View Poll Results: Who is worse?

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40. You may not vote on this poll
  • Stirling (racist comments)

    5 12.50%
  • Vick (dog abuser/fighter/killer/torturer)

    33 82.50%
  • Don't know/undecided

    2 5.00%
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Thread: Sterling vs Vick

  1. #41
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    I'm having trouble wrapping my thoughts around what was actually that RACIST about Sterling's comments. Maybe I missed some of the ones that caught everyone's attention.

    Would someone please point out the worst offences?
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
    Matt. 10:32-33

  2. #42
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Making dumb comments vs killing for pleasure. Not sure why anyone would give Vick a pass.

  3. #43
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Ah, so if dog fighting was legal, you'd have no problem with Vick? Your moral beliefs are based entirely on legality, and nothing else?

    If not, then why the **** would you even pretend this is a rebuttal?



    Society is damaged when an old man in power is a racist. Can you be any more oblivious?





    You do realize that calling me dramatic and then following that accusation with what amounts to the above is what those of us with fancy book-learnin' call "ironic", right?

    Especially when you consider the fact that kids were not involved at all (in other words, bringing kids into it is simply retarded), Vick did NOT receive a hero's welcome (thus claiming he did is retarded), thus you simply made up a bunch of retarded melodramatic nonsense because, presumably, an intelligent rebuttal was something far beyond your capablities.

    Good stuff, right there. +1000 for not even trying.
    Retarded? Nice to know you socialists hate special needs people.

    Go on defending Vick. Nice to know you defend animal abusers. Enough said.

  4. #44
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Society is damaged when an old man in power is a racist. .
    and it is also damaged when people are so motivated by their fear of being considered racist that they rush in to defend a sadistic animal killer because he is black.

    Instead of trying to combat racism by creating enormous double standards, why not use the same standards to judge all people, thus truly taking a stand against racism rather than simply turning it around?
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

  5. #45
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    He promoted the idea of segregation based on race which, even on a small level, is horrible for society.

    Before you ask ME that question, though, you should ask yourself what Vick did to society. The honest answer is not a goddamned thing. But he got two years. He got a lot of outrage spewed at him, by hypocrites who don't even hesitate to eat meat, no less.

    Racism, no matter how it gets promoted, damages society. Sterling promoted racism. He was racist. Thus he is worse than Vick who simply drew an arbitrarily line in a different place than where most people draw it.
    Vick committed actual crimes. Thats the equivalent question of "what does a murderer do to society". Sterling didnt 'promote' racism...he exposed himself as having racist beliefs in a private conversation with his cuckolding girlfriend. As has been pointed out...he is 'such' a racist that the NAACP was about to give him a lifetime achievement award for the numerous programs he has put in place and/or funded specifically targetting minority communities.

  6. #46
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    First, I'd argue rape is more damaging to society than racism, because rape is often sexism and violence combined. Macro, micro, no difference. A society that condones rape is worse than one that condones racism. It's a country mile in the difference between those two societies, IMO. The one that condones racism is going to be very bad, the one that condones rape is going to be extremely evil.

    I honestly don't think a valid argument can be presented that can support a claim that racism is worse than rape even on a macro level when one actually looks at what condoning both would achieve.
    The confusion you have towards my suggestion may come because either:

    1. You're moving the goal posts
    2. You were horribly unclear in your original post

    Your first post didn't suggest or speak, at all, about which is more damaging to society if it's CONDONED by society. You simply spoke to which is more damaging to society, seemingly in the context of reality, today.

    That's why I'd say Racism is more damaging to society as a whole, today, than rape is. While there is some ambiguity regarding what is/isn't rape at times, I'd argue that ambiguity is far less than comes with Racism. When it comes to rape, that issue doesn't permeate into the realm of politics...everywhere from the on going back and forth about Obama, to issues of affirmative actions or discriminations laws, to issues with black conservatives, on and on. There have been undoubtably horrible situations involving rape before, but I can't remember any gaining the attention and splitting the public as much as the Zimmerman/Trayvon case did due to the accusations of racism. With Rape, there's an actual system in place to put forward institutionalized penalties for it along with the societal ones...while by and large, for racism, there is no such recourse. Not to mention, racism itself can often lend itself to violence as well as we've seen numerous times.

    I'd agree, in terms of which would be more damaging if society CONDONED it...I'd go the other way. But talking about the reality of today and within our own society, racism as a concept today does more harm to society as a whole today than rape as a concept imho.

    However, on an individual level, rape is far more abhorrent to me than someone's racism.

    To your point in terms of Vick and Sterling and dogs / meat...I can understand it. I can't even say I necessarily disagree with it. At the same time, I'll happily take the notion of "hypocrite" on this one. Much like I'd happily take the title of hypocrite for saying that people should be the better man when being insulted and not punch people, but if a guy called my wife a bitch I'd clock him in the jaw. I recognize there are double standards in life that we all tend to hold to SOME degree. For example, people may be far more forgiving of an action of a family member than a friend, and of a friend than a stranger. All for an arbitrary reasons, as ultimately all of those individuals are simply other humans.

    Domesticated companion animals such as dogs and cats that have been bread into that role over the centuries pull a different string on my emotions than a Cow or a Fish; just like my sister pulls a different string than the chick sitting a few cubes back from me at the office. Doing something for the purpose of entertainment as opposed to something relatively essential to life (even if it may not be the only way to get that essential notion) pulls my strings just a little differently. And I don't really feel bad for that fact. I'll take the hypocrite label in that case.

    I'm not one to continue to villify Vick, and I'll admit my dislike of him stems from his College days at Tech and is as much on a typical sports level as any kind of personal level. That said, from a football stand point my issue with his crime was FAR less to do with Dogs; it was to do with gambling. As you know as a sports fan, gambling issues throw a HUGE wrench in things and illegal gambling is viewed generally even worse. Regardless of his jail time, I felt the gambling charges were enough to legitimately have a chance to cause a significant suspension. The notion that he was given a hero's welcome though is laughable, I agree. Jail time, suspension, repeated pleading to the comish, leading most teams to want nothing to do with him until the eagles finally grabbed him as a 3rd stringer end of the bench type guy.

  7. #47
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Is any comparison likely to be truly meaningful?

    Animal cruelty vs racism. How ****ing nebulous can you get?

  8. #48
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Some crime is so serious that it merits a permanent reduction in job opportunity and earning power. The crime Vick committed fits that bill.

    Physical injury generally causes psychological injury as well, especially if maiming and killing are involved. That makes it worse than psychological injury alone. Therefore Vick's crime was worse that what Sterling did, which, bad as it was, inflicted only psychological damage, and was not even legally criminal.

    Is there any business besides professional sport where Vick would not have been banned for life? No company I ever worked for (mostly insurance and manufacturing) would have kept my a day past the day I was arrested. Can anyone think of an exception other than pro sport? The legal profession is notorious for readmitting disbarred members, but would even lawyers be so lenient with someone convicted of dogfighting?

    Sterling deserves a lifetime ban from all professional association with sport franchises. Vick's worse behavior merits the permanent reduction in job opportunity and earning potential that an identical ban would produce, and it is deplorable that he got off with anything less.

  9. #49
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by USViking View Post
    Vick's worse behavior merits the permanent reduction in job opportunity and earning potential that an identical ban would produce, and it is deplorable that he got off with anything less.
    Wait....Vick was caught, charges were pressed, he was found guilty and sentenced to prison, and he served his time. He has a permanent criminal record.

    What more do you want? What jobs would you relegate him to after having served his time in prison?

    Also - keep in mind that we humans slaughter ca-gillions of animals a year for food, clothing, and research.

    I'm not saying Vick isn't a skeezy human being and that he deserves to be completely forgiven for his past behavior.

    But he served time in prison, and was hired by a football team after all that to play for them.
    That's not his fault. That's just capitalism.

  10. #50
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    Re: Sterling vs Vick

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    Wait....Vick was caught, charges were pressed, he was found guilty and sentenced to prison, and he served his time. He has a permanent criminal record.
    I admit I haven't read the whole thread, but I would have thought this was already covered.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    What more do you want?
    Addressed in my reply #48, but I don't mind repeating: I want him to get the same treatment you and me would have gotten if we had been convicted of a violent crime like dogfighting.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    What jobs would you relegate him to after having served his time in prison?
    The same kind of job you and me would be relegated to if we had been convicted of a violent crime like dogfighting.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    Also - keep in mind that we humans slaughter ca-gillions of animals a year for food, clothing, and research.
    That is a corrupt analogy for several reasons. To take one, in the examples you mention animals are killed to promote human life whereas the animals used in dogfighting are killed solely for the depraved pleasure of watching them suffer and die.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    I'm not saying Vick isn't a skeezy human being and that he deserves to be completely forgiven for his past behavior.
    Yeah, right- you deserves to have people like you wagging their fingers and muttering "tut tut, what a bad man you are!"


    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonfly View Post
    But he served time in prison, and was hired by a football team after all that to play for them. That's not his fault. That's just capitalism.
    This debate has nothing to do with the economic system.

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