View Poll Results: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

Voters
15. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    4 26.67%
  • No

    8 53.33%
  • Don't know/maybe

    3 20.00%
Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

  1. #1
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Yes
    No
    Don't know


    If the government can do this then why should any digital evidence provided by the government be trusted in any trial?




    What Exactly Are the Spy Agencies Actually DOING with their Bag of Dirty Tricks? Washington's Blog
    TOOLS AND POTENTIAL MISUSES

    Here are the actual dirty tricks in the British spy agencies toolkit, with hypothetical examples of potential misuses …
    CHANGELING: Ability to spoof any email address and send email under that identity. Fake an email from a privacy advocate to make it look like he’s proposing terrorism.

    SCRAPHEAP CHALLENGE: Perfect spoofing of emails from Blackberry targets. Fake an email from an opponent of bailouts to the giant banks to make it look like she’s planning to bomb a bank.

    BURLESQUE: The capacity to send spoofed SMS messages. Fake a message from an an anti-war writer to make it look like he’s planning to sabotage a military base.

    IMPERIAL BARGE : For connecting two target phone together in a call. Fake a telephone connection to make it look like a critic of the president’s policies spoke with a leader of Al Qaeda.

    BADGER : Mass delivery of email messaging to support an Information Operations campaign. Send out a fake, mass email pretending to be from a prominent whistleblower “admitting” that he’s mentally unstable, disgruntled, dishonest, vindictive and a Russian spy.

    WARPATH: Mass delivery of SMS messages to support an Information Operations campaign. Send out a fake, mass message from a targeted group calling for the murder of all Christians and Jews.

    SPACE ROCKET: A programme covering insertion of media into target networks. Insert a video of underage girls on a whistleblower website.

    CLEAN SWEEP Masquerade Facebook Wall Posts for individuals or entire countries. Put up a bunch of fake wall posts calling for jihad on the Facebook page of a reporter giving first-hand reports of what’s really happening in a country that the U.S. has targeted for regime change.

    HAVOK Real-time website cloning technique allowing on-the-fly alterations. Hack the website of a state politician who insists the government must respect the Constitution, and post fake demands for a violent march on Washington, D.C.

    SILVERLORD: Disruption of video-based websites hosting extremist content through concerted target discovery and content removal. Disrupt websites hosting videos espousing libertarian views.

    SUNBLOCK: Ability to deny functionality to send/receive email or view material online. Block emails to reporters and the web functionality of a government insider who is about to go public on wrongdoing.

    ANGRY PIRATE: A tool that will permanently disable a target’s account on their computer. Disable the accounts of a leading opponent of genetically modified foods.

    PREDATORS FACE: Targeted Denial Of Service against Web Servers. Take down a website which is disclosing hard-hitting information on illegal government actions.

    UNDERPASS: Change outcome of online polls. Change the results of an online poll from one showing that the American people overwhelmingly oppose a new war which is unnecessary for the defense of America’s national security to showing support for it.

    GATEWAY: Ability to artificially increase traffic to a website. Make a website calling for more surveillance against the American people appear hugely popular.

    BOMB BAY: The capacity to increase website hits, rankings. Make it look like a site praising praising Al Qaeda is popular among a targeted local population, when the locals actually despise violent Islamic fundamentalists.

    SLIPSTREAM: Ability to inflate page views on websites. Make it appear that an article saying that the Constitution is “outdated” and “unrealistic in the post-9/11 world” is widely popular.

    GESTATOR: Amplification of a given message, normally video, on popular multimedia websites (Youtube). Make a propaganda video – saying that Dear Leader will always help and protect us – go viral.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  2. #2
    Phonetic Mnemonic
    radcen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Look to your right... I'm that guy.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:06 AM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    33,413

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Does the defense have the same ability to present digital evidence?
    If you claim sexual harassment to be wrong, yet you defend anyone on your side for any reason,
    then you are a hypocrite and everything you say on the matter is just babble.

  3. #3
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Does the defense have the same ability to present digital evidence?
    I don't think the average person can spoof a email,msn messages and so on.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  4. #4
    cynical class clown
    Luftwaffe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    CONNECTICUT
    Last Seen
    11-18-17 @ 10:49 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    10,499

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    I want to say yes, but what I mean by "yes" is that it should be allowed but taken with a grain of salt (unfortunately courts strike me as way too technical to allow such a thing) especially if "legitimate" evidence begins to contradict cyber-evidence.
    -----MOS 19D = cavalry scout = best damn MOS there is

  5. #5
    Sporadic insanity normal.


    The Mark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Last Seen
    12-13-17 @ 11:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    19,736

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    I would think that any competent defense lawyer or group would include technical experts to throw doubt on evidence such as this, which can be (apparently) faked.

    IF that is the case, I do not see the issue - indeed, if they could prove evidence was falsified, it would cast doubt not only on that evidence, but on the whole case.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  6. #6
    cynical class clown
    Luftwaffe's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    CONNECTICUT
    Last Seen
    11-18-17 @ 10:49 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    10,499

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I would think that any competent defense lawyer or group would include technical experts to throw doubt on evidence such as this, which can be (apparently) faked.

    IF that is the case, I do not see the issue - indeed, if they could prove evidence was falsified, it would cast doubt not only on that evidence, but on the whole case.
    I actually like that, allow cyber-evidence and proving that cyber-evidence is false can have an extreme backfire on the side that presented it and also cast doubt on what could be the perceived but not actual truth.
    -----MOS 19D = cavalry scout = best damn MOS there is

  7. #7
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    I would think that any competent defense lawyer or group would include technical experts to throw doubt on evidence such as this, which can be (apparently) faked.

    IF that is the case, I do not see the issue - indeed, if they could prove evidence was falsified, it would cast doubt not only on that evidence, but on the whole case.

    How do you prove a email was falsified?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  8. #8
    Sporadic insanity normal.


    The Mark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Pennsylvania
    Last Seen
    12-13-17 @ 11:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    19,736

    Re: Should digital evidence provided by the government be valid in criminal trials?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    How do you prove a email was falsified?
    It would be enough to prove it COULD be falsified, I think.

    I'm no expert, so I have no idea.
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •