View Poll Results: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

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  • 0-2 years

    10 31.25%
  • 3-4 years

    7 21.88%
  • 5-6 years

    7 21.88%
  • 7-8 years

    1 3.13%
  • 9-10 years

    4 12.50%
  • 11-15 years

    0 0%
  • 16-20 years

    0 0%
  • 21-25 years

    0 0%
  • 26+

    0 0%
  • Never

    3 9.38%
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Thread: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

  1. #41
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    I was specifically asking about GAY marriage. Are you for bigamy/polygamy as well? If not, why?
    Gay marriage isn't any more related to those issues than interracial marriage was. Is there a reason you feel it necessary to link gay marriage to polygamy?
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  2. #42
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) yes they SHOULD, because its an equal rights issue, states dont get to infringe on equal rights and when they do they are correct eventually. SO the FED is not inserting themselves the states overstepping is the issue and the fed is doing exactly what it should.
    2.) correct
    3.) this is how our government is designed, its not mob rule and states dont get to step on individual rights, the Constitution is the highest law.
    4.) only to those that falsely think this is a states rights issue, which it is not.

    Actually our government was designed to give states the most say on issues of individual rights. If you'll remember initially the Bill of Rights wasn't binding on the states and wasn't made binding until the early 20th century. The Federal government by design wasn't given a whole lot of power over the states - though they have over the years marginalized the states.

    The point is debatable. Having the Federal government, through SCOTUS, impose its will on the states has a downside in that it just pushes the states that much closer to being nothing more than a taxing authority. Like it or not Federal overreach is a legitimate and serious concern. I'd be much happier if the Feds just stayed out of it and let the states work it out. They all will eventually recognize SSM - it's inevitable.
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  3. #43
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    Actually our government was designed to give states the most say on issues of individual rights. If you'll remember initially the Bill of Rights wasn't binding on the states and wasn't made binding until the early 20th century. The Federal government by design wasn't given a whole lot of power over the states - though they have over the years marginalized the states.

    The point is debatable. Having the Federal government, through SCOTUS, impose its will on the states has a downside in that it just pushes the states that much closer to being nothing more than a taxing authority. Like it or not Federal overreach is a legitimate and serious concern. I'd be much happier if the Feds just stayed out of it and let the states work it out. They all will eventually recognize SSM - it's inevitable.
    And since the original Bill of Rights, we have added more. In fact, we had a Civil War pertaining to this issue. The states lost, giving more rights essentially to the individuals, and protecting those rights on a federal level. We should not give up our individual rights to tyrannies of the states.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  4. #44
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    And since the original Bill of Rights, we have added more. In fact, we had a Civil War pertaining to this issue. The states lost, giving more rights essentially to the individuals, and protecting those rights on a federal level. We should not give up our individual rights to tyrannies of the states.
    I am well aware of that. I was pointing out the original intent of the framers was to design a system where the states had a much larger role in individual rights issues.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

  5. #45
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    I am well aware of that. I was pointing out the original intent of the framers was to design a system where the states had a much larger role in individual rights issues.
    Except many did not intend this. There were huge divides in which should have more power, states or federal. The issue comes in that just because a government is smaller in comparison to another does not mean that it cares about the people or their rights more, nor should people have to move out of their state in order to enjoy their rights. This is the premise of the 14th Amendment. The framers realized that times would change and that some of the things they put into our government would not work in the long run, which is why we do have the ability to change the US Constitution but it is not done on a whim.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  6. #46
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    1.)Actually our government was designed to give states the most say on issues of individual rights. If you'll remember initially the Bill of Rights wasn't binding on the states and wasn't made binding until the early 20th century. The Federal government by design wasn't given a whole lot of power over the states - though they have over the years marginalized the states.
    2.)The point is debatable.
    3.)Having the Federal government, through SCOTUS, impose its will on the states has a downside in that it just pushes the states that much closer to being nothing more than a taxing authority.
    4.)Like it or not Federal overreach is a legitimate and serious concern.
    5.)I'd be much happier if the Feds just stayed out of it and let the states work it out.
    6.)They all will eventually recognize SSM - it's inevitable.
    1.) so my statement is true that is how its design, thanks
    2.) its not unless you want to debate an entirely different topic about origins/beginnings/meanings/interpretations
    3.) in this case thier(SCOTUS) will is not what is being imposed, equal rights and the Constitution is being protected and that doesnt hurt that states at all. States rights remain intact and aren't even scratched by this.
    4.) I agree 100% and again if thats the topic you would like to talk about feel free to find a thread that is about that, fed overreach is not an issue here at all. Protecting individual rights and the constitution is not an overreach at all its exactly what they should do. The state has been found to be doing the overreach similar to minority rights, women rights and interracial marriage.
    5.) you are welcome to have that opinion but the states dont get to work this out, its beyond thier power.
    6.) I agree and its a shame that there are states that choose to get in the way of freedom and rights and infringe on them
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  7. #47
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by AGENT J View Post
    1.) so my statement is true that is how its design, thanks
    That's what it's become, not the way it was designed, but I guess I'm being overly nitpicky.

    We both want the same thing J and I couldn't be happier that NY recognized SSM. We just disagree on how to get there.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

  8. #48
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    I'm actually going to go with "never". I don't think it will ever take a federal ruling from the supreme court. I don't think they'll take any appeals on the subject, either. If they do, it will be long after every district has already ruled that SSM bans don't meet a rational basis test (which should be, as the OP suggests, within the next few years), and some state is trying to use a backdoor restriction. If there is a supreme court ruling, it won't be for the legitimacy of SSM itself, but rather on the level of protection it requires, which I expect would be intermediate scrutiny. However, such backdoor restrictions likewise may not make it up to the supreme court, or may never happen, so I'm sticking with never. I don't think it will ever require a national ruling.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

  9. #49
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I'm actually going to go with "never". I don't think it will ever take a federal ruling from the supreme court. I don't think they'll take any appeals on the subject, either. If they do, it will be long after every district has already ruled that SSM bans don't meet a rational basis test (which should be, as the OP suggests, within the next few years), and some state is trying to use a backdoor restriction. If there is a supreme court ruling, it won't be for the legitimacy of SSM itself, but rather on the level of protection it requires, which I expect would be intermediate scrutiny. However, such backdoor restrictions likewise may not make it up to the supreme court, or may never happen, so I'm sticking with never. I don't think it will ever require a national ruling.
    Do you think that SSM will be recognized at the federal level to receive those benefits, subject to fed taxation, legal protections, etc?
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  10. #50
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    Re: Same Sex Marriage, how long till its national?

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    When did gay marriage become a right? Dates, please.
    Life liberty happiness

    I'll check down gay marriage as part of all three
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