View Poll Results: Is making it harder for races to vote racist when the motive is not racial?

Voters
18. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes.

    13 72.22%
  • No.

    5 27.78%
Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 46

Thread: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vote?

  1. #21
    Guru
    Smeagol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    02-19-17 @ 11:35 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,147

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    #2 above is nonsense. The median annual income in Puerto Rico is under $20K which will not generate additional tax reveue close to what will then flow back to that island state.



    Puerto Rico's Economy Is In Shambles, It Must Be Rejuvenated | Fox News Latino

    EDIT: added census data

    http://www.census.gov/prod/2012pubs/acsbr11-02.pdf
    A read somewhere a big part of why Puerto Rico wants statehood now is the economic boom it would create, with Hawaii serving as precedent. Just the PR value (free pun) of statehood is likely to drive new tourism and other investment. If that happens, its likely many native Puerto Ricans as well as other Americans who've moved to the mainland due to limited economic opportunities will move there or back there. One problem many economically depressed areas suffer from is "brain drain" where people, especially younger people, who have talents and smarts move away to pursue opportunities not available locally leaving behind the lazy farts, deadbeats and people with no ambition (with exceptions, of course.) Statehood would turn momentum around. Although its likely the welfare people will still be there, there will be a huge economic boom too.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

  2. #22
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
    Not because they don't want people of other races to vote because they don't like their race. Rather they want to make it harder for certain ethnic groups to vote because its almost a given they will vote for candidates they oppose.

    I have a friend who privately acknowledged to me he supports efforts to make it difficult for certain minorities to vote because as he calls it, "a quick [political] death" would occur that would essentially permanently end the election our party to national office. He thinks however if the political opposition is kept from having total dominance by any means including making it difficult for certain ethnic groups vote, hopefully a political rock star with a charismatic personality will eventually arise and give our party a much needed reinvigoration. This provided we can maintain plausible deniability this has been a strategy.

    His support for efforts to make it hard for people of some ethnic groups to vote is not driven by dislike for their race. He has no problem with different races. He just wants his political team to not become extinct. If they voted for his political team he would be all about helping them vote. He also firmly believes if shoe was on the other foot, he thinks his opposition party would take his exact position.

    BTW: I don't think my friend has a racist bone in his body but like a lot of people when it comes to politics, is severely lacking in principle.

    Maybe I should start a poll asking "Are people against voter ID racist to assume that minorities are too stupid to get a government issued ID card/license".
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  3. #23
    Advisor
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Britain, Mother of Civilisation
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    468

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    I dispute the entire premise of this thread, and call you out for your dishonesty.

    Nobody is trying to make it harder for certain races to vote. That's a wrong-wing lie, that you apparently have chosen to try to perpetuate.

    You're obviously referring to the controversy over whether voters should be required to provide credible identification when voting, and to the wrong-wing claim that those who support such measures are doing so only to suppress black votes, as if it is somehow more difficult for a black voter to obtain suitable identification than for a voter of any other race.
    You're trying to tell me there's no racial voter suppression in the modern United States?

    Then why does this Wikipedia page exist?

    Voter suppression in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Is Wikipedia lying?

  4. #24
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Behind the Orange Curtain
    Last Seen
    01-30-15 @ 01:29 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    15,633

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Ad_Captandum View Post
    You're trying to tell me there's no racial voter suppression in the modern United States?

    Then why does this Wikipedia page exist?

    Voter suppression in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Is Wikipedia lying?
    "Is Wikipedia lying" ?

    Reliability of Wikipedia From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Expert opinion

    Librarians' views:

    In a 2004 interview with The Guardian, self-described information specialist and Internet consultant Philip Bradley said that he would not use Wikipedia and was "not aware of a single librarian who would. The main problem is the lack of authority. With printed publications, the publishers have to ensure that their data are reliable, as their livelihood depends on it. But with something like this, all that goes out the window."

    Academia:

    Academics have also criticized Wikipedia for its perceived failure as a reliable source, and because Wikipedia editors may have no expertise, competence or credentials in the topic. Adrian Riskin, a mathematician in Whittier College commented that while highly technical articles may be written by mathematicians for mathematicians, the more general maths topics, such as the article on polynomials are written in a very amateurish fashion with a number of obvious mistakes

    Science and medicine:

    Science and medicine are areas where accuracy is of high importance and peer review is the norm. While some of Wikipedia's content has passed a form of peer review, most has not


    Susceptibility to bias:

    Individual bias and the WikiScanner toolMain article: WikiScanner
    In August 2007, WikiScanner, a tool developed by Virgil Griffith of the California Institute of Technology, was released to match anonymous IP edits in the encyclopedia with an extensive database of addresses. News stories appeared about IP addresses from various organizations such as the Central Intelligence Agency, the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee, Diebold, Inc. and the (conservative led) Australian government being used to make edits to Wikipedia articles, sometimes of an opinionated or questionable nature

    Reliability of Wikipedia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    Wikipedia:General disclaimer

    WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY

    Wikipedia is an online open-content collaborative encyclopedia; that is, a voluntary association of individuals and groups working to develop a common resource of human knowledge. The structure of the project allows anyone with an Internet connection to alter its content. Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information.

    Wikipedia:General disclaimer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

  5. #25
    Advisor
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Britain, Mother of Civilisation
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    468

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by APACHERAT View Post
    "Is Wikipedia lying" ?

    Reliability of Wikipedia From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Expert opinion

    Librarians' views:

    In a 2004 interview with The Guardian, self-described information specialist and Internet consultant Philip Bradley said that he would not use Wikipedia and was "not aware of a single librarian who would. The main problem is the lack of authority. With printed publications, the publishers have to ensure that their data are reliable, as their livelihood depends on it. But with something like this, all that goes out the window."

    Academia:

    Academics have also criticized Wikipedia for its perceived failure as a reliable source, and because Wikipedia editors may have no expertise, competence or credentials in the topic. Adrian Riskin, a mathematician in Whittier College commented that while highly technical articles may be written by mathematicians for mathematicians, the more general maths topics, such as the article on polynomials are written in a very amateurish fashion with a number of obvious mistakes

    Science and medicine:

    Science and medicine are areas where accuracy is of high importance and peer review is the norm. While some of Wikipedia's content has passed a form of peer review, most has not


    Susceptibility to bias:

    Individual bias and the WikiScanner toolMain article: WikiScanner
    In August 2007, WikiScanner, a tool developed by Virgil Griffith of the California Institute of Technology, was released to match anonymous IP edits in the encyclopedia with an extensive database of addresses. News stories appeared about IP addresses from various organizations such as the Central Intelligence Agency, the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee, Diebold, Inc. and the (conservative led) Australian government being used to make edits to Wikipedia articles, sometimes of an opinionated or questionable nature

    Reliability of Wikipedia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    Wikipedia:General disclaimer

    WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY

    Wikipedia is an online open-content collaborative encyclopedia; that is, a voluntary association of individuals and groups working to develop a common resource of human knowledge. The structure of the project allows anyone with an Internet connection to alter its content. Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information.

    Wikipedia:General disclaimer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    So, all of this is indeed to say that you don't believe Wikipedia. Correct?

  6. #26
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Behind the Orange Curtain
    Last Seen
    01-30-15 @ 01:29 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    15,633

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Ad_Captandum View Post
    So, all of this is indeed to say that you don't believe Wikipedia. Correct?
    I don't use or recognize Wikipedia being a credible or reliable source.

    I've used Wikipedia in the past but I always check the sources that were used and I go to the "Talk Page" to see who wrote the articles and what is being said by those who either wrote the articles or are editing them.

    If you're going to use Wikipedia as a source, it's a good chance you could be misinformed and remember, that's how Obama got elected because of an uninformed or misinformed electorate.

    Zogby Poll:

    Of Obama voters, 86.9 % thought that Palin said that she could see Russia from her "house," even though that was Tina Fey who said that!!

  7. #27
    Guru
    Smeagol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    02-19-17 @ 11:35 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,147

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Maybe I should start a poll asking "Are people against voter ID racist to assume that minorities are too stupid to get a government issued ID card/license".
    The truth is in at least one state data showed a significant number of minority voters took advantage of early voting on Sunday afternoon after church. Many predominantly black churches provided transportation to the polls using church vans. Its likely some of their members had limited access to transportation and even were able to go to church thanks to their church's transportation services ministry. In order to "save money " the state cancelled early voting on Sunday afternoon. This had nothing to do with a lack of ID, being unable to afford it or being too stupid. It was about convenience, a lack of access to transportation and possible being a shut-in and/or physically disabled American. These concerns were brought to the attention of the leaders of the state prior to the election and it fell on deaf ears. On Election Day it backfired in their faces.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/14/us...lost.html?_r=0
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

  8. #28
    Global Moderator
    Moderator

    Zyphlin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    NoMoAuchie
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    47,937

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    No, I don't assume that unless the reasons they suggest are clearly racist in my head.

    As it comes to Peurto Rico...

    That's not "racist". Ignorant, bigoted, sure you could make those claims. But the argumnet you've presented that is being made about Peurto Rico isn't based on their race or ethnicity, but based on the believed voting habits of the country. The motivation MIGHT be racist in nature, but I would not ASSUME that it is simply based on what you've provided.

  9. #29
    Guru
    Smeagol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Last Seen
    02-19-17 @ 11:35 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,147

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    No, I don't assume that unless the reasons they suggest are clearly racist in my head.

    As it comes to Peurto Rico...

    That's not "racist". Ignorant, bigoted, sure you could make those claims. But the argumnet you've presented that is being made about Peurto Rico isn't based on their race or ethnicity, but based on the believed voting habits of the country. The motivation MIGHT be racist in nature, but I would not ASSUME that it is simply based on what you've provided.

    Good insight but that said, perception is reality and in the minds of a lot of minorities whose history involves cruel and inhumane efforts to deny their parents and grandparents access to voting because of race or how their race votes, its a perception that to them is reality. In 2012 it motivated them to camp out in tents to be the first to vote at the opening of the early voting polls and stand in line to almost midnight to cast their votes on election day. The minority turnout in 2012 was huge and it was Republicans that motivated them to get to the polls.
    Last edited by Smeagol; 06-09-14 at 11:29 AM.
    Having opinions all over the map is a good sign of a person capable of autonomous thinking. Felix -2011

  10. #30
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:23 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,067

    Re: Do you assume ppl are racist if they want to make it hard for others races to vot

    Quote Originally Posted by Smeagol View Post
    The truth is in at least one state data showed a significant number of minority voters took advantage of early voting on Sunday afternoon after church. Many predominantly black churches provided transportation to the polls using church vans. Its likely some of their members had limited access to transportation and even were able to go to church thanks to their church's transportation services ministry. In order to "save money " the state cancelled early voting on Sunday afternoon. This had nothing to do with a lack of ID, being unable to afford it or being too stupid. It was about convenience, a lack of access to transportation and possible being a shut-in and/or physically disabled American. These concerns were brought to the attention of the leaders of the state prior to the election and it fell on deaf ears.

    1.There is nothing wrong with voting on the day of the election.
    2.On the day of the election there are hundreds of polling places/stations open all over the city at most within 2-4 blocks depending on population size and density. If you live in a city then you can you to your county election board website and see all the polling place locations listed.

    On Election Day it backfired in their faces.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/14/us...lost.html?_r=0
    So obviously having people vote on election day and requiring that government issued IDs be presented did not stop people from voting.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 06-09-14 at 03:23 PM.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •