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Who Is More Afraid? The One Who Feels He Needs a Gun? Or the One Who Doesn't?

Who is more afraid? The one who feels he needs a gun, or the one who doesn't?

  • The person who feels he needs a gun is the one who's more afraid.

    Votes: 28 77.8%

  • The person who does NOT feel he needs a gun is the one who's more afraid.

    Votes: 8 22.2%
  • Total voters
    36
Goshin said:
If you listen to a few (admittedly loud) voices of fear and paranoia I suppose it might seem that way.

This "FEAR!!!1!" meme just alternately baffles or amuses me though. As I've said, I live in a shooting and hunting culture; I teach defensive shooting skills; and a LOT of the people I hang out with are CCWers, ex-cops, former military, etc.


And I just don't see this "FEAR!!!1!" meme playing out in real life among most gun owners or even gun carriers.

We get up and go to work like everyone else. Some of us get to carry while on the job; some can't due to company rules or etc. We may grumble about it but we go to work anyway and we don't spend the day quivering in fear and feeling inadequate because we're not properly armed.

We're AWARE that anything can happen at any time, and we're ALERT, but we don't go around jumping at shadows every five seconds or attaching a lot of emotional content to our alertness. We don't feel fear every time some stranger approaches. We just live life and have that awareness running in the back of our minds, like a computer running an application in the background rather than on-screen.

We go to each other's houses and barbecue and sit around on the back porch talking like normal people, and we don't jump up and go Rambo every time a squirrel farts in the next tree. :mrgreen:


Sometimes I feel like some of you view us as some sort of alien species or foreign invader and assign us sinister motives, or project your own fears onto us, or something of the sort. We're not; we're mostly just ordinary folks, and if you lived next door you might know us for years without ever knowing we carry, or ever suspecting we were one of the Sinister Gun People. (gasp!)


Yes, we are jealously protective of our rights. We've seen how one incremental step leads to the next, so we're tired of compromising when all that gets us is another step towards laws that may make it harder for us to protect our families IF we need to.

Yes, we're a little different in some ways. But most of the time, you could live next door to one of us (and probably do) and never know it or never think of us as some "weirdo nut"... unless we choose to talk about guns with you at some point.


We're just people like any other people, mostly. We just have a different perspective on certain things. And believe it or not, most of us do NOT have lives that actually revolve around guns... the guns are just THERE, and to us as natural a part of life as a car or a cell phone.
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I congratulate you on doing a very good job at describing the vast majority of gun owners. I agree with it.

Having said that, it is still true that the gun industry survives appealing to a fear of crime. Fear is part and parcel of the entire gun culture and is the reason for many purchases. It also seems to be the motivation behind many on the far right who have a severe fear and paranoia about government.
 
Goshin said:
Correct. I live out in the sticks, and I've needed a firearm to deal with an animal-related issue far more often than a people-related issue, at home at least.


Prime example:
When my son was 9 he was attacked by a rabid fox. I booted it off of him and it took off running. I didn't want it to possibly come back or possibly attack a neighbor, so I drew my CCW pistol and shot it before it got away.
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Hey Goshin where you going with that gun in your hand
I said Hey Goshin where you going with that gun in your hand?

Gonna shoot me a fox-found it messing around with a little man
going to to shoot me a fox, found it messing around with my little man

-and that aint too cool
 
Wiseone said:
I never said anything about restricting gun rights, I just said to be mindful and aware, but I'm used to people routinely ignoring what I say and just talking to their straw man.

Also its not just callous its also extremely ignorant.
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What is the actual effect or 'action' to be made regarding 'being mindful and aware?" WHat's the point? What is the purpose? If not to examine, intrude, and restrict. I am however, always in favor of more education.

And I'm not being ignorant, I'm being honest. I dont care about strangers who cant deal with life and leave others behind to suffer. I do care about our veterans. But aside from that, I only *care* personally about people I care personally about and expect the same from other people....the mentally ill, disturbed, the teens buried in angst...they are the responsibility...or not...of their family and friends..*and themselves.*

And I totally support assisted suicide and euthanasia.
 
haymarket said:
I congratulate you on doing a very good job at describing the vast majority of gun owners. I agree with it.

Having said that, it is still true that the gun industry survives appealing to a fear of crime. Fear is part and parcel of the entire gun culture and is the reason for many purchases. It also seems to be the motivation behind many on the far right who have a severe fear and paranoia about government.
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maybe if the Democrat party wouldn't start yapping about gun bans every time some nut case engages in a kamikaze attack, the fear you complain about wouldn't exist. However, the Dem party clearly feels a need to attack our rights just about every time there is a massacre.

that is why tons of gun dealers say Obama and Schumer, Brady and Feinstein are among the best salespeople the gun makers have. Every time those four turds start braying about gun bans, sales go through the roof.
 
haymarket said:
Are you actually going to deny that what I said is not true? Gun sales are NOT motivated by fear of crime? :shock::doh C'mon Goshin - you have far too much smarts to even go down that road.

And the paranoid fear of government drips from so many gun threads its like a constant theme. :roll:

FEAR motivates the gun community bigtime.
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And then fear of crime also motivates all purchases of home security systems, car alarms, martial arts classes, etc ad infitem. Are those completely fear-based...or based on prudence and preparedness?
 
Lursa said:
And then fear of crime also motivates all purchases of home security systems, car alarms, martial arts classes, etc ad infitem. Are those completely fear-based...or based on prudence and preparedness?
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car alarm companies, martial arts studios etc were not targeted for harassment by the Democrat party when the Democrat party wanted to pretend it was tough on crime. but your point is an excellent one
 
TurtleDude said:
car alarm companies, martial arts studios etc were not targeted for harassment by the Democrat party when the Democrat party wanted to pretend it was tough on crime. but your point is an excellent one
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A couple of things:

1. Don't feel persecuted. Both parties placate the NRA and no one will ever succeed in banning guns.

2. not a logical comparison. There has never been a car alarm spree that I know of. And outside of movies, there hasn't been a school ninja attack that I no of either.

The poll question lacks evidence. There are likely some on both side fearful. And people on both sides that are not at all fearful. I doubt fear us significant with either side.
 
Μολὼν λαβέ;1063259823 said:
Just remember not to bring a knife to a gun fight...
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Circular argument. Try again.

You mean people with a different perspective than you?
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No, I mean exactly what I said.

Glad I could be of assistance. :thumbs:
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You weren't. There is nothing in the Constitution which makes any reference to God or a creator. You failed.
Lutherf said:
Now you're just being silly.
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Says the person who can't follow a conversation. :roll:

I notice you didn't apologize to Crue Cab for calling him a statist. He'd probably like that.

Weapons likely predate controlled fire as one of the primary tools man has used to sustain the species.
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But we're not talking about "weapons", we're talking about "guns". Seriously, just once I'd like for you to stay on topic.
ChezC3 said:
Than you are a luddite extremist?
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No? I'm just possessing of common sense?

You're against medicine, vaccines, and other forms of health care too I suppose?
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I'm just against saying they are God given rights. Are you saying vaccines are a God given right? Or are you just another person who was unable to follow the concept of the conversation?

Exactly like a firearm. A tool to preserve life.
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We're not talking about that, we're talking about whether it is a God given right. Seriously, why is it so hard for people to follow the conversation?

He did craft our minds to invent them therefore as a product of our minds, our creation is an extension of ourselves, as we are an extension of our Creator...
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So? That has absolutely nothing to do with what we're saying. God also created our minds to invent money, does that mean your money is my God given right to have?

It's like some people completely lose sight of all logic when it comes to firearms, or in this case, an ability to remember the discussion.
CRUE CAB said:
Its in the Declaration of Independence.
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Which is not the Constitution. You said:
CRUE CAB said:
Has been since the ratification in 1791. Try keeping up.
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The Declaration was not ratified in 1791, the Bill of Rights was. Furthermore, the Declaration has absolutely nothing to do with our government either.

Are you finally ready to admit you were wrong yet? It seems like we do this quite often...you say something silly and false, I correct you, you try to squirm out of it, I catch you and you never apologize for being wrong. How about we try something different this time and you apologize for being wrong?

By the way, I noticed where Lutherf called you a "statist". You might consider having a word with him about that.
 
Boo Radley said:
A couple of things:

1. Don't feel persecuted. Both parties placate the NRA and no one will ever succeed in banning guns.

2. not a logical comparison. There has never been a car alarm spree that I know of. And outside of movies, there hasn't been a school ninja attack that I no of either.

The poll question lacks evidence. There are likely some on both side fearful. And people on both sides that are not at all fearful. I doubt fear us significant with either side.
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1) tell that to people in DC, NY, CT. its a lie. lots of guns have been banned including all automatics made after may 19, 1986. I don't buy that lie and it is a lie

2) dems adopted gun control to stave off attacks by people like nixon who claimed dems failed to stem the tide of mostly black street crime in the 1960s. Gun control was based on false motives and now has morphed into attacking pro gun rights groups because they told the truth on what the Dems were doing If car alarm lobbyists mainly supported the GOP, I suspect the Dems would target them too
 
Boo Radley said:
2. not a logical comparison. There has never been a car alarm spree that I know of. And outside of movies, there hasn't been a school ninja attack that I no of either.
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The claim was that they were bought out of fear of crime. So? Has nothing to do with lethality. Has to do with motivation to own/employ.
 
Slyfox696 said:
No? I'm just possessing of common sense?
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No.
I'm just against saying they are God given rights. Are you saying vaccines are a God given right? Or are you just another person who was unable to follow the concept of the conversation?
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No, did I say that?

The god given right is to defend yourself, that means using whatever tools or means necessary that you may obtain.

We're not talking about that, we're talking about whether it is a God given right. Seriously, why is it so hard for people to follow the conversation?
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It isn't so hard, it is a simplistic argument you're trying to concoct, a word game. Those are easily comprehensible and defeated, as I've done.

You're trying to say a person has a god given right to a gun, as in they're born and one is issued while Angels hark, and that's just nonsense. No one in their right mind thinks that.

So? That has absolutely nothing to do with what we're saying. God also created our minds to invent money, does that mean your money is my God given right to have?
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No, it is your god given right to acquire your own money.

It's like some people completely lose sight of all logic when it comes to firearms, or in this case, an ability to remember the discussion.
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I know, it's like how hard of a concept is it to understand that if you are able to procure a firearm for yourself, either through purchase, trade, or smithing, than you have a God given right to that firearm should you feel it necessary to use as a tool of self defense?


I'd go on to explain private property is a God given right and how the tool that is a firearm plays into that but as I can see you're not really up for a conversation so much as you are for pounding sand because no one wants to play your gotcha game BS...
 
TurtleDude said:
maybe if the Democrat party wouldn't start yapping about gun bans every time some nut case engages in a kamikaze attack, the fear you complain about wouldn't exist. However, the Dem party clearly feels a need to attack our rights just about every time there is a massacre.

that is why tons of gun dealers say Obama and Schumer, Brady and Feinstein are among the best salespeople the gun makers have. Every time those four turds start braying about gun bans, sales go through the roof.
Click to expand...


This is a common sense issue - not a partisan one. It involves what type of society we want to live in as Americans - not as partisan Democrats or Republicans.
 
Lursa said:
And then fear of crime also motivates all purchases of home security systems, car alarms, martial arts classes, etc ad infitem. Are those completely fear-based...or based on prudence and preparedness?
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yes - the things you cited are also aided by fear. As to being "completely fear based" ... I doubt it althought I suspect it is significant.
 
NoC_T said:
What do firearms have to do with God? Or did God suddenly wink into existence with the advent of gunpowder?
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Did God wink into existence healthcare, because some think they have a right to that?
 
haymarket said:
I congratulate you on doing a very good job at describing the vast majority of gun owners. I agree with it.

Having said that, it is still true that the gun industry survives appealing to a fear of crime. Fear is part and parcel of the entire gun culture and is the reason for many purchases. It also seems to be the motivation behind many on the far right who have a severe fear and paranoia about government.
Click to expand...

For some, it's the fear of Obama coming to git their guns, the reasoning for buying even more guns and ammunition, people fear our gubbermint is going to come and take away their constitutional right to own guns, yes, fear is a powerful tool, when it's used, people flock like sheep. Gun dealers have nobody to thank but Obama for the upward spike in gun & ammunition sales.
 
AJiveMan said:
For some, it's the fear of Obama coming to git their guns, the reasoning for buying even more guns and ammunition, people fear our gubbermint is going to come and take away their constitutional right to own guns, yes, fear is a powerful tool, when it's used, people flock like sheep. Gun dealers have nobody to thank but Obama for the upward spike in gun & ammunition sales.
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Yes, that is 100% true. Which is why it is so amazing when people on the gun lobby side attempt to insult people who disagree with them calling them things like "fear driven" or accusing them of being emotional rather than factual when the emotions of gun supporters and in fact the entire industry is significantly driven by their own fears and emotions. They are guilty of the very thing they accuse their enemies of.
 
The question of what one is afraid of appears too vague.
IF I am afraid and have a gun it would only be because I am "in fear of my life" from an adversary with criminal intent not the government.
IF I did not have a gun I would be more afraid of my government taking not just my right to self-defense but other rights and or property at it's whim !
 
haymarket said:
Yes, that is 100% true. Which is why it is so amazing when people on the gun lobby side attempt to insult people who disagree with them calling them things like "fear driven" or accusing them of being emotional rather than factual when the emotions of gun supporters and in fact the entire industry is significantly driven by their own fears and emotions. They are guilty of the very thing they accuse their enemies of.
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I wonder why recently people fear the gubbermint? Don't they know of the checks and balances it would take to pass constitutional amendments or to change wording in that? Seems people are acting out of not knowing and desperation over what people talk about on MSM and talk radio, seems they're being fed bad pablum.
 
AJiveMan said:
I wonder why recently people fear the gubbermint? Don't they know of the checks and balances it would take to pass constitutional amendments or to change wording in that? Seems people are acting out of not knowing and desperation over what people talk about on MSM and talk radio, seems they're being fed bad pablum.
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What do you mean by people "acting out"? Examples?

I don't know how many--a few, some, many--citizens fear our government, but if they do, is it because they are credulous and believe everything they hear?

I don't own a gun. But I am afraid of the increasing encroachment of the federal government into citizens' lives, and I am particularly afraid of federal agencies overstepping their bounds and playing politics, for example, the IRS. it has no right to ask questions such as "What do you pray?" If you aren't scared about that, you should be.
 
nota bene said:
What do you mean by people "acting out"? Examples?

I don't know how many--a few, some, many--citizens fear our government, but if they do, is it because they are credulous and believe everything they hear?

I don't own a gun. But I am afraid of the increasing encroachment of the federal government into citizens' lives, and I am particularly afraid of federal agencies overstepping their bounds and playing politics, for example, the IRS. it has no right to ask questions such as "What do you pray?" If you aren't scared about that, you should be.
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Acting out; e.g., Obama is pro gun control, that is to say more rigorous background checks, more regulation of high capacity ammunition clips.
Then, people hear this and think, oh, he's going to try to regulate the kinds of guns and ammunition we buy now, darn, we's better go out and purchase all we can, while we can, acting out of fear of the unknown, or acting out of fear because somebody said the gubbermint is going to take our guns, and take away our rights to own guns.

I fear no evil.

FearNoWeevil.JPG
 
Slyfox696 said:
Circular argument. Try again.

No, I mean exactly what I said.

You weren't. There is nothing in the Constitution which makes any reference to God or a creator. You failed.
Says the person who can't follow a conversation. :roll:

I notice you didn't apologize to Crue Cab for calling him a statist. He'd probably like that.

But we're not talking about "weapons", we're talking about "guns". Seriously, just once I'd like for you to stay on topic.
No? I'm just possessing of common sense?

I'm just against saying they are God given rights. Are you saying vaccines are a God given right? Or are you just another person who was unable to follow the concept of the conversation?

We're not talking about that, we're talking about whether it is a God given right. Seriously, why is it so hard for people to follow the conversation?

So? That has absolutely nothing to do with what we're saying. God also created our minds to invent money, does that mean your money is my God given right to have?

It's like some people completely lose sight of all logic when it comes to firearms, or in this case, an ability to remember the discussion.
Which is not the Constitution. You said:

The Declaration was not ratified in 1791, the Bill of Rights was. Furthermore, the Declaration has absolutely nothing to do with our government either.

Are you finally ready to admit you were wrong yet? It seems like we do this quite often...you say something silly and false, I correct you, you try to squirm out of it, I catch you and you never apologize for being wrong. How about we try something different this time and you apologize for being wrong?

By the way, I noticed where Lutherf called you a "statist". You might consider having a word with him about that.
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Bill of Rights is finally ratified — History.com This Day in History — 12/15/1791
 
AJiveMan said:
I wonder why recently people fear the gubbermint? Don't they know of the checks and balances it would take to pass constitutional amendments or to change wording in that? Seems people are acting out of not knowing and desperation over what people talk about on MSM and talk radio, seems they're being fed bad pablum.
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Guess you haven't heard about executive orders yet.
 
haymarket said:
Yes, that is 100% true. Which is why it is so amazing when people on the gun lobby side attempt to insult people who disagree with them calling them things like "fear driven" or accusing them of being emotional rather than factual when the emotions of gun supporters and in fact the entire industry is significantly driven by their own fears and emotions. They are guilty of the very thing they accuse their enemies of.
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Link to that absurd accusation.
 
so soooorry, can't read your post, try changing your user name or your attitude.
 
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