View Poll Results: What's the best indicator(s) of the success/failure of the "war on poverty"?

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57. You may not vote on this poll
  • How much money is allocated to social programs and welfare

    5 8.77%
  • Helping the most people possible live more comfortably regardless of their income or lack of it

    4 7.02%
  • By how many people are actually able to get out of poverty

    48 84.21%
  • Other

    9 15.79%
  • Death Star

    3 5.26%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: "War on Poverty"

  1. #111
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by joG View Post
    (1) It is the people that chose the cheap t-shirts over the expensive ones made inthe USA or the foreign car for price or price, as the case may be.

    (2) Actually, I have thought about the different issues involving the Gini coefficient, redistribution, global allocation processes and all that a number of times and relatively thoroughly. And it might be that the people lacking the formal education to understand what happened get angry, when the development has been globally so positive. It is a pity, though, that the USA has been so far in the lead and the main carrier of the load, while their competitors gained relatively from the closing wealth gap.

    I agree we've done much better than the Media or population in general realizes, a lot of that is due to their inability to appreciate how much less there was in the past. But we had some qualities (depth, physical activity) the current generations don't have, as a result of less focus on the superficial love of materialism and distraction of technology.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  2. #112
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    If the poor are so lazy, then why are so many Chinese and Indians making products? They're growing out of poverty.





    The FED can't pump money into the stock market indefinitely and the gov't can't run the debt up to the stars. Something has got to give. We've become a service oriented country and don't have a large production force anymore, especially with technology taking more and more jobs.

    Also, humanity is growing the population and raising their standard of living beyond what the planet's environment can ultimately sustain. The southern border problem (masses of poor), European Austerity, Middle East, Russia, Asian threats are all about struggling for economic resources. Now we've got a cauldron of incurable diseases cropping up from intercontinental travel.
    I agree with your comments about the Fed and Government spending.

    As to humanity, we've barely scratched the surface on what is, and will become, available to us. The challenges faced by struggling nations aren't the result of population, but the result of poor choices in the face of reality. They will self correct, because that is how nature works. Humans have survived plague and all sorts of other threats, and will do so into the eons that are to come.

  3. #113
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    If the poor are so lazy, then why are so many Chinese and Indians making products? They're growing out of poverty.
    What do the Chinese and Indians have to do with the failed liberal war on poverty? The entire premise of marxism was to end the poverty of the working class, how'd that work out?

    You aren't hearing what Im saying-your ideology conceals reality. You are hearing your discredited leftist dogma. The Chinese and Indians are making products because they have figured out that capitalist free market principles deliver people from poverty.

    When you start with the fundamentally flawed assertion that equality of outcomes is the goal, you are dooming yourself to failure-that hasn't happened anywhere, ever-because thats not how life works.Decades of discredited marxist policies only brought them famine, and strife-the same conclusion that european marxists figured out a few decades before.


    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    The FED can't pump money into the stock market indefinitely and the gov't can't run the debt up to the stars. Something has got to give. We've become a service oriented country and don't have a large production force anymore, especially with technology taking more and more jobs.
    Thats nice but again it has nothing to do with the war on poverty-which was started around the same time we moved off the silver standard. In any case, a free market should be allowed to adapt, rather than using govt handouts to achieve the screwed up liberal notion of fairness.

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    Also, humanity is growing the population and raising their standard of living beyond what the planet's environment can ultimately sustain. The southern border problem (masses of poor), European Austerity, Middle East, Russia, Asian threats are all about struggling for economic resources. Now we've got a cauldron of incurable diseases cropping up from intercontinental travel.
    What/Who is "humanity" in this context? This is about different groups of people making different choices which logically lead to different outcomes-some work, some dont. This isn't about compassion-if it was you wouldn't support it or our failed govt schools. This is the silly amorphous crap the left likes to hide behind. Whats humane about millions of unskilled poor dependent on welfare. Whats humane about forcibly taking from some to buy the votes of others? What works? Capitalism.

    What does not work? Handouts to keep people subservient and dependent. Whats the most f'd up is you CLAIM to want to help the poor, but when shown incontrovertible evidence that freebies dont help you stick to your marxist guns. Thats because helping the poor is only a pretext-a pretext to control and partisan ideology. If it wan't you'd be leading the charge to implement what works-but you wont. Drop the appeals to emotion-this is too important to pretend.

  4. #114
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Paul Ryan has lived off the government TEAt his entire life.
    None of your diversions to Obama and Hillary will change that FACT .
    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Paul Ryans first job was at McDonalds, and he worked for a construction company.

    Tell us about Obama and Hillary's jobs.
    Physics is Phun

  5. #115
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Paul Ryan has lived off the government TEAt his entire life.
    None of your diversions to Obama and Hillary will change that FACT .
    Actually, the conversation is about the relative success/failure of the war on poverty and how to evaluate that. Talking about Ryan attending elementary school and walking on sidewalks to get there and breathing air provided by the US government are the distractions.
    The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.
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  6. #116
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    I agree with your comments about the Fed and Government spending.

    As to humanity, we've barely scratched the surface on what is, and will become, available to us. The challenges faced by struggling nations aren't the result of population, but the result of poor choices in the face of reality. They will self correct, because that is how nature works. Humans have survived plague and all sorts of other threats, and will do so into the eons that are to come.
    I guarantee the problems with energy, food, fresh water, real estate and other resources, including pollution, dwindling animal species and rain forests are all due to population. I do believe we'll be forced back into a natural balance thru a retraction, and that's going to happen before we expand into a far greater number. The pressures from our crumbling systems and environmental stresses are already showing.



    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    What do the Chinese and Indians have to do with the failed liberal war on poverty? The entire premise of marxism was to end the poverty of the working class, how'd that work out?

    You aren't hearing what Im saying-your ideology conceals reality. You are hearing your discredited leftist dogma. The Chinese and Indians are making products because they have figured out that capitalist free market principles deliver people from poverty.

    When you start with the fundamentally flawed assertion that equality of outcomes is the goal, you are dooming yourself to failure-that hasn't happened anywhere, ever-because thats not how life works.Decades of discredited marxist policies only brought them famine, and strife-the same conclusion that european marxists figured out a few decades before.




    Thats nice but again it has nothing to do with the war on poverty-which was started around the same time we moved off the silver standard. In any case, a free market should be allowed to adapt, rather than using govt handouts to achieve the screwed up liberal notion of fairness.



    What/Who is "humanity" in this context? This is about different groups of people making different choices which logically lead to different outcomes-some work, some dont. This isn't about compassion-if it was you wouldn't support it or our failed govt schools. This is the silly amorphous crap the left likes to hide behind. Whats humane about millions of unskilled poor dependent on welfare. Whats humane about forcibly taking from some to buy the votes of others? What works? Capitalism.

    What does not work? Handouts to keep people subservient and dependent. Whats the most f'd up is you CLAIM to want to help the poor, but when shown incontrovertible evidence that freebies dont help you stick to your marxist guns. Thats because helping the poor is only a pretext-a pretext to control and partisan ideology. If it wan't you'd be leading the charge to implement what works-but you wont. Drop the appeals to emotion-this is too important to pretend.

    Denying the truth doesn't make it untrue. You're emotionally thrashing about in the minutia, which gets you nowhere towards seeing the problem in a way that it can be solved. All you want to do is use the issues to point fingers and label blame for an ego boost, rather than actually come up with any realistic solutions.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

  7. #117
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    I don't see a "War on Poverty", I see a "War for Money".
    …and votes.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  8. #118
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by NIMBY View Post
    Paul Ryan has lived off the government TEAt his entire life.
    None of your diversions to Obama and Hillary will change that FACT .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Ryan
    I've just proven your comment factually incorrect, sir.

  9. #119
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by US Conservative View Post
    Paul Ryan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    I've just proven your comment factually incorrect, sir.
    Which part because, judging by that Wiki article, Paul Ryan has never held a non-political job in his life. He's never been employed in the private sector. He's a lifetime public teat-sucker.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  10. #120
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    Re: "War on Poverty"

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Which part because, judging by that Wiki article, Paul Ryan has never held a non-political job in his life. He's never been employed in the private sector. He's a lifetime public teat-sucker.
    I really do not think that is a good qualification. I would not automatically exclude professional politicians from the top job. But I would mistrust them and certainly want to examine why such inexperience should not be dangerous.

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