View Poll Results: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

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Thread: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

  1. #21
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Aren't convicts transferred from state facilities when a private prison prison takes over?
    State facilities continue to exist and the quota is satisfied by a transfer of inmates. Would you agree to build and staff a private prison when the state might only provide a handful of customers? The state could build a new facility and your entire investment is lost.

    The quota in no way affects arrests or convictions. There are plenty of state facilities from which to satisfy the contract. If the state operates at less than capacity, that's the state's loss. As the state does not have a profit motive, this is the most reasonable way to provide security for the investment required.

  2. #22
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    State facilities continue to exist and the quota is satisfied by a transfer of inmates. Would you agree to build and staff a private prison when the state might only provide a handful of customers? The state could build a new facility and your entire investment is lost.
    I oppose the idea of outsourcing prisons to private companies.There are certain functions that should only be the duty of the government and corrections is one of those.

    The quota in no way affects arrests or convictions. There are plenty of state facilities from which to satisfy the contract. If the state operates at less than capacity, that's the state's loss. As the state does not have a profit motive, this is the most reasonable way to provide security for the investment required.
    These contracts with lock up quotas have penalties built in if states do not meet the minimum occupancy rate.So the state does have a financial incentive to make sure the private prisons are full.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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  3. #23
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    I oppose the idea of outsourcing prisons to private companies.There are certain functions that should only be the duty of the government and corrections is one of those.
    A reasonable position. I disagree. I believe things done by the government are more efficiently accomplished in the free market, with the exception of a military and other issues directly of national security concern.

    These contracts with lock up quotas have penalties built in if states do not meet the minimum occupancy rate.So the state does have a financial incentive to make sure the private prisons are full.
    The state satisfies the quota by transferring inmates from state institutions and operating, itself, at less than capacity.

    Surely you understand that millions of dollars in investment needs to have some kind of security. The quota/transfer system allows the state to provide that investment security without creating an incentive for arrests and convictions.

  4. #24
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Absolutely illegal, unless to fulfill their "quotas" the private prison admins, lobbyists, and stockholders are locked up

  5. #25
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    A reasonable position. I disagree. I believe things done by the government are more efficiently accomplished in the free market, with the exception of a military and other issues directly of national security concern.



    The state satisfies the quota by transferring inmates from state institutions and operating, itself, at less than capacity.

    Surely you understand that millions of dollars in investment needs to have some kind of security. The quota/transfer system allows the state to provide that investment security without creating an incentive for arrests and convictions.
    If you think there's no incentive for the for profit prison lobby to pursue outrageous laws and sentences, you don't understand corporations at all. They will push for those laws *in addition to* demanding that state run prisons transfer their inmates. They'll charge obscene fees for inmate phone calls or visitors, enraging their loved ones whose only crime was knowing them.

    The prison lobby was all over racial profiling in arizona and i'm frankly unable to look up other examples. Too sickened by the idea of any "justice system", let alone ours, being whored out to and at the mercy of profit margin. What do you think will happen when prisons are entirely privatized? We're already at the point of having more prisoners than stalin's gulag.

  6. #26
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    If you think there's no incentive for the for profit prison lobby to pursue outrageous laws and sentences, you don't understand corporations at all. They will push for those laws *in addition to* demanding that state run prisons transfer their inmates. They'll charge obscene fees for inmate phone calls or visitors, enraging their loved ones whose only crime was knowing them.

    The prison lobby was all over racial profiling in arizona and i'm frankly unable to look up other examples. Too sickened by the idea of any "justice system", let alone ours, being whored out to and at the mercy of profit margin. What do you think will happen when prisons are entirely privatized? We're already at the point of having more prisoners than stalin's gulag.
    I know people that have been to prisons, and the private ones have way better facilities and programs. For the minor inconvenience of transferring enough inmates from state facilities, the state makes use of these improved, modern and economically efficient facilities.

    And please, let's not drone on about the evils of corporations until we've had a job or two.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 11-06-14 at 07:19 PM.

  7. #27
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I know people that have been to prisons, and the private ones have way better facilities and programs. For the minor inconvenience of transferring enough inmates from state facilities, the state makes use of these improved, modern and efficient facilities.

    And please, let's not drone on about the evils of corporations until we've had a job or two.
    Yeah right, where's the profit in it for them *and* the cost saving for the state if they aren't cutting programs or adding fees beyond what's necessary? Or demanding additional "customers" by way of new laws?

    And if there is such a path, why can't the state accomplish the same in its own prisons?

  8. #28
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Or demanding additional "customers" by way of new laws?
    Hysterical CT.

    There are more than enough inmates in state facilities to satisfy quotas (the only way to provide investment security) simply by transfers and operating, itself, at less than capacity. There is no incentive for additional arrests or convictions.

    I think you need to read the thread (particularly, my posts). You're just inventing nonsense about why and how this is done.

  9. #29
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    Absolutely no prisons should ever be privately owned.


    I say this because I can see far too many opportunities for abuse in privatizing such things.


    Edit: Then again...there's a ****load of abuse opportunities if they're publicly owned.
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  10. #30
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    Re: Should occupancy rates/lock-up quotas for private prisons be illegal?

    This is a very dangerous concept. A prison-industrial complex is every bit as dangerous as a military-industrial complex. It could eventually evolve into the vast majority of the population being imprisoned on frivolous and trumped up charges--in other words slaves that could be leased out from and to the minority of elites who run the state and the system.

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