed so that it had produce to trade with their neighbors and with the Indians and were able to celebrate their new prosperity in that iconic first Thanksgiving.

    There is an important lesson to be learned from this story.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  5. #455
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    click on the numbers-you will see the names of those who voted all other votes are non members or dishonest members who logged out and voted more than once
    Ah, okay. I didn't realize it was a public poll. I am more encouraged. Thanks.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  6. #456
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    A leftist thing? No. Poverty is caused by not having money ... that's it.

    The cure for poverty is, would you believe it, ensuring that everyone has wealth. Obviously poverty is then complicated and entrenched by how the lack of wealth causes instability in the affected communities and families; and how it likewise destabilizes individuals' lives (e.g. not being able to afford healthcare = higher susceptibility to disease / work disabilities ) which leads to the cyclical effect of poverty.

    Regardless options in the poll like "personal liberty" or "freedom from coercion/association" or "free markets" while being vitally important for our freedoms, have absolutely nothing to do with eliminating poverty, because they don't address the root cause of poverty: the lack of wealth.
    Poverty is not necessarily a lack of money. Poverty, as it is generally understood, is the lack of food, clothing, shelter and necessities of life. If you have all the money in the world and have not sufficient food, clothing, or shelter to sustain your life and have no way to obtain these, you are poorer than the church mouse who has all that he needs. When personal liberty, free markets, and freedom from coercion promotes the production of food, clothing, shelter--necessities of life--then much more poverty will be eliminated than can ever happen by taking from those who earned what they have and giving it to those who did not earn it.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  7. #457
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Stop all foreign aid, eliminate all forms of welfare and unemployment insurance, make pensions illegal, apply free-market principles to drugs and medical care and, six months later, make slavery legal. You'll eliminate poverty in one generation.
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  8. #458
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    William Bradford wrote in "Of Plymouth Colony"--a not-all-that-popular account of history--stating how the first colonists were organized on a communal farm. Everybody would work for the colony and everybody would share and share alike in the produce. But for two and a half years there was massive starvation and want because even back then nobody was willing to work and be the sucker when others worked less and received as much. So before the entire colony was wiped out, Bradford saw the error of that plan and reorganized the colonists so that each family was given its own plot of land to work and would keep whatever they grew there. Within one season the farms were flourishing and each family produced more than it needed so that it had produce to trade with their neighbors and with the Indians and were able to celebrate their new prosperity in that iconic first Thanksgiving.

    There is an important lesson to be learned from this story.
    That's a great story. However what is the actual evidence there? Such as, for example, a rigorous and systematic study to measure the quantified effectiveness of the colonies' different economic structures and its broader impact on each households’ behavior? Willy Bradford would have never in his dreams been able to produce such evidence-based arguments. So how can we actually trust his conclusions, when they very well could be based on faulty premises like tradition, anecdotes, conventional wisdom or confirmation biases?

    Obviously that's not an argument for communal agrarianism, but it is an argument for doing what is actually proven. Show the evidence. If communal agrarianism had produced the best results beyond whatever Bradford had against it, why not do it?

    Second -- I'm not sure what communal farming has to do with eliminating poverty.

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    as a libertarian, what is your solution
    Pragmatism. As in, do you know how the extreme poverty Millennium Development Goal is being solved right now?

    Countries are implementing safety net programs ("welfare") and putting in place directed programs like conditional cash transfers, where impoverished families are receiving money from the government or NGOs. These programs aren't a panacea for poverty, but they've been shown to be effective by both tackling the lack of wealth (giving money) and the conditions that prevent wealth accumulation (on the condition of regular school attendance).

    Take a read: http://siteresources.worldbank.org/I..._noembargo.pdf
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post




    Pragmatism. As in, do you know how the extreme poverty Millennium Development Goal is being solved right now?

    Countries are implementing safety net programs ("welfare") and putting in place directed programs like conditional cash transfers, where impoverished families are receiving money from the government or NGOs. These programs aren't a panacea for poverty, but they've been shown to be effective by both tackling the lack of wealth (giving money) and the conditions that prevent wealth accumulation (on the condition of regular school attendance).

    Take a read: http://siteresources.worldbank.org/I..._noembargo.pdf
    I think one of the most important steps is to discourage as strongly as possible-irresponsible people from having children. far too many people have children they are unable and/or unable to properly care for and current welfare programs encourage this activity



  10. #460
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    Re: How is poverty best eliminated?

    Quote Originally Posted by brothern View Post
    A leftist thing? No. Poverty is caused by not having money ... that's it.

    The cure for poverty is, would you believe it, ensuring that everyone has wealth. Obviously poverty is then complicated and entrenched by how the lack of wealth causes instability in the affected communities and families; and how it likewise destabilizes individuals' lives (e.g. not being able to afford healthcare = higher susceptibility to disease / work disabilities ) which leads to the cyclical effect of poverty.

    Regardless options in the poll like "personal liberty" or "freedom from coercion/association" or "free markets" while being vitally important for our freedoms, have absolutely nothing to do with eliminating poverty, because they don't address the root cause of poverty: the lack of wealth.
    Greetings, brothern.

    There are more whites living in poverty in this country than any other group, blacks included. To assume that it is a racial thing which only affects blacks is incorrect, since it is probably more accurate to state that since there are more whites than blacks in this country, it is statistically more likely that the percentage of whites living in poverty is greater than any other group, which happens to be true.

    Secondly, how could anyone ensure that everyone has wealth? If that were possible, it would have been done long ago. There are only five ways that I can think of to have wealth 1) earn it by working and investing wisely; 2) inherit it; 3) steal it; 4) come up with a new product that everyone wants or needs, ie become an entrepreneur and/or an inventor, or 5) win the lottery. Of the five, the first choice is most likely for the majority of people, no matter what color you are, which means you do not drop out of school, and you go on to college to get a higher education - or you go to school to learn a trade like plumber, electrician, etc, or you are skilled enough to become sports star. It is being responsible for your own life choices - nothing more.

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