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America is or is not a Christian Nation.

Is America a Christian Nation?

  • Yes

    Votes: 26 25.7%
  • No

    Votes: 75 74.3%

  • Total voters
    101
Not if the state religion is enforced at gunpoint. Look at christianity's beginnings even. Constantine decided to no longer persecute christians and pretty soon it was the pagans being persecuted.

That is only happening in Muslim nations now...
 
So when can one use the term "Nation" to refer to its people then? Nothing is 100%. Isreal is not a Jewish Nation then. I just think some of you are being argumentative.

You can use the term nation to define any government regulated land of a group of people. How you define that nation is more than just Majority wins. Israel has an official religion. It enforces laws and a culture that is centered around that. That's the distinction.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Israel

Religion in Israel is a central feature of the country and plays a major role in shaping Israeli culture and lifestyle, and religion has played a central role in Israel's history.


... and it is not a fact because I say it is a fact... but it is a fact none the less.
No it's not. Not at all.
 
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A "nation" is the people that live within an area controlled by a government... we are a Christian Nation. Just a fact. I am an atheist and I accept this fact. No biggy.
I disagree, and it isn't a fact. If the nation is the people than this can't be a Christian nation not all the people are Christian. All you can say is that it is a majority Christian nation.
 
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According to this here text book being used in Texas, we are a Christian nation.
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The majority in this country are Female, however there is no question about whether this country is male dominated or whether the male gender has the most sway here.

Would you call the United States a "Male Nation" or a "Male Dominated Nation" or a "Predominantly Male-Centric Nation"?
 
Would you call the United States a "Male Nation" or a "Male Dominated Nation" or a "Predominantly Male-Centric Nation"?
I'm not sure, if anything I'd say the third one. Simply because many of the values in our country are male centric, but that's changing. I believe our nation is a Progressive Nation or a Nation that is changing.
 
I'm in the "no" camp.

There is no question that Christianity is an important part of US history. But since we cannot have an official state religion, it's not a "Christian nation," in the same way that Islam is the official religion of Saudi Arabia.
 
That's absurd.

Here's an eyewitness report of what's really in store for the stiff-necked crowd:

23 Minutes in Hell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lhhEvfSaSA

An eyewitness report? What, did he resurrect too? He should totally found a new religion and write a NT 2.0 and claim to be god then. You should become his Paul and write a Romans 2.0 also since your whole argument for the bible's legitimacy seems to be "You can't bust the resurrection!" Oh, and we can all celebrate Christmas 2 and get more presents then and a day off work! I hope his birthday was in February. One less day to go in during those dreary midwest winters.
 
I'm not sure, if anything I'd say the third one. Simply because many of the values in our country are male centric, but that's changing. I believe our nation is a Progressive Nation or a Nation that is changing.

Nicaragua had a female president in its first ever election back in 1990, while the US media and public is always pondering if this country is ready for a female prez with Hillary running. Changing perhaps, progressive...not so much.
 
Nicaragua had a female president in its first ever election back in 1990, while the US media and public is always pondering if this country is ready for a female prez with Hillary running. Changing perhaps, progressive...not so much.

In regards to culture, religion and people, I believe that most accurate description of our country - one that even stretches across our history, and unlike Christianity, still has a very strong influence in all levels of the US, is Multi Cultural. The Melting Pot Nation.
 
In regards to culture, religion and people, I believe that most accurate description of our country - one that even stretches across our history, and unlike Christianity, still has a very strong influence in all levels of the US, is Multi Cultural. The Melting Pot Nation.

Not by design, that's for sure, at least aside from colleges and such. Just look at our crazy immigration policies and segregation. My hometown was 97% white. It's a good thing it ended up that at least various cultures are accessible in big cities however.
 
Not by design, that's for sure, at least aside from colleges and such. Just look at our crazy immigration policies and segregation. My hometown was 97% white. It's a good thing it ended up that at least various cultures are accessible in big cities however.

Perhaps my perceptions is shaped by the fact that I grew up in los Angeles all my life. I'm not sure then... what kind of nation are we?
 
I'm not sure, if anything I'd say the third one. Simply because many of the values in our country are male centric, but that's changing. I believe our nation is a Progressive Nation or a Nation that is changing.

The reason I ask is that based on your claims with regards to males, it'd absolutely be reasonable to suggest we're a Predominantly Christian-Centric Nation as well then if you'd go with the last one in terms of males.

I would also think you're ABSOLUTELY wrong and simply projecting if you're calling the U.S. a "Progressive" nature...capital P....if you're refusing to acknowledge that it's reasonable to suggest it may be a Christian Nation.
 
In regards to culture, religion and people, I believe that most accurate description of our country - one that even stretches across our history, and unlike Christianity, still has a very strong influence in all levels of the US, is Multi Cultural. The Melting Pot Nation.

The melting pot concept and multi-culturalism doesn't really synch up well, so using them back to back is kind of weird.

The entire notion of the "melting pot" is that as you add individual things into the "melting pot" they all contribute their own unique flavor but overall it becomes one cohesive meal.

The notion of "multi-culturalism" is just that, MULTIPLE cultures existing and surviving next to each other. That's the anti-thesis to the "melting pot" philosophy as it relates to cultural intigration into a country.

The Melting Pot concepts suggests that individuals from disparate cultures entering a joint society all add their own tastes to one unique, uniformed, joined culture. The Multicuturalism concept suggests that those individuals from disparate cultures entering a joint society all keep their own cultures seperate to any over arching culture of the society.

To go with the food analogy that "Melting Pot" easily lends itself to....

A Melting Pot dinner would be a bisque containing hints of ginger, cilantro, and oregano (incorporating flavors from asian, south america, and the mediterranian)

A Multi-Cultural dinner would be Ginger Chicken along side some spaghetti and elote with crema.
 
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Perhaps my perceptions is shaped by the fact that I grew up in los Angeles all my life. I'm not sure then... what kind of nation are we?

The only likely accurate assertion to what kind of "nation" exists within the United States of America is likely an "American" nation. A general identification with the Government and Country that nation exists within with some generalized shared cultural factors.

When one uses the various arguments to abjectly disqualify describing the nation of people existing within the United States as a "Christian Nation", there are few other "Nations" one could likely point out in any kind of reasonable fashion.
 
The reason I ask is that based on your claims with regards to males, it'd absolutely be reasonable to suggest we're a Predominantly Christian-Centric Nation as well then if you'd go with the last one in terms of males.

I would also think you're ABSOLUTELY wrong and simply projecting if you're calling the U.S. a "Progressive" nature...capital P....if you're refusing to acknowledge that it's reasonable to suggest it may be a Christian Nation.


No I disagree. I'm not seeing how you made that connection. I said that our nation could be male centric since our culture by in large in male centric. A lot of principals, standards, etc that run through our country are male centric - I don't believe the same can be said for Christianity in this modern day.

I'm not qualifying a nation by only one thing - population or majority.

I believe the culture here is removed from the teachings of Christ - are laws make it point to avoid being theocratic - if and when they do seem to be based on religious teaching there is a backlash, especially if that said law infringes on the rights of a group of people. Many old laws that are still around from when we where a Christian nation are being challenged.

The Duck Dynasty controversy is one example of many that reflect Christianity's standing in our country currently. Now a days I hear many Christian complain about how they feel they are persecuted or attacked for their religious beliefs. Many feel like they are being pushed out the way. Those are not analogous with what sentiments you think you would find in a nation that could be Defined as Christian.


If this nation was Christian it wouldn't simply be because of the majority it would it also be reflected in other areas - Like the law, our standards, and overall culture. It's not though, not any more.

The only likely accurate assertion to what kind of "nation" exists within the United States of America is likely an "American" nation.

So I can't say absolutely that this Nation is not Christian, but when asked directly you yourself will not define out country as Christian either.

Look I'm not attacking Christianity, which I'm assuming is your religion, I just believe that it can be said objectively that our nation is not currently a Christian nation, and I doubt it will ever become a Christian nation again - judging by the current trend of things.
 
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No I disagree. I'm not seeing how you made that connection. I said that our nation could be male centric since our culture by in large in male centric. A lot of principals, standards, etc that run through our country are male centric - I don't believe the same can be said for Christianity in this modern day.

You pointed out how men still holds the majority of political power in this country; so too do Christians hold most of the political power as well. Look at the religion of most of our elected officials, and specifically those at the higher reaches of government. You pointed out how culture still objectifies women; well it still largely gives deference to christians as well. Look at the many businesses that still routinely open later, if at all, on Sunday's to account for church attendance. Look at how censors still generally view "god damn" as offensive but "damn" as not. Look at the prominence of the christian faith in various shared avenues of our culture, like sports. And while law can not be codified enforcing a particular religion, it is ridiculously laughable to suggest that many of the laws on our books weren't inspired by, or gained support from, individuals who were in part motivated by their religious convictions, morals, and beliefs.

While I've not seen you do this one way or another, I've seen the same argument from others who who routinely criticize Christians for being offended when attacked by pointing to how influential and ingrained throughout society it is and thus they can't be persecuted. And it's laughable when they then turn around and act as if it's not ingrained throughout society as a means of discrediting an argument that one could suggest that America could be considered a Christian Nation...or at least as I'm suggesting here, based on your logic, Predominantly Christian-Centric.

You keep going on and on about a theocracy; the form of government does not a nation make.
 
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You pointed out how men still holds the majority of political power in this country; so too do Christians hold most of the political power as well. Look at the religion of most of our elected officials, and specifically those at the higher reaches of government. You pointed out how culture still objectifies women; well it still largely gives deference to christians as well. Look at the many businesses that still routinely open later, if at all, on Sunday's to account for church attendance. Look at how censors still generally view "god damn" as offensive but "damn" as not. Look at the prominence of the christian faith in various shared avenues of our culture, like sports. And while law can not be codified enforcing a particular religion, it is ridiculously laughable to suggest that many of the laws on our books weren't inspired by, or gained support from, individuals who were in part motivated by their religious convictions, morals, and beliefs.

While I've not seen you do this one way or another, I've seen the same argument from others who who routinely criticize Christians for being offended when attacked by pointing to how influential and ingrained throughout society it is and thus they can't be persecuted. And it's laughable when they then turn around and act as if it's not ingrained throughout society as a means of discrediting an argument that one could suggest that America could be considered a Christian Nation...or at least as I'm suggesting here, based on your logic, Predominantly Christian-Centric.

You keep going on and on about a theocracy; the form of government does not a nation make.

For you to jump through hoops to try and suggest it'd be reasonable to suggest this is a Male Centric Nation, or even more crazily a "Progressive" (Capital P, so speaking ideologically and not simply the generalized used of hte word), to suit your political agenda and yet to abjectly and wholey declare it impossible to even reasonable suggest that it could be considered a Christian Nation highlights the agenda driven, political motivated basis for your arguments here.

yes there are many artifacts of when our nation was once a Christian nation. Long established traditions that started there. But, and you are not the first to bring up those traditions, those things no longer reflect their origin. Much like our holidays Christmas, Halloween, Easter all of which, which I admit I was corrected on, stem from Christianity, but they are in no way a reflection of their true intention any more.
The vast majority, if we are going ot be honest here, are not eagerly awaiting Jesus's birthday they are eagerly awaiting their new Xbox, car, golf clubs. They are eagerly awaiting a bag of candy or chocolate bunnies. Sure those things have roots in Christianity, but they are hardly Christian anymore - that's why everyone celebrates them even atheist.

I don't work on Sundays - but I don't go to church just because I'm off, like one is supposed, honor god. The vast majority do things entirely unrelated to Christ, even Christians.

So yea though many Legislators are Christian, but those same legislators if and when they try to past laws that are purely religious based are often met with opposition by the people - no matter how accurate that law may be reflecting to word of God. No to mention that newer generations are becoming more secular -

Study: Young Americans less religious than their parents - CNN.com

Losing Our Religion: The Growth Of The 'Nones' : The Two-Way : NPR

religion-gallup-none.jpg

Also, again, with Christians by and large complaining about feeling poorly represented, attacked for their beliefs, and pushed aside - it doesn't fit for a nation that is supposedly Christian. It doesn't make since. why would any Christian feel that way if the USA could accurately be described as a Christian nation.
 
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So I can't say absolutely that this Nation is not Christian, but when asked directly you yourself will not define out country as Christian either.

Do you not see the difference between suggesting there is no legitimate reason to refer to the nation as a Christian one, and suggesting that I personally would not term it as so?

Here, let me help you out.

One is suggesting ones opinion is fact and belittling the worth of anyones argument who suggests otherwise as being utterly illegitimate.

One is suggesting ones personal opinion is just that, opinion, and recognizes that depending on how one is defining the criteria for ones claim that a legitimate claim can be made either way.

No, I would not personally define the people of the United States of America as a "christian nation" myself...but I absolutely think there are some reasonably legitimate reasons and arguments as to why someone would make such a claim.

Look I'm not attacking Christianity, which I'm assuming is your religion

Of course you would assume that. One, because it's the predominant religion within the country to the point that it's a defacto notion to assume people are that religion (this is a similar argument as to the claim that "white privledge" exists; do you happen to believe in that notion? Because if you do, that's yet another style of logic that one can go to make a legitimate argument that this could be a christian nation). Two, because of you're personal prejudices assuming anyone that could defend it in some fashion must be Christian.

The closest to my religious views you could tie me to (I've posted them up in full in various places in the forum) would be an agnostic diest. I self identify as Christian, less due to any actual strict adherance to the religion and more in defence to the cultural notion of what I grew up as a part of.

I just believe that it can be said objectively that our nation is not currently a Christian nation

The "Nation" as it relates to the people of the United States of America can not "objectivelY" be claimed to be ANY sort of Nation other than perhaps an "American" nation.

Everything else you've tossed out as possible "nations" are no more "objective" than the notio nof a "Christian Nation"...they're still entirely subjective in nature, based on the arbitrary criteria and measurements you've determined in your head.

If your issue is with the notion of people calling the United States a "[blank] nation" when it's not objecitvely true, then your focus and bone to pick singularly on "Christian Nation" belies your seeming intent.
 
Perhaps my perceptions is shaped by the fact that I grew up in los Angeles all my life. I'm not sure then... what kind of nation are we?

300 million people spanning 4 million square miles, it's too vast for me to come up with a simple answer to that. There are 700 resident white trash towns and huge modern cities and everything in between. However, i'm not sure that most americans are grateful for this melting pot so much as just tolerate it (and not even that, when you consider "show me your papers" laws like arizona's).

I just know we're not a "Christian nation" in the conventional sense or every other belief and nonbelief system would be violently forced underground.
 
When one uses the various arguments to abjectly disqualify describing the nation of people existing within the United States as a "Christian Nation", there are few other "Nations" one could likely point out in any kind of reasonable fashion.

Really? Brazil has a huge statue of Jesus presiding over its major city. Latin America in general would qualify i think, and missionaries are always trying to turn Africa into Christian dominated territories that, among other things, pass laws to kill homosexuals.

It's impossible to imagine the US - with its founders' wisdom to separate religion from state and the court system as protection - allowing that kind of oppression.
 
I would also think you're ABSOLUTELY wrong and simply projecting if you're calling the U.S. a "Progressive" nature...capital P....if you're refusing to acknowledge that it's reasonable to suggest it may be a Christian Nation.

Wow talk about projecting. Your bias is really showing if you think that being a Christian nation is somehow progressive. The Inquisition and Crusades were centuries ago and there are a billion Christians all over the world. It certainly would be nothing new or unique.
 
yes there are many artifacts of when our nation was once a Christian nation. Long established traditions that started there. But, and you are not the first to bring up those traditions, those things no longer reflect their origin. Much like our holidays Christmas, Halloween, Easter all of which, which I admit I was corrected on, stem from Christianity, but they are in no way a reflection of their true intention any more.
The vast majority, if we are going ot be honest here, are not eagerly awaiting Jesus's birthday they are eagerly awaiting their new Xbox, car, golf clubs. They are eagerly awaiting a bag of candy or chocolate bunnies. Sure those things have roots in Christianity, but they are hardly Christian anymore - that's why everyone celebrates them even atheist.

I don't work on Sundays - but I don't go to church just because I'm off, like one is supposed, honor god. The vast majority do things entirely unrelated to Christ, even Christians.

Yeah, similarly i like to joke that with the day off on Memorial Day "it's about time the military is good for something." Of course i don't mean it but it's to acknowledge that most don't give a damn anymore. We haven't had a 'war of necessity' in almost anyone's lifetime and the military today is way too huge and mostly an enormous waste of government spending.

But yeah, as an atheist, yay for Christmas! New Xbox and a day off. Finally Jesus is good for something
 
One is suggesting ones opinion is fact and belittling the worth of anyones argument who suggests otherwise as being utterly illegitimate.

I never insisted my opinion is fact. Not once Your whole tone sounds offended. I find it hilarious that you are on my ass for apparently taking a stance that you believe no one can take on this issue, one of objectivity. and yet you haven't said anything to the user Bod who is doing the exact same thing, and he/she actually does believe his opinon is fact - stated so in two posts.

A "nation" is the people that live within an area controlled by a government... we are a Christian Nation. Just a fact. I am an atheist and I accept this fact. No biggy.

But Bod is arguing in favor of Christianity - so yeah you targeting me does seem a tad biased, especially since I never claimed my stance is fact. I stand by my stance, but I have also pointed out in a previous post that this thread shows that a nation is subjectively defined. Because everyone here has opposing views on how to define this nation, .
 
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