View Poll Results: The Greatest Empire in History?

Voters
58. You may not vote on this poll
  • Persian Empire

    0 0%
  • Roman Empire

    30 51.72%
  • Han Empire

    4 6.90%
  • Mayan Empire

    0 0%
  • Mongol Empire

    3 5.17%
  • Portuguese Empire

    0 0%
  • Spanish Empire

    0 0%
  • Russian Empire

    1 1.72%
  • French Empire

    2 3.45%
  • British Empire

    27 46.55%
Multiple Choice Poll.
Page 2 of 11 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 109

Thread: The Greatest Empire in History

  1. #11
    Sage
    Higgins86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    13,249

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    The British Empire clearly for me since it industrialised the world.


    Roman empire was all but forgotten during the dark ages.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

  2. #12
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaius46 View Post
    Rome was effectively global given what the known world looked like to them at the time.

    And Americanized, quite frankly means Romanized to a large extent given how Rome influenced - and still influences - Europe and America
    That such a large part of the world was unknown to them at the time is precisely why Rome's influence and power were weaker than America's current position.

    Your second point is valid, and it begs the question whether in this poll we should consider the lasting influence of the empire, or simply its relative power at the time.

  3. #13
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainman05 View Post
    yeah that's right, compare the USA today with a civilization that existed in a whole different era. In a pre-industrial revolution era.

    Yeah, you sure are #1 all time. That comment proves it beyond doubt.



    EDIT: This isn't an attempt to mock america or americans. But to mock the mentality of Peter Grimm and the likes of him.
    Your picture exemplifies precisely what I don't like about Americanization. The Walmart, microwave culture. I much prefer the cobblestone streets of Europe with its locally owned cafe's and charm.

    I think the legacy America will leave on the world, what it will be most remembered for, is it's enterprising nature. Americans are distinctively commercial-minded, enterprising, entrepreneurial, and innovative.

    Americans create, package, sell, and profit better than anyone in the history of the world; and that is both our biggest strength as well as our biggest weakness.

  4. #14
    Imposition of miscellany
    NoC_T's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Last Seen
    11-25-17 @ 04:57 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    11,193

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Soon as I caught the thread title, I thought 'Yep. Here we go. Europe vs America. Yay.'

  5. #15
    Advisor
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Britain, Mother of Civilisation
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Socialist
    Posts
    468

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    First, I think America sucks in a lot of major ways so don't get the false impression that I'm over here rooting for "team America." Objectively and rationally, though, you'd have to be a fool not to see the influence America exerts on the rest of the world.
    Of course the US has huge influence over the rest of the world -- nobody is arguing there. I'm merely arguing that A) It's not that powerful relative to other powerful nations in context and B) Much of what you think is American influence is really European, specifically British influence, because the US is fundamentally an Anglo- European culture, as I'll prove forthwith.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    The majority of that influence is not centralized nor is it intentional. For example and incidentally, we are communicating via the internet (an American invention), hosted on an American server.
    We're using the World Wide Web, which was developed by Briton Sir Tim Berners-Lee. The Internet itself I'm not sure you can really claim as a single invention; it's more a method of communication, like writing. Writing certainly had no single inventor -- it was a synergistic agreement and collaboration between many.

    Still, I'd argue that Briton Donald Davies was the first to conceive of the idea that would become the Internet through his Mark I programme, based on packet-switched computer networking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    You are probably listening to some form of modern music (jazz, blues, rock, hip hop, rap, etc all invented in America),
    Equally I could be listening to ska, punk, folk, electronic, dubstep, house, trance, drum and bass, or reggae.

    It is certainly true that the vast majority of music listened to around the world is not American, nor from any one country.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    or watching television (American invention),
    Scottish invention, courtesy of John Logie Baird. Seriously, look at what the Scots have invented. It's actually crazy.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    or enjoying indoor lighting (American),
    Another British invention, actually, courtesy of Humphry Davy, a Cornish guy, meaning they can finally be proud that Cornwall has done anything, ever. Though you'll get no argument from me that Thomas Edison made the *best* lightbulb of the era.



    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    or driving your car (American)
    A French invention. Nicolas-Joseph Cugnot invented the first automobile that we could vaguely recognise as a car in 1769. You're probably thinking of Henry Ford, who very certainly did NOT invent the first car -- he popularised a particular type of production method for them.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    or flying a plane (American) etc etc etc.
    This one I'll give you! I'm a big fan of the United States, and I don't mean to drag its name through the mud. I simply can't abide the idea that you think the US has done everything important ever -- not only does it devalue what other nations have contributed, it devalues your own country.



    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    A large part of America's greater influence relative to the other empires on your list is simply the fact that in the modern world, we are all much more connected. In the days of the Empire (British), someone in China or Saudi Arabia could be fairly insulated from British influence. Today, you can go to the most remote corners of the world, for example the jungles of Africa, and young men will listen to American rap music and wear t-shirts and jeans (American inventions both).

    Some of America's influence and power is most certainly centralized and intentional. For example, I think we have something nutty like half the world's military spending or something like that. I'd have to check. Either way, it's ridiculous and overt hegemony. We control the world's energy supply, both via strategic military intervention, and also via control of the world's currency. Speaking of currency, over half of the world's gold resides in the United States.

    The United States dominates two oceans, and takes up nearly an entire continent full of nearly every natural resource we could ever need. You can't compare that to even the British Empire at its height.
    Well I certainly can compare that to the British Empire at its height! The British Empire at its height dominated ALL the world's oceans! And all the world's trade by sea, and all the world's stocks, and all the world's currency, and all the world's diplomatic affairs, and all the world's wars and conflicts, etc. etc.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post

    I would rank the British Empire at #2.


    I think the best argument one could make for the Roman Empire is the lasting effects it's had on the world we live in today. Roman culture shaped Western European culture (and eastern, to an extent), which in turn shaped American culture.

    So in that sense, it depends greatly on how you define "greatest." Relative to its own time, the Americans win. Taking in to consideration the cumulative and lingering effects of the empire, the Romans take the prize.

    In essence, I think you do not understand the scope of the influence of the British Empire. America's influence truly pales in comparison -- though this is not an insult, I very much think of the US as something of a successor to Britain.

    You're very wrong to think America's influence was actually anywhere near as pervasive as Britain's. You cite things (some of which just proved false) like American music, or American corporations. Britain does you one better on all of these charges and more:

    Britain has given the world industrialism. The computer you're typing on? The chair you sit on? The house you live in? All because of Britain's truly unprecedented (in all of human history) decision to try something totally new instead of mercantilism and human labour.

    Britain has given the world institutional organisation -- bureaucracy as we know it, in fact, is a product of Britain ruling half the world from one city on one island. The transport you take, the food you eat, the railroads and roads that service it all -- British.

    Britain has given the world international diplomacy. The idea that nations can treat with each-other in a society of states is a direct product of the British Empire's meddling in the affairs of literally every nation on Earth.

    The language you speak (English), the concepts you adore (democracy, the rule of law, sovereignty), the means by which your life operates (wage work, entrepreneurism, corporations), and the very society of nations that we find ourselves in (the UN, NATO, the EU, etc.) are all directly a product of the British Empire.

  6. #16
    Sage
    Higgins86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    13,249

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by NoC_T View Post
    Soon as I caught the thread title, I thought 'Yep. Here we go. Europe vs America. Yay.'
    Thing is most Americans I speak to actually resent America being called an empire.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

  7. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Ad_Captandum View Post
    Of course the US has huge influence over the rest of the world -- nobody is arguing there. I'm merely arguing that A) It's not that powerful relative to other powerful nations in context and B) Much of what you think is American influence is really European, specifically British influence, because the US is fundamentally an Anglo- European culture, as I'll prove forthwith.
    If American influence is really European due to our Anglo-European roots, then what is European is really Roman, due to the massive influence the Roman Empire had on shaping Europe.

  8. #18
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Ad_Captandum View Post
    We're using the World Wide Web, which was developed by Briton Sir Tim Berners-Lee. The Internet itself I'm not sure you can really claim as a single invention; it's more a method of communication, like writing. Writing certainly had no single inventor -- it was a synergistic agreement and collaboration between many.

    Still, I'd argue that Briton Donald Davies was the first to conceive of the idea that would become the Internet through his Mark I programme, based on packet-switched computer networking.
    The Internet was invented by Robert E Kahn and Vint Cerf, both Americans.

  9. #19
    Banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    The anals of history
    Last Seen
    07-25-15 @ 02:05 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    10,348

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Ad_Captandum View Post
    Equally I could be listening to ska, punk, folk, electronic, dubstep, house, trance, drum and bass, or reggae.
    All but reggae are American inventions.

  10. #20
    Sage
    Higgins86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    England
    Last Seen
    Today @ 05:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    13,249

    Re: The Greatest Empire in History

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    If American influence is really European due to our Anglo-European roots, then what is European is really Roman, due to the massive influence the Roman Empire had on shaping Europe.
    By the dark ages people had forgotten Rome and much of her ruins were not disocvered until much later. There is text in England which shows that many people thought that giants had built the massive structures left behind.
    ‘This is not peace, it is an armistice for 20 years.’ (Ferdinand Foch. After the Treaty of Versailles, 1919).

Page 2 of 11 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •