View Poll Results: What do you think about the economic situation in the US?

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  • Everything is completely falling apart, there is nothing we can do now.

    4 10.53%
  • Everything is falling apart fast, if we act fast we can stop a collapse.

    5 13.16%
  • Its dier, we need to do something quickly.

    4 10.53%
  • Bush is the cause of this decline, he must resign now.

    4 10.53%
  • The dollar will do the work, everything will even out over time.

    5 13.16%
  • We will manage it, but it will take time and missery.

    9 23.68%
  • Its alright, shouldnt be to difficult to fix.

    0 0%
  • Everything is fine as it is.

    3 7.89%
  • Other.. (explain)

    2 5.26%
  • Everything is the fault of John Kerry..

    2 5.26%
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Thread: The fall of the dollar..

  1. #21
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    I have never seen someone get owned in a thread this bad, and still continue on....You are either very stubborn, or you got alot of heart Maximus......
    hate is a powerful emotion.

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  2. #22
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    I have never seen someone get owned in a thread this bad, and still continue on....You are either very stubborn, or you got alot of heart Maximus......
    Personally I think he's the Rocky Balboa of anti-Americanism. "It's not how hard you hit, its how hard you can get hit and keep movin' forward and makin stuff up"
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
    I never thought infanticide could be so delicious.

  3. #23
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Trajan Octavian Titus View Post
    Umm you have no idea what you're talking about the U.S. increased the money supply which decreased the value and our interest rates.



    What effect does the trade deficit have on the value of currency exactly?



    Where are you getting this stuff from?



    Your grasp of the economy is starteling, tell me have you ever heard of the service industry? The U.S. is a service based economy, and the trade deficit has nothing to do with the value of currency, the U.S. has intentionally decreased the value of its currency by increasing the money supply in order to lower interest rates. Infact as Friedman would have it a large trade deficit is actually a signal that the currency of a nation is strong and desirable infact a trade deficit is a good thing in that it implies that consumers have an opportunity to buy more goods at lower prices that otherwise they would not get to consume, and inversely a trade surplus implies that a country is exporting goods its own citizens did not get while paying higher prices for goods that they actually did receive.
    Maybe its time to do some more economic research? Perhaps you should take some kind of course in basic economics.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

  4. #24
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    I have never seen someone get owned in a thread this bad, and still continue on....You are either very stubborn, or you got alot of heart Maximus......
    Yeah, because debating is like American wrestling.
    Europe is illegally occupied by the US

  5. #25
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Maybe its time to do some more economic research? Perhaps you should take some kind of course in basic economics.
    I've taken Macro and Micro and read alot about the subject so much so that I know the trade deficit has nothing to do with the value of currency and that the value of currency is determined by the amount of money supply and the size of the GDP.

  6. #26
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Trajan Octavian Titus View Post
    I've taken Macro and Micro and read alot about the subject so much so that I know the trade deficit has nothing to do with the value of currency and that the value of currency is determined by the amount of money supply and the size of the GDP.
    Have to agree with TOT there.

  7. #27
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Iriemon View Post
    Have to agree with TOT there.
    And that right there is how absolutely off base you are Max.
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
    I never thought infanticide could be so delicious.

  8. #28
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by RightOfCenter View Post
    And that right there is how absolutely off base you are Max.
    It is in times like this that I am forced to....

    Ring* Ring*

    **Hatuey picks up his phone.

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    "But moma..."

    "Yes baby I know, it's not right but when a man is wrong he's wrong. He has to accept it."

    "I know moma, but..."

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    "Love ya son"

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    As I was saying...

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    "Hatuey...get yo lil black *** off the thread."

    "I'm sorry moma!"

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    Gotta go.
    Peace is a lie. There is only Passion. Through Passion I gain Strength. Through Strength I gain Power. Through Power I gain Victory. Through Victory my chains are Broken. The Force shall free me.

  9. #29
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Iriemon View Post
    Have to agree with TOT there.
    I think I need a shower.

  10. #30
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    Re: The fall of the dollar..

    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    What can you get for 1$ in the US? Just for comparison to Europe and 1€.
    What about 10$?
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    That which you quoted is a very good thing..This is the bad thing.. Its actually a good thing, but it will feel like a bad thing when US inflation is at an exceptional high level.Luck, yeah sure.. Thats why everything started looking good a time after Clinton entered office, and imrpoved as long as he was there..Then Bush came to office and lowered taxes and introduced economical madness and neglect. Everytihing pointed downwards and the relative US economy has gone backwards during the Bush term. EXCEPT Gdp per capita that has just slowed down, but not decreased.I dont know, he can have a responsible fiscal policy, spend things on healthy issues instead of wars for example.. Since 2000, the US have spent about 200 billion a year extra in everage on war and the military. Now this over say 6 years since we exclude 2000, is about 1.2 trillion$ that could have been spent better.. Now that is half a US government spending.. Us government spending for your information is around 2.5 trillion$ annually. Th US GDP is over 10 trillion, yes..Now, dont you think a president have some power over the economy?1. No its not, its 1/10th of government budget/spending. Imagine if that money was spent on social issues instead, the US would look completely different today. Imagine if that money was spent to subsidise renewable energy or environmental friendly technology.. Things would be completely different..
    2. Not corporate welfare, corporate insentives.. Imagine GM getting paid to switch from fossil to environmental friendly energy in their cars..just one example there of possibly millions. Now, what could 250 billion do in R&D?3. I never said that.Fair enough, but the president shouldt have asked congress for so much extra on war and military.Basically, yes it has.. But mostly it has apreciated against the dollar which is our main export market. Of course the Euro value matters greatly.. Any given thing now bought from the US is about 50% cheaper than it was at the low point of the Euro. Big difference between 1€ being worth 1.35$ and one that is only worth 0.8$ which it was at the lowest point.Lol, perhaps you should try to understand what i am actually saying the instead of giving me that award because of your lack of knowledge.What you have to understand is that the world is now a two(big) currency market, not 1 like it has been since the 1970s. This is a HUGE difference. GDP and numbers have always been compared in USD, they still are. And when the Euro fluctuate against the dollar, this doesnt mean that nothing happens like you wish. It means an appreciation of the whole European economy, and a decline of the US economy. Remember those 850 billion$ annually the US is strugelling with? The relationship between that, the value of the dollar and the value of the Euro and the Euro area difference is all related.
    The REAL value of the dollar is shown when the dollar reach that level that will even out imports and export. That is the REAL/Natural value of the dollar against other currencies. The two currency market has brought huge changes to the whole world economy that it makes this MUCH more obvious and visible, before the US could basically maniupate the dollar like they wanted. Now they cannot anymore, and it means the US economy will be valued in REAL terms against other economies when the dollar hits its natural value..The Euro is at natural value, because Eurozone imports and exports have a difference of about 0 annually. +- a few billions.
    The Pound is overvalued the same way the dollar is.Lets theoretically say that the REAL value of the dollar is 1.65$ = 1€.. The real value again is when Imports and exports in the US have no difference in value, thats when the dollar is "correctly" valued.. Now.. The EU economy was 10.9 trillion € after Romania and Bulgaria joined, which was start of 2007. The dollar VS the €uro at the time was something like 1.25. That means the EU economy was worth 13.625 trillion $, this is because for comparison economists use the dollar(i could also use the € to demonstrate the exact same thing). With a value that is 1.65 dollars for 1 Euro, the EU economy would be valued at 18 trillion $.. So in reality, the dollar was just overvalued the whole time, and the European economy if measured in the REAL dollar value is something like 18 trillion$..Now, here is the clue why this is so... Im not saying production in the EU all of the sudden raised 5 trillion. I am just saying that the valuation of that production has changed, and thats very important in a market with two large currencies that have to fit imports and exports of the representative countries.
    But the Eurozone is not the whole EU economy, it only represent about 90% of it.. But anyways, the numbers are pretty accurate. And the case would be the same, just -10%.But, I guess, you Americans just want to keep measuring everyting in 2000 value dollars..
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Its not certain, but when demand will remain, prices hike and supply dry out, the demand will follow, or the US economy have to compensate somehow.. This would probably be to produce more of that stuff you need back home instead, but that isnt done overnight.. So then your dollar keeps falling, prices for your imports go up, and you have to pay more for the same.. Now, how is that not going to affect inflation?You have this wonderful tendency to ignore what I am REALLY saying and misunderstand my messages.. Of course Clinton was single handedly responsible for the US 1990s economic miracle.. No one else was, just and ONLY Clinton did that alone.. He wouldnt even need a US population or companies, he could do all that alone.Because wasteful spending is wasteful spending, and you have absolutely no understanding of how much have been wasted during the Bush term.. So someone have to tell you..again you try as best you can to misunderstand and you succeed in that..Everything matters in the economy, short term and long term..I didnt say it was a bad thing for the US economy.. I said it was the right thing for the US economy. Maybe you should actually tart reading my posts?? Of course there are, but there are only two major ones, just 10 years ago there was only 1 major currency.. There are two major ones and five important ones.. The major ones are the dollar and the Euro, the important ones besides those are the Yen, the Pound and the Swizz Franc.But its still a two currency market, before it was a one currency market.Im not saying the Euro will destroy the US economy.. I am just saying its great for US and that our economy just will be so much more appreciated, and correctly appreciated against the US economy when the US dollar hits its REAL value.No its not, the REAL value of the currency is when export and imports are about equal.. What you are talking about is market value..Dont come here and tell me that the real value of google who have a revenue of 5 billion is 400 billion just because the stock market says so.. Thats the market value, not the real value.. In the end, the market value will ALWAYS become more and more the same as the REAL value.In the US, the market tends to overvalue things, while in Europe its valued pretty REAL. In China its undervalued just like their currency..The REAL value of the Chinese ramibi like the dollar is when exports and imports in China is about equal. So currently the Chinese currency is undervalued while the dollar is overvalued. US trade deficit with Europe is about 90 billion€ every year, this means that the US have to adjust the dollar to make that around 0.. And then China have to adjust their currency to reduce European trade deficit(and at the same time US trade deficit)..So actually the best thing would be if both China and US changed their currencies around the Euro, as this would be the easiest way to reach the REAL value..Do you btw understand the concept of GDP ppp and GDP? and how this is related to currencies? The Chinese if they revalue their currency to a REAL value their economy is an 8 trillion $ economy and not a 2 trillion dollar economy like it is now.. Are you saying that such a change is irrelevant and that it should always be measured in 2000 value dollars?The US economy is overvalued, the Chinese one is undervalued..The US dollar is falling, and revaluing the US economy against mainly the European economy at the same time.. The European economy is appreciated, the US depreciated.. Now the last step is to appreciate the Chinese economy a whole 400% and that is the Chinese currency that needs to do this..It will all fit in the end man, but you obviously dont understand the concept of REAL value..I just know that if I was American I would surely put some of my savings in other currencies as well, especially the Euro and the Swizz Franc. Setting them in the Chinese currency is a risk, but could potentially double your money twice if the Chinese currency is correctly revalued.Every economy in the world is now appreciating in comparison to the US.. Think of it as a slowly bursting dot-com bubble. Its not that the Euro is appreciating the most that is the point. The point here is that the US economy is depreciated.. Its difficult to see the big picture in this, especially for a US patriot, but your economy is undergoing a HUGE decline as we speak.Yeah, I prefer that too, but you know the funny thing, usually the market will always realize the REAL value of things, like they are doing now with the US economy..Ps. If you have any stocks in google I would suggest slowly selling them off now, before the market realize the real value of it and burst it like the dot-com market.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post



    The dollar isnt undervalued, its still way overvalued. You can see that by the differences in exports and imports. China have an undervalued currency, and you can also see that in exports and imports differences.
    In dollar terms the Chinese economy is still just 2 trillion, while the real value is about 8 trillion.Now, this means the Chinese economy is seriously undervalued while the US economy is overvalued. So in reality, when the dollar and the Ramibi his the right values, it will be like this.US economy 13.5 trillion $Chinese economy 8 trillion $
    Eurozone economy 16 trillion $
    EU economy 19 trillion $

    Thats when the euro hits 1.65 against the dollar.. Thats about the time US exports and imports should approximately equal.Well, the petro age is over.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Yeah, you guys in the US are too pussy to handle any real competition, so you let the value of the dollar fall and make the US economy smaller and smaller compared to the Euro economy.
    The US economy is shrinking against almost all economies..
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Maybe its time to do some more economic research? Perhaps you should take some kind of course in basic economics.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maximus Zeebra View Post
    Yeah, because debating is like American wrestling.
    I am sorry!
    did you say something?

    Human Taxidermist - - now offering his services for all your loved ones
    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

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