View Poll Results: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs?

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  • Yes

    48 52.75%
  • No

    43 47.25%
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Thread: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

  1. #451
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    I was simultaniously diagnosed with a thyroid problem and T2 diabetes. Once I got my diabetes under control, my thyroid problem went away also.
    I was hoping that would be the case for me but my thyroid issue was diagnosed when I was 16. I've been too thin most of my life.

    My diabetes is slowly starting to come under control. I'm still taking Metformin twice a day but they added Lantus insulin last month, and now I'm on 30 units of that each night. My sugars are down from the 200s+ to low-mid 100s. I am thrilled!

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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Yes- but you have to control for the fact that some medical conditions actually CAUSE obesity, which confounds that calculation.

    Overall, obesity seems to be less of a driver of medical costs than one might think.

    PLOS Medicine: Lifetime Medical Costs of Obesity: Prevention No Cure for Increasing Health Expenditure
    According to that, non smokers of normal weight have the highest lifetime medical care costs due to the fact that they live longer on average than either obese people or smokers. I can see how that would be, but on the other hand, since they live longer, they also pay into the system for a longer time.

    I suppose the case could be made that the way to decrease the cost of Medicare would be to encourage people to smoke and over eat. That strategy could reduce the costs of pensions and Social Security as well in the same way.

    Is that a strategy you'd advocate?
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I was hoping that would be the case for me but my thyroid issue was diagnosed when I was 16. I've been too thin most of my life.

    My diabetes is slowly starting to come under control. I'm still taking Metformin twice a day but they added Lantus insulin last month, and now I'm on 30 units of that each night. My sugars are down from the 200s+ to low-mid 100s. I am thrilled!

    Thin T2 diabetics. Not much of an issue in the US - but its actually pretty common in Europe. Less so these days.

    Ive always thought that the most rational therapy for thinner diabetics might be Actos - its an interesting drug in term of mechanism, and will actually have patients literally increase their subcutaneous fat at the expense of their visceral fat.

    Again, another drug that actually can directly cause weight gain and obesity, yet is treating a medical condition... which is why we shouldnt base insurance rates on obesity.
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    According to that, non smokers of normal weight have the highest lifetime medical care costs due to the fact that they live longer on average than either obese people or smokers. I can see how that would be, but on the other hand, since they live longer, they also pay into the system for a longer time.

    I suppose the case could be made that the way to decrease the cost of Medicare would be to encourage people to smoke and over eat. That strategy could reduce the costs of pensions and Social Security as well in the same way.

    Is that a strategy you'd advocate?

    Of course not. I'm just pointing out the vagaries of trying to see if things are cost-effective. From a societal view thats concerned only with cost (and dont think that view doesnt exist...cough..teaparty.. cough.) the perfect lifestyle is for someone to be completely healthy and productive up until the point where they retire, and then drop dead of a sudden MI or untreatable cancer.

    Ideally, you want to have the healthiest possible population for the longest time possible, and thats why preventative care, which plays a significant role in the ACA, will hopefully have the effect of both driving down long term health care costs AND maintain a healthier population for the least amount of money possible.
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    According to that, non smokers of normal weight have the highest lifetime medical care costs due to the fact that they live longer on average than either obese people or smokers. I can see how that would be, but on the other hand, since they live longer, they also pay into the system for a longer time.

    I suppose the case could be made that the way to decrease the cost of Medicare would be to encourage people to smoke and over eat. That strategy could reduce the costs of pensions and Social Security as well in the same way.

    Is that a strategy you'd advocate?
    How about if we just charge everyone the same and stay out of their personal lives? Then, none of this is an issue at all except for the whiners who whine because they have to pay a couple of extra dollars a month on their premiums.

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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    How about if we just charge everyone the same and stay out of their personal lives? Then, none of this is an issue at all except for the whiners who whine because they have to pay a couple of extra dollars a month on their premiums.
    Thats exactly what I would like to do.

    Except that I would have a sin tax on sugar and possibly some other health threatening food sources, and use the revenue from those sin taxes in the insurance pool, so that those who over eat unhealthy food pay for their own increased risk.

    It's just the most simple solution.
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    Thats exactly what I would like to do.

    Except that I would have a sin tax on sugar and possibly some other health threatening food sources, and use the revenue from those sin taxes in the insurance pool, so that those who over eat unhealthy food pay for their own increased risk.

    It's just the most simple solution.
    Not me. I'd prefer to just educate people and let them make their own choices. Besides, with the government mismanagement of taxpayer monies, you never know WHERE the money is going to go. AND I want the government to stay out of people's lives and choices.

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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    Thats exactly what I would like to do.

    Except that I would have a sin tax on sugar and possibly some other health threatening food sources, and use the revenue from those sin taxes in the insurance pool, so that those who over eat unhealthy food pay for their own increased risk.

    It's just the most simple solution.
    I dont know about a sin tax. That seems to be a little arbitrary... why tax sugar and not, say trans-fats? Or if you do both, do you tax artificial sweeteners?

    It seems like a better solution might be NOT to subsidize the primary producer of sugar... corn (as in high fructose corn syrup, or dextrose, or corn sugar).

    Take off those subsidies, or maybe transfer them to truck farm vegetable producers, and that may make sense.
    Many Trump supporters have lots of problems, and those deplorables are bringing those problems to us. They’re racists. They’re misogynists. They’re islamophobic. They're xenophobes and homophobes. And some, I assume, are good people.

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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    Quote Originally Posted by Threegoofs View Post
    Of course not. I'm just pointing out the vagaries of trying to see if things are cost-effective. From a societal view thats concerned only with cost (and dont think that view doesnt exist...cough..teaparty.. cough.) the perfect lifestyle is for someone to be completely healthy and productive up until the point where they retire, and then drop dead of a sudden MI or untreatable cancer.

    Ideally, you want to have the healthiest possible population for the longest time possible, and thats why preventative care, which plays a significant role in the ACA, will hopefully have the effect of both driving down long term health care costs AND maintain a healthier population for the least amount of money possible.
    Exactly, and encouraging a healthy lifestyle is one way to promote the healthiest possible population for the longest time possible.
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    Re: Should medically judged fat people pay higher medical costs? [W:87]

    The worst part (and most obvious from within this thread) is the lack of shame and denial by fat Americans. I know it's a real phenomena because I work with grown men and women of all ages and demographics who are a good 40 pounds overweight. When 70% of your workforce is 40 or more pounds overweight what it creates is an "Obesity Fascism" of sorts. Nobody is allowed to really talk about it or even talk about weight because 7 out of 10 employees are medically fat. It's pathetic. They even pretend they're in shape sometimes out of that despicable little consumerist dogma of "individualism" when there's absolutely nothing "individualist" about eating Twinkies from a major corporation every day then passing the tab of your medical bills to everybody else.

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