View Poll Results: Bush vs Obama overall who did a better job on all matters.

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  • bush

    55 41.98%
  • obama

    76 58.02%
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Thread: Bush vs Obama

  1. #21
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    U.S. Constitution was written to govern a frontier society where independence and self-reliance were the order of the day because nothing else could be relied upon. We live in the 21st century and face 21st century threats. The U.S. Constitution is nowhere near equal to the task of governing us anymore. Instead of just getting rid of it and forming a new government and a new constitution the way we should have (at 1860, 1900, and 1945) we've allowed these cancerous growths to form.

    At a certain time, formerly useful legal systems become redundant and must be discarded. Hammurabi's Code has enormous flaws, but the idea of a justice system based on abstract principles there were universal in their application in a society where justice was predicated on family and tribal ties was a great leap forward, echoing from the cradle of civilization across time to work its influence in the laws we enjoy today.
    Too many flaws here to rebut, but if anything has changed over the past two centuries, it is the people, not the Constitution. There is nothing wrong with our governing document when individuals are capable of self-governance. You're placing blame on the wrong entity.

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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Yea, please stop voting.

    I mean really, what a desperately innane and ignorant statement that was.

    That we've had a "strong recovery " since 2008.

    You cant just show up here and make stuff up

    I mean you can, I wouldn't expect anything else from you, but don't think you're not going to get challenged.

    6 years in and we just had a 3 percent contraction in our economy, and thats after 7 Trillion in new structural debt since

    20 Million plus people added to the unemployment roles, and disability rates have more than doubled.

    Labor participation rates are near record lows and there are plenty of PART TIME Positions.

    Poverty rates have increased and more and Americans have neen introduced to chronic unemployment.

    " strong recovery " ? Only in your delsusion driven alternative reality
    Add 50 million on food stamps to your list. These strong recoveries sure ain't what they used to be!

  3. #23
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackstone View Post
    Too many flaws here to rebut, but if anything has changed over the past two centuries, it is the people, not the Constitution. There is nothing wrong with our governing document when individuals are capable of self-governance. You're placing blame on the wrong entity.
    Well, that's just your opinion, man.

    I might ask why you think the U.S. Constitution is so special when none of the Founding Fathers -- even the ones who supported its adoption -- thought of it as a magical document. For the most part, response was muted in the same way liberals and conservatives respond to Obama Care. Hamilton's camp thought they needed even more central power, Jefferson's thought they needed to stick closer to the original to the Articles. Everyone was pretty surly and pissed, but they needed something that would allow them to form a government that could face the imperial powers of Europe on equal diplomatic and military footing that they couldn't have as a confederacy.

    Anyway, the people have changed because the world has changed. In a frontier society, opportunity -- the opportunity to improve one's self and one's condition -- is the direction of the frontier and is as far away as the next unincorporated territory. In the 21st century, opportunity is a leading export that most people don't have the economic standing to pursue and which wouldn't help them if they did. Gunpowder was the biggest threat, and it was a continent away -- the nearest threat was the sticks and stones of hostile Native Americans. These days, super plagues, nuclear bombs, rapidly dwindling resources and hunger for new territories, climate change, rogue states, and proliferating terrorism are the biggest threats, with missiles they can reach anywhere in the world in an hour. Responding to threats requires collectivization on a scale unimaginable to the Founding Fathers; a 1700s local militia might be able to guide people away from a flood or fight Native Americans, but it can't stop North Korea from pursuing nuclear technology.

    As a last resort, anyone in the 1700s could avoid starvation and supplement their diet by hunting and trapping, a feat reduced mostly to recreation in a society where populations are tens of thousands of times bigger and only factory farming on a super massive industrial scale can provide humans with enough food to remain fed. Aka, self-reliance is hopeless on a fundamental level; if everyone had to be self reliant, tens or hundreds of millions of people would have to die because nature wasn't supplying enough livestock to keep them fed no matter how skillful of hunters they were.

    Nobody has a time to multi-task into self-reliance, anyway, because our economic order requires each individual to invest every ounce of their time into learning a specialized skill, like driving a huge truck across Alaska, accounting, or soldiering. There isn't enough time to learn all the skills you need to maintain the technological complexity of a modern home.

    Don't know how you expected anyone to stay the same as we were two hundred and fifty years ago when everything is so different.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 07-06-14 at 11:06 AM.
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  4. #24
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Mostly not about who is best, but who is the least bad. Luckily for us, the office of POTUS doesn't have nearly as much power as people ascribe to it, thanks to that (outdated? I think not!) Constitution.

    Now, let's dump the incumbents out of Congress, pick the constitution up, dust the footprints off of it, and move forward.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

  5. #25
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    America has voted.
    OBAMA SUCKS!
    If you are going by that Poll, how do you figure?

    Ranked from best to worst, the poll found these results for the “best president” of modern times:


    1. Ronald Reagan 35 percent
    2. Bill Clinton 18 percent
    3. John F. Kennedy 15 percent
    4. Barack Obama 8 percent
    5. Dwight Eisenhower 5 percent
    6. Harry S. Truman 4 percent
    7. Lyndon B. Johnson (tie) 3 percent
    8. George H.W. Bush (tie) 3 percent
    9. Jimmy Carter 2 percent
    10. Richard Nixon (tie) 1 percent
    11. Gerald Ford (tie) 1 percent
    12. George W. Bush (tie) 1 percent


    Read more at Barack Obama, George W. Bush: Who Was The Worst President? [Poll]

  6. #26
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Bush's main failings were the optional Wars, and his torching of our National Reputation(foreign relations). Oh, 9/11 as well, though his management was supreme.
    Obama has failed more times than one can count, but he did inherit a worse situation, and none of his failings were on the Bush scale
    I think in the end, Bush will be viewed as the moron he is, and Obama as the mediocre president he was

    The fact that Bush is being voted higher at this point in this poll just shows the hyper partisan, low information political environment right now.
    Men do what they have to when they want to, Great men do what they have to, even when they don't want to.

  7. #27
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Which is worse, being waterboarded or having your fingernails removed slowly one by one?

    It's essentially the same question....


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  8. #28
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob N View Post
    If you are going by that Poll, how do you figure?

    Ranked from best to worst, the poll found these results for the “best president” of modern times:


    1. Ronald Reagan 35 percent
    2. Bill Clinton 18 percent
    3. John F. Kennedy 15 percent
    4. Barack Obama 8 percent
    5. Dwight Eisenhower 5 percent
    6. Harry S. Truman 4 percent
    7. Lyndon B. Johnson (tie) 3 percent
    8. George H.W. Bush (tie) 3 percent
    9. Jimmy Carter 2 percent
    10. Richard Nixon (tie) 1 percent
    11. Gerald Ford (tie) 1 percent
    12. George W. Bush (tie) 1 percent


    Read more at Barack Obama, George W. Bush: Who Was The Worst President? [Poll]
    Nope, the second poll.
    OBAMA#1 worst POTUS

    Barack Obama 33 percent
    George W. Bush 28 percent
    Richard Nixon 13 percent
    Jimmy Carter 8 percent
    Lyndon B. Johnson (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Ronald Reagan (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Bill Clinton (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Gerald Ford (tie for 8th) 2 percent
    George H.W. Bush (tie for 8th) 2 percent
    Dwight Eisenhower 1 percent
    Harry S. Truman less than 1 percent (tie)
    John F. Kennedy less than 1 percent (tie)

    Read more at Barack Obama, George W. Bush: Who Was The Worst President? [Poll]
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
    Matt. 10:32-33

  9. #29
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    Nope, the second poll.
    OBAMA#1 worst POTUS

    Barack Obama 33 percent
    George W. Bush 28 percent
    Richard Nixon 13 percent
    Jimmy Carter 8 percent
    Lyndon B. Johnson (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Ronald Reagan (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Bill Clinton (tie for 5th) 3 percent
    Gerald Ford (tie for 8th) 2 percent
    George H.W. Bush (tie for 8th) 2 percent
    Dwight Eisenhower 1 percent
    Harry S. Truman less than 1 percent (tie)
    John F. Kennedy less than 1 percent (tie)

    Read more at Barack Obama, George W. Bush: Who Was The Worst President? [Poll]
    OK. Well one shows he is in 4th place as the best and another has him in 1st place as the worst. Polls are funny, huh?

    Just makes me wonder just how Barack and GWB got in for two terms. Maybe that kind of poll (Where people go out in November to vote.) has more substance to it than one taken from a media source, huh.

  10. #30
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    Re: Bush vs Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Well, that's just your opinion, man.

    I might ask why you think the U.S. Constitution is so special when none of the Founding Fathers -- even the ones who supported its adoption -- thought of it as a magical document. For the most part, response was muted in the same way liberals and conservatives respond to Obama Care. Hamilton's camp thought they needed even more central power, Jefferson's thought they needed to stick closer to the original to the Articles. Everyone was pretty surly and pissed, but they needed something that would allow them to form a government that could face the imperial powers of Europe on equal diplomatic and military footing that they couldn't have as a confederacy.

    Anyway, the people have changed because the world has changed. In a frontier society, opportunity -- the opportunity to improve one's self and one's condition -- is the direction of the frontier and is as far away as the next unincorporated territory. In the 21st century, opportunity is a leading export that most people don't have the economic standing to pursue and which wouldn't help them if they did. Gunpowder was the biggest threat, and it was a continent away -- the nearest threat was the sticks and stones of hostile Native Americans. These days, super plagues, nuclear bombs, rapidly dwindling resources and hunger for new territories, climate change, rogue states, and proliferating terrorism are the biggest threats, with missiles they can reach anywhere in the world in an hour. Responding to threats requires collectivization on a scale unimaginable to the Founding Fathers; a 1700s local militia might be able to guide people away from a flood or fight Native Americans, but it can't stop North Korea from pursuing nuclear technology.

    As a last resort, anyone in the 1700s could avoid starvation and supplement their diet by hunting and trapping, a feat reduced mostly to recreation in a society where populations are tens of thousands of times bigger and only factory farming on a super massive industrial scale can provide humans with enough food to remain fed. Aka, self-reliance is hopeless on a fundamental level; if everyone had to be self reliant, tens or hundreds of millions of people would have to die because nature wasn't supplying enough livestock to keep them fed no matter how skillful of hunters they were.

    Nobody has a time to multi-task into self-reliance, anyway, because our economic order requires each individual to invest every ounce of their time into learning a specialized skill, like driving a huge truck across Alaska, accounting, or soldiering. There isn't enough time to learn all the skills you need to maintain the technological complexity of a modern home.

    Don't know how you expected anyone to stay the same as we were two hundred and fifty years ago when everything is so different.
    "Well, that's just your opinion man.

    There is plenty of opportunity in this country for any American willing to put the work in to seize it. You are proving my point that the caliber of people living under the Constitution have failed, not the document itself.

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