View Poll Results: Who is MOST to blame for the problems of African Americans?

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  • GOP

    5 4.39%
  • Black Leadership

    29 25.44%
  • Democrats

    21 18.42%
  • Other

    59 51.75%
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Thread: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

  1. #541
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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    No, again, you are conflating 2 statements, it was easier for single women to live on their own following no-fault divorce and their increasing wage gains in the 1960's......and 20 years later thru today, wage gains for all lower quintile workers (particularly women) have gone stagnant or negative.

    I have my explanation of the same phenom, your argument is to return to marriage being an economic necessity, resulting in higher female suicide and homicide.....rather than creating greater wage gains for women and men in lower quintiles.

    I know, fear of violence and suicide...is selfishness, and everyone knows that continued decreased wage gains is something everyone anticipated!
    So now marriage leads ot violence, suicide, and dependency?

    No, it still seems to me that one of the solutions to poverty, whether the poor are black or white, is to get married before making babies.
    "Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud... [he's] playing the American public for suckers." Mitt Romney

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I'm want to focus on both and more. As your post makes clear, you see it in black and white. That either/or type thinking is flawed
    OK, well you go on thinking that I'm exactly the way you want to think that I am and continue to ignore reality.
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Look to any failing city. See what party runs the Mayor's office and City Council.

    Democrats.

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Straw, I never said I could not......BUT....the focus of the debate IS blacks...in the US.....and the point still is that white racism was a fundamental rationale for slavery's continuation in the South.
    YOu're right, you never explicitly stated that only blacks are slaves, you just only referenced black slaves and the impact that slavery had on them. My ancestors were both slavers (Vikings) and the enslaved (Irish/British) and for some odd reason I don't carry one bit of guilt over them being slavers nor one bit of anger towards then for the enslaving. I live my life in the present. Would you lik to know why I don't?? Because I wasn't indoctrinated into the anger and victimhood that today's black are indoctrinated into. For the blacks who think that they are suffering because of what happened over 150 years, I can only say that it's time to move on. Stop walllowing in the past and start living for your future. For those who continually remind people of that history with the intent of creating that anger and victimhood, my comments would over the filters on this site. They are among the worst that our society has to offer. People who use the mistakes of the past to try to drag down the present.
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    For the blacks who think that they are suffering because of what happened over 150 years, I can only say that it's time to move on.
    As I showed in the study of black youths, the racism they see is not imagined, it is real and tangible and still exist against them.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    So now marriage leads ot violence, suicide, and dependency?
    Now? jeez Louise, it has been that way for centuries.

    No, it still seems to me that one of the solutions to poverty, whether the poor are black or white, is to get married before making babies.
    wash rinse repeat...

    I have my explanation of the same phenom, your argument is to return to marriage being an economic necessity, resulting in higher female suicide and homicide.....rather than creating greater wage gains for women and men in lower quintiles.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I agree with that, but I'm not sure I would call racism a form of classism. However, at least in the US, the two seem "entwined" with each other. Or maybe entwined isn't the best word for it, but I can't think of a better word to use.

    For example, I think there's a tendency amongst many people to associate black people with the lower class and the lower class with black people. The racism and racial prejudice of some reinforces the negative associations they have regarding lower classes. That is, if you're racist, the fact that blacks are more likely to be poor makes it easier for you to have a negative opinion of poor people, even if most poor people are white.
    But that's my point that the real economic problem is not associated with race, as much as meeting a certain criteria to gain access to funding for higher education and job opportunities. It's not because a majority of the Fortune 500 are white males, it's because they're elitist. And many of the cultural problems for blacks, latinos and poor whites are from generations of negative habits and customs, poverty is truly a trap, not just 'whitey' holding people down.
    Einstein, "science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    But that's my point that the real economic problem is not associated with race, as much as meeting a certain criteria to gain access to funding for higher education and job opportunities. It's not because a majority of the Fortune 500 are white males, it's because they're elitist. And many of the cultural problems for blacks, latinos and poor whites are from generations of negative habits and customs, poverty is truly a trap, not just 'whitey' holding people down.
    I would never say that racism is the only thing that is causing problems for black people. I wouldn't even say it's the cause for the difference in the % of white and black people who are poor. However, it definitely plays a role. How big of a role is debatable but it's not the "nothing" or "negligible effect" that some are arguing.
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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I would never say that racism is the only thing that is causing problems for black people. I wouldn't even say it's the cause for the difference in the % of white and black people who are poor. However, it definitely plays a role. How big of a role is debatable but it's not the "nothing" or "negligible effect" that some are arguing.
    Agreed. I do believe that aversive racism does exist, even among liberals and progressives. I don't believe many people are trying to keep black people down, but I find the notion that black people should 'just get over it, and move on' the second segregation ends to be a bit dishonest from people who argue it. It wasn't that long ago.

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    Re: Who do you blame for the problems of African Americans?? [W:98]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    As I showed in the study of black youths, the racism they see is not imagined, it is real and tangible and still exist against them.
    I've seen some those studies and they confuse racism with discrimination against a "thug" stereotype that far too many young blacks embrace. IMO, the issue isn't related to the fact that they are black, but rather that what most people notice the most about young blacks is the stereotype that they seem to love. When someone sees a young black guy wearing "gang" style clothing and with an attitude to match, they do pull back. See that enough and they start equating that same attitude with all young blacks.
    The problem looks like this:
    Joe citizen sees a young black person.
    The young black person is acting like a stereotypical "thug".
    Joe citizen sees another young black person.
    That young black person is acting like a stereotypical "thug".
    Repeat a dozen times or so and what happens is that the idea of young black person equaling a "thug" gets reinforced, regardless of the person dress or behavior.

    Keep in mind that I learned this from a guy who's an ex-Law enforcement and is black (nicest guy you ever wanted to have your back since he's considered an actual mountain in several states [muscle, not fat]). Tom told me that the problem is that people learn things and what they are learning about young blacks these days has far more negative than positive. The problem is twofold, first of all people should be judging others solely on their character and not their manner of dress, secondly, if you want respect, act respectful.
    Our nation has not always lived up to its ideals, yet those ideals have never ceased to guide us. They expose our flaws, and lead us to mend them. We are the beneficiaries of the work of the generations before us and it is each generation's responsibility to continue that work. - Laura Bush

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