View Poll Results: Can one be called a Doctor, no matter the setting, if they have a Doctrates?

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Thread: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

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    Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    No, this has nothing to do with Obamacare so retract your claws.

    I have for a very long time, as have many others, referred to physicians as "Doctors". However, as a college student who is now more aware of degree and the titles that come with them - I now know that a Doctor isn't necessarily a "Doctor" and a "Doctor" is not always, technically, a Doctor.

    So here is a thread on a nursing site regarding their right as a nurse to refer to themselves as a Doctor if they have earned, through rigurous study and invested time, a doctrates in Nursing Practice ( A degree that allows them to act in some capacities as a physician)

    Can you be called "Doctor" with a PhD in Nursing? - pg.5 | allnurses

    An articulate quote from one Dr. Nurse -

    It seems to me that some of the posters in this thread have some "self esteem issues" when it comes to the profession of nursing -- and are putting physicians on a pedastal they do not deserve.

    It is wrong to put physicians on a pedastal and it is wrong to encourage the general public to do so. Other disciplines have much to offer and should not be shoved aside or diminished by encouraging a glorification of the medical profession over all others. We should be educating the public about the value of the other professions, not perpetuating any existing misunderstandings or illusions about the absolute supremacy of medicine.

    As I have said before, I introduce myself using my first and last name -- rarely using any title and always identifying myself as a nurse. But my PhD outranks an MD in the world of academic degrees and I have earned the title of "Doctor" with 7 years of full time graduate education plus many years of practice. In case you didn't notice, I have spent more years in school than most physicians.

    I have earned the title of "Dr." and will use it when I choose to use a title. Those who don't want nursing (or other disciplines) to be given the respect and public acknowledgement we have earned should get over their desire to worship physicians. It's insulting to those of us who have done the work to earn other doctoral degrees.

    Physicians chose to use the title of Dr. back when it was an elevation for them to be called the same thing as college professors with PhD's. Historically, their education was less and the "Dr." title was a way for them to be elevated in the public eye. They should not now try to kick the PhD's down by stripping the title they appropriated from them in the first place. If they want a title that is exclusively their's, they should either use the title "physician" or make up another title -- not kick the original "owners" of that title out of the club
    .
    Now this is a MD forum discussing the same topic. Skim through it if you like but the overall sentiments there are - "No only we physicians get to be called 'Doctors'"
    Doctor of Nursing Practice? | Student Doctor Network

    Now the title Ph.D predates the academic established field of Medical Practice. Being a Doctor of any field and referring to yourself as a Doctor was thing before physicians stepped into town. From what I can gather physicians in America, since outside of the US physicians are often referred to as just that physicians, started referring to themselves as Doctors to gain more repsect for a field of study that at the time wasn't being as respected as it should be.

    Though physicians are skilled, vital, and educated people - I don't believe they have the right to monopolize the title Doctor, especially when many physicians do not have a Doctrates in the first place. Granted as language has evolved the word Doctor now includes physician as a definiton, but I don't believe that addition in meaning should trump the original and still applicable meaning of -

    A person who has earned the highest academic degree conferred by a university.
    In a nutshell if you have a Doctrates in Economy - You are a doctor.
    If you have a doctrates in English Literature - You are a doctor. And you have every right to refer to yourself by your earned titled.
    Last edited by Zinthaniel; 06-25-14 at 07:11 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    In my own experience here, people seem to ignore a posters professional experience or training if the app pro holds a view that is disagreed with.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Fair enough outside of a hospital or in any setting a person may expect to come across a medical doctor.

    People have expectations in context...and litigation issues surrounding proclaiming yourself as something regarding consent.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    Fair enough outside of a hospital or in any setting a person may expect to come across a medical doctor.

    People have expectations in context...and litigation issues surrounding proclaiming yourself as something regarding consent.
    So in other words, no?
    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    In my own experience here, people seem to ignore a posters professional experience or training if the app pro holds a view that is disagreed with.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Zinthaniel View Post
    So in other words, no?
    Perhaps medical doctors can acquire a new, widely accepted title that won't lead to law suits aplenty. But in absence of that, no regardless of the historical origins of the term, someone working in a hospital shouldn't be able to call themselves "Dr." because they have a PhD.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    Perhaps medical doctors can acquire a new, widely accepted title that won't lead to law suits aplenty. But in absence of that, no regardless of the historical origins of the term, someone working in a hospital shouldn't be able to call themselves "Dr." because they have a PhD.
    ok. I disagree. Especailly if that person has a Ph.D in a field related to medicine and other clinical practice. I'm quite confident people like Psychologist would laugh at your assertion that they do not have the right to refer to themselves as a Doctor when their coursework and time invested in study is just as consuming and rigours, if not more (It's a higher ranking degree than md) as that of a physicians course work.

    If I am recalling correctly the laws prohibit anyone from posing and falsely claiming they are a physician or Medical doctor - they don't prohibit you from using your earned title.
    Last edited by Zinthaniel; 06-25-14 at 07:27 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    In my own experience here, people seem to ignore a posters professional experience or training if the app pro holds a view that is disagreed with.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Zinthaniel View Post
    ok. I disagree. Especailly if that person has a Ph.D in a field related to medicine and other clinical practice. I'm quite confident people like Psychologist would laugh at your assertion that they do not have the right to refer to themselves as a Doctor when their coursework and time invested in study is just as consuming and rigours, if not more (It's a higher ranking degree than md) as that of a physicians course work.

    If I am recalling correctly the laws prohibit anyone from posing and falsely claiming they are a physician - they don't prohibit you from using your earned title.
    I couldn't care less which is more time consuming or rigorous. The feels over your title don't matter. In a hospital setting many patients don't have any idea about the differences in educational achievement and it's dangerous to confuse them over ego.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    I couldn't care less which is more time consuming or rigorous. The feels over your title don't matter. In a hospital setting many patients don't have any idea about the differences in educational achievement and it's dangerous to confuse them over ego.
    Placating public ignorance is not an excuse to rob people of their title. It's also hyperbolic to assume that a Doctor of Pyschology would put themselves in a posistion where they are being confused with a physician.

    Flippantly dimissing the amount of work required, and life time required, to earn a ph.d is absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    In my own experience here, people seem to ignore a posters professional experience or training if the app pro holds a view that is disagreed with.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Zinthaniel View Post
    Placating public ignorance is not an excuse to rob people of their title. It's also hyperbolic to assume that a Doctor of Pyschology would put themselves in a posistion where they are being confused with a physician.

    Flippantly dimissing the amount of work required, and life time required, to earn a ph.d is absurd.
    But I'm not. I stated in a particular setting it's not appropriate to title yourself a doctor so your feelings aren't hurt at the expense of the understanding of the patient, where yes, they understand that to mean medical doctor.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    People with a medical degree are referred to as "Doctor" in Britain too, but rarely as a "physician". "Nurse" is a legally protected title whereas doctor, curiously is not. Nevertheless, a nurse with a PhD will use that title when formality requires it.

    Here's one, cleverly photographed earlier. Dr. Peter Carter is Chief Exec. of the RCN, the biggest nursing union in the world.

    Don't work out, work in.

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    Re: Can we talk Doctors? A Discussion on the Academic Title

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben K. View Post
    But I'm not. I stated in a particular setting it's not appropriate to title yourself a doctor so your feelings aren't hurt at the expense of the understanding of the patient, where yes, they understand that to mean medical doctor.
    It's more likely that your feelings are hurt since you are only one trying to make this personal.

    The setting doesn't matter. Obviously a doctor in a clincal field of study, but who is not a physician, has the obligation to clarify what they are a doctor of before proceeding, but that individual still has every right to introduce themselves as a doctor. Communication is key - placating mass ignorance is idiotic.
    Last edited by Zinthaniel; 06-25-14 at 07:44 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    In my own experience here, people seem to ignore a posters professional experience or training if the app pro holds a view that is disagreed with.

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