View Poll Results: What would you do about the death penalty?

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  • Nothing. It's fine as it's currently practiced.

    6 7.59%
  • Eliminate it completely.

    42 53.16%
  • Modify it. (Explain your answer)

    31 39.24%
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Thread: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

  1. #11
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by MACS-24 View Post
    I vote "modify"
    First, find a way to ensure 99.99% guilt then actually enforce it. As it stands there is no deterrent and has become useless. Instead, redundant 'new' laws are made that usually only affect the innocent for what they "might" do.
    99.99% guilt allows for innocent people to be executed once in a while. Also, how do you prove "99.99% guilt"? Specially when so many cases rely on circumstantial evidence? Scott Peterson's case relied mostly on circumstantial evidence. Timothy McVeigh was convicted because of circumstantial evidence. Is there any doubt as to their guilt? No. But many crimes are proven by a series of arguments that alone mean absolutely nothing. The "smoking gun" isn't always there.
    Last edited by Hatuey; 07-13-14 at 02:55 PM.
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  2. #12
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    99.99% guilt allows for innocent people to be executed once in a while.
    If I said 100%, some one would say "you can't be 100%" (ie kills 99.9% of germs). Thank you sue-nation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    If certain gun guys are insulted by that? Good, they should be ashamed: the rest of US are sick and tired of having our intelligence insulted[/i].



  3. #13
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by MACS-24 View Post
    If I said 100%, some one would say "you can't be 100%" (ie kills 99.9% of germs). Thank you sue-nation.
    Maybe speaking about guilt in terms of percentages is ridiculous to begin with. What percentage of guilt does someone found guilty due to circumstantial evidence have? 100%. What happens when the verdict is overturned because the evidence is later found to be erroneous, falsified or flat out irrelevant? 0%. Guilt is a black and white word, not something which has degrees. You can't be 40% responsible for a charge. You can't be 75% guilty of a crime. You are either found guilty or not guilty of the charges brought against you. 99.99% guilty is nonsense.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

  4. #14
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Ugh. Clicked on modify it when I meant to choose eliminate it (as a penalty).
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Maybe speaking about guilt in terms of percentages is ridiculous to begin with. What percentage of guilt does someone found guilty due to circumstantial evidence have? 100%. What happens when the verdict is overturned because the evidence is later found to be erroneous, falsified or flat out irrelevant? 0%. Guilt is a black and white word, not something which has degrees. You can't be 40% responsible for a charge. You can't be 75% guilty of a crime. You are either found guilty or not guilty of the charges brought against you. 99.99% guilty is nonsense.
    I agree, I was thinking 100% guilty then carrying out penalty, just didn't want to argue the perfect 100 problem. I think incorporating DNA evidence into possible DP charges. It seems it is only used to prove innocence after the fact. We can't abolish death penalty, I think, but as it works now, it's certainly not a deterrent.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    If certain gun guys are insulted by that? Good, they should be ashamed: the rest of US are sick and tired of having our intelligence insulted[/i].



  6. #16
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Other than to improve the reliability of evidence, I'm fine with it as it stands.

  7. #17
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    I agree that too many capital cases get convictions just on circumstantial evidence. I also agree that there have been several instances of states executing the wrong person.

    Both are totally unacceptable, but the system could still be modified to eliminate those possibilities.

    First, if the prosecution plans to seek the death penalty, they must be held to a higher standard of proof. Guilt beyond a "reasonable doubt" is not enough; it should be guilt without a shadow of a doubt. For instance, the killer would likely have to confess, and to provide details that only the person who committed the crime could know.
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Ugh. Clicked on modify it when I meant to choose eliminate it (as a penalty).
    hehe, You just evened the poll out.
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    If certain gun guys are insulted by that? Good, they should be ashamed: the rest of US are sick and tired of having our intelligence insulted[/i].



  9. #19
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    So, have it but never ever use it?? There is never, and I do mean never, zero doubt about a person's guilt. There is always at least a slight chance that your conviction is wrong. Yet another reason why the death penalty is a bad idea. It is especially bad in this corrupted system of "guilty before proven innocent", but it is generally a bad idea in all systems.
    i'm ok with "beyond a reasonable doubt".. which is the current standard.

    i'm also perfectly ok with an appeals and oversight process that objectively analyzes the the verdict , the evidence, and prosecutorial behavior.

  10. #20
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    Re: Would you modify how the death penalty is applied?

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    I agree that too many capital cases get convictions just on circumstantial evidence. I also agree that there have been several instances of states executing the wrong person.

    Both are totally unacceptable, but the system could still be modified to eliminate those possibilities.

    First, if the prosecution plans to seek the death penalty, they must be held to a higher standard of proof. Guilt beyond a "reasonable doubt" is not enough; it should be guilt without a shadow of a doubt. For instance, the killer would likely have to confess, and to provide details that only the person who committed the crime could know.
    I can't see too many confessions except for a few extreme 'suicide by cop' kinda thing
    Quote Originally Posted by jet57 View Post
    If certain gun guys are insulted by that? Good, they should be ashamed: the rest of US are sick and tired of having our intelligence insulted[/i].



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