• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

High school exit exams

Do you think exit exams are fair

  • Yes, we let kids off too easy, they need to prove themselves

    Votes: 27 60.0%
  • No, this can devastate and humiliate a teen

    Votes: 3 6.7%
  • It's only fair if the teen failed other classes

    Votes: 5 11.1%
  • The teen should still be able to walk just not get a diploma

    Votes: 1 2.2%
  • Other

    Votes: 9 20.0%

  • Total voters
    45

herenow1

DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 25, 2007
Messages
1,686
Reaction score
928
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Over the past several years some states have implemented passing exit exams be required for graduation. 26 states have made this a requirement.If a child passes all of their classes, even if they're an A B student, they can't walk or graduate b/c they didn't pass an exit exam. Some of the tests include questions the teachers haven't even covered. Granted you have 4 yrs to pass it, BUT not everyone does well on tests. Do you think this is fair? Do you think it's fair that a child goes to school, passes all his classes, graduates to the next grade each year, yet he/she can't walk all b/c they fail a test?
 
Over the past several years some states have implemented passing exit exams be required for graduation. 26 states have made this a requirement.If a child passes all of their classes, even if they're an A B student, they can't walk or graduate b/c they didn't pass an exit exam. Some of the tests include questions the teachers haven't even covered. Granted you have 4 yrs to pass it, BUT not everyone does well on tests. Do you think this is fair? Do you think it's fair that a child goes to school, passes all his classes, graduates to the next grade each year, yet he/she can't walk all b/c they fail a test?

I suspect it's designed to combat teachers giving students a passing grade for something they didn't actually pass (not sure how much that actually happens), and probably to combat students who cheated on class tests.

Or something.

That said, Ithink many/most tests only really measure memorization skills, not actual skill/knowledge of the subject.

Of course with memorized information, skill and knowledge can be learned through application of same, I suppose.
 
(not sure how much that actually happens)

It happens a hell of a lot more than most people realize or would admit. Most school districts can not hold a kid back, even if they get across the board F's, if the parents do not initiate it. Considering the lack of parenting and parental involvement, that leads to LOADS of kids that should never graduate…
 
As long as the test makers stick to the basics of reading, writing, math, science, history and don't go off into some esoteric subject that students may not have taken, I think they're a good idea.
 
My son graduates next week, one of his friends isn't b/c he failed the test and is devastated. I feel bad for him, he's a good kid. I know if they had this requirement when I was in HS I wouldn't have graduated b/c I would have failed the math portion. You have to pass all three, math, science ,and English. I was terrible at math and only made it to pre algebra. If it wasn't division, multiplication, adding and subtracting, it was Greek to me. I just think it's stupid, especially in states where the school systems are the lowest ranking!
 
I graduated 5 years ago(holy **** it's been 5 years already! :lol:) and took these tests. They are SO FREAKING EASY! On every test but the math I finished them all in like 15 minutes, the math took me 30 minutes, and I scored in the top 5 percentile in every subject. So yeah, they aren't that hard.
 
I graduated 5 years ago(holy **** it's been 5 years already! :lol:) and took these tests. They are SO FREAKING EASY! On every test but the math I finished them all in like 15 minutes, the math took me 30 minutes, and I scored in the top 5 percentile in every subject. So yeah, they aren't that hard.
Damn.

And all this time I thought you were older than I am, for some reason....

Seeing as I "graduated" over 10 years ago.
 
Damn.

And all this time I thought you were older than I am, for some reason....

Seeing as I "graduated" over 10 years ago.

Really? :lol:

I'll take that as a compliment, I guess.
 
In my state the exams were adopted to hold schools accountable. Some schools were graduating students who were illiterate or couldn't do simple arithmetic. Obviously there's something wrong with that picture. Diplomas should not be just given away. And the exams are not that difficult as they only require a student to demonstrate a 10th grade proficiency level.
 
if we want the HS diploma to be given out for having attended school, then no metrics need be met (other than acceptable attendance)
but if that diploma is intended to identify for colleges and employers students able to learn, then yes, the kids need to pass the very low bar which is established to be identified as a HS graduate
 
Part of the problem stems from the "everyone wins" attitudes. There have lawsuits over holding students back. Some Child psycho-babilist claim that labeling children as "failures" or making them repeat grades/classes in school cause "psychological damage". Than add on all the "sports stars" that used to get passed through the system but couldn't read or write. Some of this is BS from the Federal Government, some the result of Court decisions.

I won't even go into the whole "equal" education fiasco.

Some states adopted the "exit exam" as a means of identifying those who actually got some education vs stayed in school for 12 years. Some states have also changed it since first being implemented because teachers started teaching how to pass the test, not the subjects.

All in All, it is just one more indicator in the mounds of data about how really screwed up or education systems have become.
 
It happens a hell of a lot more than most people realize or would admit. Most school districts can not hold a kid back, even if they get across the board F's, if the parents do not initiate it. Considering the lack of parenting and parental involvement, that leads to LOADS of kids that should never graduate…

Here, in high school, it's not about being held back. It's a matter of credits. If you don't pass you don't get a credit. If you don't have enough credits you don't move up. You have to have a certain number of credits to be a sophomore, etc., and you have to have a certain number to graduate.
 
My son graduates next week, one of his friends isn't b/c he failed the test and is devastated. I feel bad for him, he's a good kid. I know if they had this requirement when I was in HS I wouldn't have graduated b/c I would have failed the math portion. You have to pass all three, math, science ,and English. I was terrible at math and only made it to pre algebra. If it wasn't division, multiplication, adding and subtracting, it was Greek to me. I just think it's stupid, especially in states where the school systems are the lowest ranking!

My oldest daughter aced the test the first time she took it, she doesn't have to worry about it. My youngest daughter is going to take it next year and will ace it too. I think that school systems that are ranking low need to take this as a wake up call, they have to perform better than they have to get their students to learn the assigned lesson plan. That's all these tests do, measure how well the students are retaining information that they are taught. That's their job. I don't care if they sit in high school for decades until they can get that through their heads.
 
Damn.

And all this time I thought you were older than I am, for some reason....

Seeing as I "graduated" over 10 years ago.

Hey, don't look at me, this year is my 30 year reunion.
 
Damn.

And all this time I thought you were older than I am, for some reason....

Seeing as I "graduated" over 10 years ago.

You're both a couple of kids.
I graduated HS the same year Kennedy was elected.
Back when the anti public school self described conservatives like to say a high school diploma really meant something, unlike today, when kids are coddled etc., etc.,

We didn't have to pass any exit exam, or algebra, or anything else, and I'm at least 75% certain that the kid who sat behind me in general science, back before I wised up and started taking "college prep" classes, was illiterate. I'd bet he wasn't the only one.

Our drop out rate was around 40%, too.

So, schools have improved, and one of the improvements has been requiring graduates to prove competence in reading and math. Exit exams are a good idea.
 
You're both a couple of kids.
I graduated HS the same year Kennedy was elected.
Back when the anti public school self described conservatives like to say a high school diploma really meant something, unlike today, when kids are coddled etc., etc.,

We didn't have to pass any exit exam, or algebra, or anything else, and I'm at least 75% certain that the kid who sat behind me in general science, back before I wised up and started taking "college prep" classes, was illiterate. I'd bet he wasn't the only one.

Our drop out rate was around 40%, too.

So, schools have improved, and one of the improvements has been requiring graduates to prove competence in reading and math. Exit exams are a good idea.
Had a thought.

Perhaps if an individual so desired, they could "partially graduate", only in the subjects they passed on the exit exam, and take GED-style tests later if they wanted a complete high school diploma (or equivalent, in this case).

But that would only be an option if they showed SOME level of skill in the non-pass areas. Say...a D instead of a C (assuming a C is "pass"). If they got an F though...back to class...

The only downside to this that I see is the test part itself - some people have serious issues with tests, even if they know the subject being tested.
 
Damn.

And all this time I thought you were older than I am, for some reason....

Seeing as I "graduated" over 10 years ago.

Ditto! I always kinda "looked up" to Your Star, and I'm class of 2002.

Turning 30 this year... I'm gonna be OLD! :boohoo:
 
I graduated in 98, the tests were a joke. I think they should keep them in the schools. I also took the ASVAB and it wasn't too hard, though I did check a book out of the library to "study" for it. I recommend doing that BTW just so you can get the highest score possible. I took never took the SAT/ACT. I have a BS and MS. You earn what you learned.
 
If I HS student gets good grades but can't pass the graduation exam the school cheated thoset student by not teaching the appropriate material.

I would like to see the K-12 school system merged with the community colleges and public trade schools so that there is less stigma and there are more opportunities for people who screwed up in high school and want to catch up and move forward with their education.
 
If I HS student gets good grades but can't pass the graduation exam the school cheated thoset student by not teaching the appropriate material.

I would like to see the K-12 school system merged with the community colleges and public trade schools so that there is less stigma and there are more opportunities for people who screwed up in high school and want to catch up and move forward with their education.
while that is a possibility, that the student got good grades on material irrelevant to the-end-of-school test topics, i believe there are multiple other explanations. explanations which would reveal that the school was not at fault for the student's failure
 
As a student in College, I can say that there is already way to much standardized testing. This could devastate kids at a level that would follow them all their lives. If it has to exist, give it to the kids with 2.0 and less gpa's, that way it can be tested whether they need another year. The kids above that are usually doing fine, and they should not have to take it because it is unnecessary.

Also, what are the topics? i went to high school where i could choose most of my courses (i had control over the pace, whether it was AP/pre-AP,i could choose the electives) If it is the same in other schools, there would be to much diversity for a successful standardized test.
 
My oldest daughter aced the test the first time she took it, she doesn't have to worry about it. My youngest daughter is going to take it next year and will ace it too. I think that school systems that are ranking low need to take this as a wake up call, they have to perform better than they have to get their students to learn the assigned lesson plan. That's all these tests do, measure how well the students are retaining information that they are taught. That's their job. I don't care if they sit in high school for decades until they can get that through their heads.

I don't care either.

Realistically, one way or another, at 19 (at least in my state) they're free not to attend anymore.

It may take another ten years to see what "social promotions" and "entitlement" and so on hath wrought. But I can testify that the "best and brightest" in college too often are not and wouldn't have made it to college ten years ago. Many, many can't do math, are historically and culturally illiterate, and cannot comprehend what they read in a newspaper article (much less a thoughtful essay).

Because, in defiance of scientific law, the sickening culture of measurement and assessment has trickled upward into academia, professors are now being "encouraged" to let all students know that they too can be "successful" in their classes.

In plain English, the pressure is on to inflate grades even on the college level. Failure, after all, is only "delayed success," and "everybody is a winner." Except that this often is a lie, and it's better to face your deficits and either overcome them or accept them. Sorry, you don't have what it takes to attend medical school, even if you've been told all your life that you can do anything if you just set your mind to it.
 
Nevada adopted such tests. Those tests are not hard at all.

This whole "doesn't test well" excuse is complete bull****.

When doing an insurance application over the phone with a confused customer it's very similar to taking a test. I'm not sure what the next answer is, it's very tense, I have to rely on information I've memorized and am able to quickly recall, the things I press on the computer screen are multiple choice. My applications are reviewed for accuracy and the phone calls are recorded.
 
while that is a possibility, that the student got good grades on material irrelevant to the-end-of-school test topics, i believe there are multiple other explanations. explanations which would reveal that the school was not at fault for the student's failure

What would explain a student getting good grades but flunking a graduation exam beside the school failing to teach the wrong material? The only scenario I can imagine is if the student cheated throughout school, but catching and/or preventing cheating is also the school's responsibility.
 
Back
Top Bottom