View Poll Results: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

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  • Yes

    17 26.56%
  • No

    47 73.44%
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Thread: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face? [W:166]

  1. #251
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Eco...my ancestry and family is from Denmark. If someone speaks harshly of Denmark...even though it doesnt bother me...will you be my hero?
    White people are the majority power, it's socially irrelevant if someone talks crap about them. Try not to play victim too much.

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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face? [W:166]

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    I'm certain that you invoked the reality thing Vance. It seems your preoccupation.
    I invoked it because I dwell in it. You and yours....not so much. You want to live in a world where ISIS and Al Qaida controls Iraq Syria and others...then I suggest you travel there in person and express your support and admiration. You assign your down with corporations! Down with capitalism! bull**** to a US response to the current situation...well...it DOES speak volumes.

  3. #253
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    White people are the majority power, it's socially irrelevant if someone talks crap about them. Try not to play victim too much.
    THATS what you took from that.

  4. #254
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    Liberals DONT care about American Indians and for all your bull****, neither do you. Do you know WHY we arent having a discourse on the plight of the American Indian or what Obama may or may not have done? It is because the only time you or any other liber surfaces on Indians it is to whine bitch and moan about a stupid sports team logo.

    You 'claim' to be somehow tribal affiliated...and yet THIS is the ONLY time you ever so much as bring issues up. You have NEVER...E V E R...expressed concern about the poverty, unemployment, education, unwed mothers, domestic violence, sexual assault, substance abuse, growing gang problems, violent crimes and other problems that are a major component of res life. NEVER. E V E R. Oh but you are gonna surface any time you get to do your fauxcahontas act on THIS subject.

    Hot air? You ought to be embarrassed. You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
    I'm not ashamed at all...my fiance uses her Law Degree to help American Indians (she graduated from a top 10 law school) and I always donate money to programs that she recommends. There's no doubt she's much more involved than I am, but unless you're an activist I guarantee I'm much more involved than you are.

    Your caricature of me is just wrong.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  5. #255
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    If I honestly believed the words entire history, as a reference to native americans, had been one of a derogatory and disparaging fashion I'd be more apt to believe it should be changed. If I honeslty believed the most common use of the word today was as a means of referring to american indians in a slurring fashion I'd be more apt to change the name. If I honestly believed the intent of the team in choosing the name was insulting or belittling in nature i would be more apt to change the name. If I honestly believed that a majority of native americans felt that the name should be changed because it deeply offended them then I would likely be more apt to believe it should be changed. If I honestly believed the name was causing some kind of significant "harm" to Native Americans in this country I would likely be more apt to change the name.

    However...

    Based on what I've researched and read regarding the history of the word, it has not always been used as a means of derogatorily or disparagingly referring to native americans and is not ALWAYS used in a slurring fashion.

    Based on what I've personally experienced, various means of lay research (such as examining internet searches for the use of the word), and talks with others I believe the word is most commonly used in the vast majority of this country as a means of referencing the Football team and not as a derogatory means of referring to native americans.

    Based on what I've read and researched with regards to the origins of the name of the team, the steps they've taken over the years with other aspects related to the name (such as their current logo), and common sense as it relates to the naming of sports teams I simply don't believe the name was done with an intent to disparage or insult or degrade or mock or disrespect american indians.

    Based on the only polls on the issue I've seen conducted, individuals I've spoken to in my area and when attending the NNALEA conference, interviews and statements made by some native americans in the media and online, input from individuals who have researched and visited reservations gathering opinions, and the presense of predominantly native american schools who themselves use the name I don't believe "native americans", as an all encompassing over all group, feel that the name should change and I do believe the vast majority hover between "don't want it to change" and "don't really care either way".

    Based on an understanding of the challenges facing Native Americans on and off the reservations in this country, and the lack of actual tangible evidence of any "harm" being directed towards native americans due to the name other than some peoples opinion that it "Stereotypes" them which inherently "harms" them, I can't honestly say there is any "harm" coming to the american indian community over all due to the name, let alone "harm" that could be considered "significant" when stacked agaisnt the multitude of troubles affecting large portions of the community.

    This is all combined with a belief that many, in what I think are a minority, of those offended by the name are, in part, offended based on a spurious and incorrect assertion, propogated by a questionable activist source, that the word means, or is originated from a reference to, "scalped native americans"....an assertion used as the basis for offense often by those who claim offense, including a recent Salon writer and a tribal leader in another story I read recently.

    So no...I don't find it offensive. I understand some DO find it offensive, and they're free to do so...but I don't, and I'm not going to change my mind based on a false premise that they constantly attempt to use to justify WHY they feel it's right to tell others, or attempt to guilt others, into being offended.
    That's fine. Like I've mentioned...I don't feel strongly one way or another. I don't agree with the reasoning "why are you worried about this when there are larger issues".

    Most of the people that mention that aren't concerned with the larger issues. American Indians already vote heavily Democratic because liberals are the party that tends to actually care about American Indian issues and fight to help a very small percentage of the population.

    There's no doubt American Indians would prefer the focus to be on other things, but people fighting about the use of Redskin isn't about American Indians at all. It's turned into the typical culture right vs left war with American Indians on the sideline.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  6. #256
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    I don't even know how I could be in a situation to call someone a redskin.

    when I meet someone I don't know, I introduce myself, and they usually do the same, ..so i don't see how the situation is going to come to pass.

    when flagging someone's attention, ...i say...excuse me.

    so the question is not a fair one....i certainly would not call them a redskin, if they pissed me off i have derogatory names to use instead.

    now.......... on to the "Cleveland Indians!"....for more political correctness.

  7. #257
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Truthfully, I don't see the "redskin" name as having any basis in fact. I lived with an Indian girl for several years and have many Indian friends and acquaintances and do business on a Reservation. The only people I know that could be referred to as "redskins" would be blonde or red headed people with sensitive skin. Indians are the same shade as many Orientals and I've never seen any of those I'd refer to as "redskins" either. I have never considered the name derogatory any more than "black" for Negroes. It's hard to even figure where the nickname came from. I would think no more of using the term "redskin" in conservation with an Indian than I would referring to a "black" when talking with a Negro. Bigotry is a lot more than a word.

  8. #258
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    That's fine. Like I've mentioned...I don't feel strongly one way or another. I don't agree with the reasoning "why are you worried about this when there are larger issues".

    Most of the people that mention that aren't concerned with the larger issues. American Indians already vote heavily Democratic because liberals are the party that tends to actually care about American Indian issues and fight to help a very small percentage of the population.

    There's no doubt American Indians would prefer the focus to be on other things, but people fighting about the use of Redskin isn't about American Indians at all. It's turned into the typical culture right vs left war with American Indians on the sideline.
    you are so lost you couldn't find your way into this discussion with a guide. It is ever and always leftists and liberals that bring this up and offer the pretense of 'caring'. It's a cruel joke for you to even imply liberals 'care'. They don't and never have. Oh...sure...they occasionally wring their hands about nonsense like sports teams nicknames...and...well...that's it...jobs done. You celebrate causes because it is a political issue, not because you actually give a **** about the people. And it's not just this issue...it's across the spectrum. Same with abortion. Same with the death penalty. Same with gun violence. Same with all of it.

    The left bangs this drum. Not because they 'care' but because...well...hey...**** it...we HAVE this drum...we might as well beat it. The right responds stating both the cause is wrong AND that if you actually gave half a **** there are far greater issues to at least pretend to care about.

    It has been established that 90% of Indians either A Don't care about this issue or B are proud of the team name. It has been established that the formation of the team nickname was done as a means of HONORING Indians AND that the Redskin Indian logo (far from being insulting) was actually DESIGNED by an Indian and endorsed by Indian tribal chiefs.

    You would think that it would be enough. But not for people invested solely in "the cause".

  9. #259
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face?

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    you are so lost you couldn't find your way into this discussion with a guide. It is ever and always leftists and liberals that bring this up and offer the pretense of 'caring'. It's a cruel joke for you to even imply liberals 'care'. They don't and never have. Oh...sure...they occasionally wring their hands about nonsense like sports teams nicknames...and...well...that's it...jobs done. You celebrate causes because it is a political issue, not because you actually give a **** about the people. And it's not just this issue...it's across the spectrum. Same with abortion. Same with the death penalty. Same with gun violence. Same with all of it.
    Yes, Americans Indians are dumb which is why they overwhelmingly vote Democratic and identify as liberals. The only people that truly care about American Indian issues are Conservatives, if only American Indians and other minorities were smart enough to understand. *sarcasm*

    It has been established that 90% of Indians either A Don't care about this issue or B are proud of the team name. It has been established that the formation of the team nickname was done as a means of HONORING Indians AND that the Redskin Indian logo (far from being insulting) was actually DESIGNED by an Indian and endorsed by Indian tribal chiefs.
    I know I've mentioned it multiple times in this very thread...BUT I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE USE OF THE NAME!...I think it's ridiculous when someone states as a fact that someone should or should not be offended by the name or faulty logic that if you can't find something offensive because there are more important things to worry about. You can do both!

    You would think that it would be enough. But not for people invested solely in "the cause".
    Once again...rightwing talk radio caricture of a liberal "they don't really care about American Indians!" after a segment bitching about some bill that funds American Indian projects.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  10. #260
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    Re: Would you call a Native American "redskin" to their face? [W:166]

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    This is a better question than the other poll.

    If your answer is "no," you should ponder why not. And maybe even post why not in this thread.
    No -- I tend not to call people ethnic slurs, to their face or otherwise.

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