View Poll Results: Are police units going too far by being overly militarized?

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  • Yes

    54 87.10%
  • No

    7 11.29%
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Thread: Are Cops Too Militarized?

  1. #161
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    What militarization of the police? The things discussed int he OP are for the most part keeping up with technology. are you against the police keeping up with technology?

    I suspect part of the reliance on more powerful equipment is the slavish campaign to reduce municipal budgets thereby costing police jobs and positions and the difference then has to be made up in equipment rather than bodies. And it was a right wing desire to slash taxes and government that was the impetus for this.


    "A decade of billions in spending in the name of homeland security has armed local police departments with military-style equipment and a new commando mentality. But has it gone too far? Andrew Becker and G.W. Schulz of the Center for Investigative Reporting report.

    Nestled amid plains so flat the locals joke you can watch your dog run away for miles, Fargo treasures its placid lifestyle, seldom pierced by the mayhem and violence common in other urban communities. North Dakota’s largest city has averaged fewer than two homicides a year since 2005, and there’s not been a single international terrorism prosecution in the last decade.

    But that hasn’t stopped authorities in Fargo and its surrounding county from going on an $8 million buying spree to arm police officers with the sort of gear once reserved only for soldiers fighting foreign wars.

    Every city squad car is equipped today with a military-style assault rifle, and officers can don Kevlar helmets able to withstand incoming fire from battlefield-grade ammunition. And for that epic confrontation—if it ever occurs—officers can now summon a new $256,643 armored truck, complete with a rotating turret. For now, though, the menacing truck is used mostly for training and appearances at the annual city picnic, where it’s been parked near the children’s bounce house....

    The buying spree has transformed local police departments into small, army-like forces, and put intimidating equipment into the hands of civilian officers. And that is raising questions about whether the strategy has gone too far, creating a culture and capability that jeopardizes public safety and civil rights while creating an expensive false sense of security...

    In Montgomery County, Texas, the sheriff’s department owns a $300,000 pilotless surveillance drone, like those used to hunt down al Qaeda terrorists in the remote tribal regions of Pakistan and Afghanistan. In Augusta, Maine, with fewer than 20,000 people and where an officer hasn’t died from gunfire in the line of duty in more than 125 years, police bought eight $1,500 tactical vests. Police in Des Moines, Iowa, bought two $180,000 bomb-disarming robots, while an Arizona sheriff is now the proud owner of a surplus Army tank.

    The flood of money opened to local police after 9/11, but slowed slightly in recent years. Still, the Department of Homeland Security awarded more than $2 billion in grants to local police in 2011, and President Obama’s 2009 American Recovery and Reinvestment Act contributed an additional half-billion dollars."

  2. #162
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Arguably the beginning of the trend



    "Feb. 18, 1986: A Los Angeles Police Department battering ram sits next to a South Los Angeles home damaged during a police raid. The house was suspected of being a center for drug dealing. A Uzi submachine gun and eight other firearms were found inside. A second nearby home also was raided. Seven suspects were detained.

    It was the fifth time the six-ton armored vehicle equipped with a 14-foot steel battering ram had been used in LAPD raids."
    LAPD battering ram - Framework - Photos and Video - Visual Storytelling from the Los Angeles Times

  3. #163
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    What? Is this a serious question?

    Let's not forget that the "war on drugs" is not just an American thing. Other countries have adopted this policy at our urging as well. See links below.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/11/op...so11.html?_r=0

    War on Drugs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Im sorry.... I don't think you seem to understand..

    I didn't ask what the War on Drugs is.

    I asked what the "fallout" you mentioned is.

    The point I am getting at is that your original post I responded to seems to imply that if the war on drugs went away, suddenly the inner city trash neighborhoods would suddenly become like the more peaceful suburbia.

  4. #164
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Im sorry.... I don't think you seem to understand..

    I didn't ask what the War on Drugs is.

    I asked what the "fallout" you mentioned is.

    The point I am getting at is that your original post I responded to seems to imply that if the war on drugs went away, suddenly the inner city trash neighborhoods would suddenly become like the more peaceful suburbia.
    Obviously you didn't read the links. It's all stated therein.

  5. #165
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    When in our history did the American right wing begin the hard turn against law enforcement? At one time American conservatives and support for law enforcement went hand in hand. Now, its obvious that the hate for government that is part and parcel of libertarianism has been extended to law enforcement. When did this devolution happen?
    Libertarians are neither right-winged nor conservative. Perhaps this is the stem of your confusion?

  6. #166
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And denying what every dictionary tells us only makes one ignorant.

    Dictionary.com at least defines police as a civil organization.

    The police aren't subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice, they are subject to the civil law of their jurisdiction. Hence they are not a military organization.

    They may act in a military fashion, they may have a military style chain of command but the police is not a military organization.

    The problem is one of mindset. The military views the people it comes into conflict with as "the enemy" and largely deals with them by killing them. The proper mindset for policing is completely different.
    Don't be a grammar nazi - Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, Book 1 #7

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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Liberals/lefties have been concerned about the militarization of the police, pre-conviction property seizures, police accountability, the right to protest peacefully, racial profiling, sentencing disparities impacting minorities and poor people, criminalization of young people and are against the war of drugs for decades. In my view this is a more mature and nuanced view compared to the of the old anti-cop attitudes. It also reflects some of the successes in making the police more accountable and community oriented.

    The right has become more anti-authoritarian since Obama was elected because they feel that conservatives are no longer in control of the establishment the way they used to be. Most of them will probably return to being authoritarian if and when Republicans/conservatives/white men get more of their power back.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Poor people, minorities and counter culture people have felt like the police are an occupational army for a very long time, now that they are worried about gun control and minorities in power, white conservatives are experiencing what it feels like.
    Whats with the obsession with race?

    Why 'dey gotta be white?

  8. #168
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisL View Post
    Obviously you didn't read the links. It's all stated therein.
    You posted a link talking about a narcotic drugs convention in Vienna and a Wikipedia article discussing the War on Drugs in general.

    Neither of these describe the "fallout" of the war on drugs and how it is the sole reason why there is violent crime in the inner city neighborhoods.

    You also ignored my comment as to what you are implying via this.... So I'll ask a question instead...

    Do you believe if the war on drugs ended tomorrow that we would see inner city crime-ridden gang-ridden neighborhoods become peaceful family friendly neighborhoods?

  9. #169
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard Truth View Post
    Arguably the beginning of the trend



    "Feb. 18, 1986: A Los Angeles Police Department battering ram sits next to a South Los Angeles home damaged during a police raid. The house was suspected of being a center for drug dealing. A Uzi submachine gun and eight other firearms were found inside. A second nearby home also was raided. Seven suspects were detained.

    It was the fifth time the six-ton armored vehicle equipped with a 14-foot steel battering ram had been used in LAPD raids."
    LAPD battering ram - Framework - Photos and Video - Visual Storytelling from the Los Angeles Times
    Did you miss the bolded part of your own post? That sort of manpower and armament is what the police are facing and you're complaining because the police respond in kind? What do you expect them to do, send the community service volunteers up to the door with cookies?

    The American police must NEVER lose, they must never back down. When that starts happening, as giddy as it would make the Liberals, Americans are doomed. You fill the country with America hating foreigners, worship homegrown predatory cultures that have no respect for the law, the property of others or authority and you want the police disarmed?

    Give the police whatever they want to do their job and go home safe, screw the Liberal whiners.

    If you make it impossible for the police to protect Americans, you will then see the justifiable rise of nationwide vigilantism. If you would be more comfortable with that, then keep attacking the police.
    Last edited by Ray410; 05-20-14 at 02:41 PM.

  10. #170
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    Re: Are Cops Too Militarized?

    A better mouse trap begets a better mouse begets a better mouse trap...

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