Remember, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean the government isn't out to get you...
:wink2:
Yeah, yeah, the conservatives are the one's living in fear while the dumb ass democrat in office is arming very governmental agency he can to the teeth...
:lamo
Ze Germans are coming!!! ZE GERMANS ARE COMING!!!!. :scared:
You've got a better chance of seeing that than the roving, armed, criminal posses who're ready to strike and take down poor unsuspecting police departments in Middle America at any moment. The whole thing is contrived.
So, since you don't do anything illegal, it is okay for cops to abuse civil rights, and act like the mob when in the process of law enforcement. That is a very faulty way to think, if you value your rights in society.
They're not violating my civil rights, are they violating yours?
I kind of agree. I've been seeing a lot of anti-cop sentiment from more and more conservatives.
It appears you missed the point.
Isn’t that the response towards the police here? A mindless panic that having a few ex-military vehicles will magically turn the US in to some kind of militarised police state?
As I said, I was talking about in the extreme. I agree that 99% of the time, the high-end capabilities of these vehicles will be irrelevant. They’re still cheap vehicles that the police can make practical use of though, so there is no reason for it to be a negative thing. Would you rather this valuable equipment was just scrapped of left to rot in some warehouse somewhere?
Are you sure it is only the government and not the world?
Yes sir, it is!!! Our LE officers have been trailing the criminals they fight in weapons technology for as long as I can remember. We need them to have the best and most effective tools available to make the idea of fighting against them so abhorrent to criminals that their motivation for committing crimes goes down substantially. If a criminal knows that taking off in a car and trying to force the LE to break off pursuit in order to protect civilians will only result in a helo taking them out with a laser targeted missile, they will be far less likely to run, since going to jail is normally more preferable to getting turned into road-kill.http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/09/us/war-gear-flows-to-police-departments.html
Do our police have to be militarized? Is this what we want patrolling our streets?
Is all this really necessary?
Yeah, the local police need a 30 ton military vehicle. Don't be silly.
Hey, all they gotta do is say, come out with your hands up, and it's done.
I don't deal drugs, takes drugs, or make them, I have nothing to fear.
I have noticed lately that there must be many, many conservatives living in fear though, poor them. Must be living in hell having to look over their shoulders all the time wondering who's going to get them. :lol:
Yes sir, it is!!! Our LE officers have been trailing the criminals they fight in weapons technology for as long as I can remember. We need them to have the best and most effective tools available to make the idea of fighting against them so abhorrent to criminals that their motivation for committing crimes goes down substantially. If a criminal knows that taking off in a car and trying to force the LE to break off pursuit in order to protect civilians will only result in a helo taking them out with a laser targeted missile, they will be far less likely to run, since going to jail is normally more preferable to getting turned into road-kill.
Nope, the police don't need that. That's excessive. Let the National Guard take care of things that may require a vehicle like that.
Back in the day the penalty for theft was the same as murder, Death. There still was thieving, there still was murder.
I think it is hilarious to see people freaking out and losing their minds because they think the second Amendment, which covered 1 shot ball and powder weapons, gives them the right to have weapons of mass war and carnage.
But when the Police want to have the ability to counter these mass weapons of war, they do a 180 and want the police to have 1 shot ball and powder weapons.
The hypocrisy is mind boggling..
Was there the same amount of theft and murder that there would have been without those laws?
It's a sad thing to have to resort to forcing people to prove that something that didn't happen, could have happened...
So what about the people who aren't going to come with their hands up and have an armory of weapons they bought on the black market?? Do we simply send in our officers with batons and shields?? I'm a conservative and I'm not afraid of criminals. What I want is for criminals to be afraid of LE. Right now, they aren't.
Again with the "what ifs"
The point is that this will not be a determent.
It's a sad thing to have to explain that the only reality we have is the one we're in right now. What could have happened didn't happen, and there is no changing that.
You can't prove that it won't reduce crime and neither can I. You're asking to prove that something didn't happen and that's a dishonest debate tactic. Instead of doing that, how about engaging in honest debate?? Look at the facts of what happens in most human interactions when one person has the power to enforce their will on another. If our LE has the ability to stop a criminal act using superior weapons, that reduces the possibility of that act being carried out. It does not stop it altogether, but it does reduce the number of incidences, since the basic human nature of self-preservation reinforces the idea that fighting a superior enemy means losing the fight. There people who will ignore that and fight any way, but most will not. Take an extreme example: Put four highly armed Navy Seals (with blanket permission to shoot anyone who is even rude to the clerk) in the convenience store in this country with the highest rate of armed robbery. Suddenly, the store goes from having the most robberies to the least and has a very polite clientele. Why? Because they understand that they are going to lose if they are dumb enough to try to rob the store or even call the clerk a jerk. Right now, our criminals understand that they can fight LE and win and that ENCOURAGES their criminal activity. We need to make it so that they understand that they WILL lose if they fight LE and DISCOURAGE them. This isn't a 100% cure for the problem of crime, it's a step in the right direction.
You can't prove that it won't reduce crime and neither can I. You're asking to prove that something didn't happen and that's a dishonest debate tactic. Instead of doing that, how about engaging in honest debate?? Look at the facts of what happens in most human interactions when one person has the power to enforce their will on another. If our LE has the ability to stop a criminal act using superior weapons, that reduces the possibility of that act being carried out. It does not stop it altogether, but it does reduce the number of incidences, since the basic human nature of self-preservation reinforces the idea that fighting a superior enemy means losing the fight. There people who will ignore that and fight any way, but most will not. Take an extreme example: Put four highly armed Navy Seals (with blanket permission to shoot anyone who is even rude to the clerk) in the convenience store in this country with the highest rate of armed robbery. Suddenly, the store goes from having the most robberies to the least and has a very polite clientele. Why? Because they understand that they are going to lose if they are dumb enough to try to rob the store or even call the clerk a jerk. Right now, our criminals understand that they can fight LE and win and that ENCOURAGES their criminal activity. We need to make it so that they understand that they WILL lose if they fight LE and DISCOURAGE them. This isn't a 100% cure for the problem of crime, it's a step in the right direction.
Not an entirely unreasonable point in general terms. This is specifically about a heavy truck though. Cry wolf over that and nobody will take you seriously when you have real issues to complain about.The response is well deserved, considering. No, I'm very mindful, very mindful when I see increased police hostility to the people, increased powers of authority being taken (not given, but taken), increased militarization of police departments which face no credible threat that you propose, the armament of government agencies which needn't be. I'm mindful of all of these things. Don't try to dismiss legitimate concerns as mindless acts of panic, I don't panic, I don't cry "ze Germans are coming ze Germans are coming". I do however take note and point out when government is overstepping its bounds.
My point was that the extreme abilities of this vehicle might be of specific use in rare situations but it's still a vehicle capable of getting people from A to B.Also, you cannot say the police will make practical use out of something that you in the breath before admit is only justified with the "what ifs" of extreme situations. That's just not, .....well,.....practical.