View Poll Results: Donald Sterling must sell his NBA team

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  • Yes

    23 34.33%
  • No

    44 65.67%
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Thread: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

  1. #131
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    That's nice.

    I'd vote no. What were the reasons the others said they would vote no? I haven't seen you ask them that yet. Am I so interesting that you only care about my reasons?
    Because I am always interested in understanding why those who call themselves "cons" claim that "ownership rights" trumps contracts. They don't seem to understand that even "property rights" are not exclusive, unlimited. "Property rights" are limited. As an analogy, you can own a home, but that does not mean you can violate city codes without consequence.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  2. #132
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    So then an owner can do anything, can damage the brand in real terms.....and the franchisees should not, cannot, strip that franchisee of his/her rights?
    I'd like to address this one... I respect that there is a morals/public behavior clause that applies to the owners of an NBA franchises. I just don't feel that an owner who expresses his thoughts and feelings in private to a member of his family (or in this case to someone he is in a relationship with) in his own home, should be subject to losing his franchise. He did not publicly make racist comments or in any way act in such a manner that any reasonable person could conclude put the league, it's members, or other owners at financial risk. He did what every American has the constitutional right to do... He expressed his own thoughts and beliefs in the privacy of his own home, and there is no way anyone is going to tell me that in doings so, Sterling violated anything.

    To strip the man of the team he bought and paid for, brings to mind "thought police", 1930's Germany and Castro's Cuba, where you can't freely express your thoughts even in the privacy of your own home. The NBA may have legal grounds to force him out, but I'm not making a legal argument, I'm making a principled one.


    Understand, if Sterling would have had that conversation at a restaurant, in a parking lot, at work, or anyplace else where there was no expectation of complete and total privacy, then I would have no problem voting him out. But because there was an expectation of privacy, to punish him smacks in the face of everything America is supposed to stand for.

  3. #133
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    I'd like to address this one... I respect that there is a morals/public behavior clause that applies to the owners of an NBA franchises. I just don't feel that an owner who expresses his thoughts and feelings in private to a member of his family (or in this case to someone he is in a relationship with) in his own home, should be subject to losing his franchise. He did not publicly make racist comments or in any way act in such a manner that any reasonable person could conclude put the league, it's members, or other owners at financial risk. He did what every American has the constitutional right to do... He expressed his own thoughts and beliefs in the privacy of his own home, and there is no way anyone is going to tell me that in doings so, Sterling violated anything.

    To strip the man of the team he bought and paid for, brings to mind "thought police", 1930's Germany and Castro's Cuba, where you can't freely express your thoughts even in the privacy of your own home. The NBA may have legal grounds to force him out, but I'm not making a legal argument, I'm making a principled one.


    Understand, if Sterling would have had that conversation at a restaurant, in a parking lot, at work, or anyplace else where there was no expectation of complete and total privacy, then I would have no problem voting him out. But because there was an expectation of privacy, to punish him smacks in the face of everything America is supposed to stand for.
    Once the racist comments become out, privacy doesn't matter, it cannot be used as defense. The damage is done. The issue becomes whether or not the league can afford to keep as a member someone who holds to the views, no matter how those views came to light.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  4. #134
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Because I am always interested in understanding why those who call themselves "cons" claim that "ownership rights" trumps contracts. They don't seem to understand that even "property rights" are not exclusive, unlimited. "Property rights" are limited. As an analogy, you can own a home, but that does not mean you can violate city codes without consequence.
    I don't know any cons.

  5. #135
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    I'd like to address this one... I respect that there is a morals/public behavior clause that applies to the owners of an NBA franchises. I just don't feel that an owner who expresses his thoughts and feelings in private to a member of his family (or in this case to someone he is in a relationship with) in his own home, should be subject to losing his franchise. He did not publicly make racist comments or in any way act in such a manner that any reasonable person could conclude put the league, it's members, or other owners at financial risk. He did what every American has the constitutional right to do... He expressed his own thoughts and beliefs in the privacy of his own home, and there is no way anyone is going to tell me that in doings so, Sterling violated anything.

    To strip the man of the team he bought and paid for, brings to mind "thought police", 1930's Germany and Castro's Cuba, where you can't freely express your thoughts even in the privacy of your own home. The NBA may have legal grounds to force him out, but I'm not making a legal argument, I'm making a principled one.


    Understand, if Sterling would have had that conversation at a restaurant, in a parking lot, at work, or anyplace else where there was no expectation of complete and total privacy, then I would have no problem voting him out. But because there was an expectation of privacy, to punish him smacks in the face of everything America is supposed to stand for.
    Well said, Grim.

  6. #136
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I don't know any cons.
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    Is this your weak azz attempt to avoid discussing the limitation of "property rights"?

    A: Yes, it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  7. #137
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
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    Is this your weak azz attempt to avoid discussing the limitation of "property rights"?

    A: Yes, it is.
    I'm a conservative. I'm not a con. I don't know any cons.

    How are you making out getting the others who said they would vote no to articulate their reasons?

  8. #138
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I'm a conservative. I'm not a con. I don't know any cons.

    How are you making out getting the others who said they would vote no to articulate their reasons?
    Um, my commenting in this thread is not exclusive to you....but then you miss many things.

    This is just further diversion from your inability to discuss your understanding of your "property rights" concepts and their limitations.
    Quote Originally Posted by trouble13 View Post
    If you wanna know why Trumpsters are ignoring you its for the same reason you ignored the KKKs complaints about Obama.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

  9. #139
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    Um, my commenting in this thread is not exclusive to you....but then you miss many things.

    This is just further diversion from your inability to discuss your understanding of your "property rights" concepts and their limitations.
    I believe in personal ownership rights. He paid for the franchise. I wouldn't vote to remove him of what he paid for.

    Conservatives versus non-conservatives aren't the issue here, are they?

    Did I miss your posts where you asked others, conservative or liberal, do defend why they would vote "no"? I'll have to go back and read the thread. Obviously I did miss those posts.

  10. #140
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    Re: Would you vote to take the Clippers from Donald Sterling?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    I'd like to address this one... I respect that there is a morals/public behavior clause that applies to the owners of an NBA franchises. I just don't feel that an owner who expresses his thoughts and feelings in private to a member of his family (or in this case to someone he is in a relationship with) in his own home, should be subject to losing his franchise. He did not publicly make racist comments or in any way act in such a manner that any reasonable person could conclude put the league, it's members, or other owners at financial risk. He did what every American has the constitutional right to do... He expressed his own thoughts and beliefs in the privacy of his own home, and there is no way anyone is going to tell me that in doings so, Sterling violated anything.

    To strip the man of the team he bought and paid for, brings to mind "thought police", 1930's Germany and Castro's Cuba, where you can't freely express your thoughts even in the privacy of your own home. The NBA may have legal grounds to force him out, but I'm not making a legal argument, I'm making a principled one.


    Understand, if Sterling would have had that conversation at a restaurant, in a parking lot, at work, or anyplace else where there was no expectation of complete and total privacy, then I would have no problem voting him out. But because there was an expectation of privacy, to punish him smacks in the face of everything America is supposed to stand for.
    You're missing something very important in this debate. The other owners would not vote him out to in your word to punish him. They would vote against him because they felt what he did tarnished the NBA brand and therefore hurt their investment in the NBA.


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