View Poll Results: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?

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  • Yes

    64 78.05%
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Thread: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

  1. #511
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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Not necessarily white, that's just US context. In order to perpetuate racism, as opposed to bigotry, one must be of the majority power (or a minority oppressing another minority). Racism against the majority is impossible due to the social factors of this social construct.
    Go back and read the posted definition of racism. there is nothing in there about being a majority or minority factor. You're just adding in your own factors to the definition.
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  2. #512
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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    So far as I was aware, racism is just race-specific bigotry.
    rac·ism /ˈrāˌsizəm/ noun: racism
    the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.


    big·ot·ry
    /ˈbigətrē/
    noun: bigotry; plural noun: bigotries
    bigoted attitudes; intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.

    Nope, racism is not race specific bigotry. Racism is about the real and percieved attributes of a given race, while bigotry is about ideas and opinions. I will agree with ecofarm that race is a social construct as we are all actually of a single race. Regardless, whatever term we have given to those factors that differentiate between the "races", that term will form the basis of the ism that currently exists under the term "racism". For that matter I would venture to say that all -isms are social constructs. But they are still exhibited by individuals.

    Another problem is that too many people are equating bigotry with racism. Bigotry can also work, at least seemingly, towards a positive goal, such as the intolerance towards racism
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  3. #513
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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    While AA programs are racially biased, they are not racist because they do not *assume that one race is superior to the rest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Empirica View Post
    Once again, those "racially biased programs of AA" unjustly demand accountability and sacrifice of totally innocent people who have absolutely nothing to do with the current I]condition[/I] of Black America_
    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Was there something I said that indicated otherwise?
    Actually, there was not and what you said is factual when taken in the context of it's wording_
    But!
    Placing the burden of responsibility and sacrifice on the backs of white Americans who had absolutely nothing to do with the perceived problem is "racist" because it *assumes one race is guilty based solely on skin color_
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  4. #514
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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Not necessarily white, that's just US context. In order to perpetuate racism, as opposed to bigotry, one must be of the majority power (or a minority oppressing another minority). Racism against the majority is impossible due to the social factors of this social construct.
    That is a odd rather limiting definition you have come up with. You seem unaware that there are 3 definitions in the dictionary for the word racism.


    rac·ism [rey-siz-uhm]
    noun
    1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.
    2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
    3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

    Affirmative Action can be described by definition 2. Affirmative Action is indeed a policy and it indeed fosters a doctrine that asserts that decisions on hiring for employment and admissions to educational institutions must be done based on race. Therefor like it or not Affirmative Action is racism.

    Consider this: http://www.colorado.edu/studentaffai...on%20Terms.pdf

    Racism is even more varied in definition when we give the word a qualifier word. Where does your definition fit in? Your assertion of impossibles is in error. Certainly a racist dictator that is a member of a minority race could produce wholesale racism. And certainly a individual can practice racism despite being a minority.

    Racism: belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that those
    racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race

    Individual racism: The beliefs, attitudes, and actions of individuals that support or perpetuate
    racism. Individual racism can occur at both an unconscious and conscious level, and can be both
    active and passive. Examples include telling a racist joke, using a racial epithet, or believing in
    the inherent superiority of whites.

    Active racism: Actions which have as their stated or explicit goal the maintenance of the
    system of racism and the oppression of those in the targeted racial groups. People who
    participate in active racism advocate the continued subjugation of members of the targeted groups
    and protection of “the rights” of members of an agent group. These goals are often supported by
    a belief in the inferiority of People of Color and the superiority of white people, culture, and
    values.

    Passive racism: Beliefs, attitudes, and actions that contribute to the maintenance of racism,
    without openly advocating violence or oppression. The conscious and unconscious maintenance
    of attitudes, beliefs, and behaviors that supports the system of racism, racial prejudice, and racial
    dominance.

    Cultural racism (racism at the cultural level): Those aspects of society that overtly and
    covertly attribute value and normality to white people and Whiteness, and devalue, stereotype,
    and label People of Color as “other,” different, less than, or render them invisible. Examples of
    these norms include defining white skin tones as nude or flesh colored, having a future time
    orientation, emphasizing individualism as opposed to a more collective ideology, defining one
    form of English as standard, and identifying only Whites as the great writers or composers.

    Institutional racism (racism at the institutional level): (or structural racism or systemic
    racism) is a form of racism that occurs in institutions such as public bodies and
    corporations, including universities.

    Horizontal racism: The result of people of targeted racial groups believing, acting on, or
    enforcing the dominant (White) system of racial discrimination and oppression. Horizontal
    racism can occur between members of the same racial group (an Asian person telling another
    Asian wearing a sari to “dress like an American”; a Latino believing that the most competent
    administrators or leaders are white, Native Americans feeling that they cannot be as intelligent as
    Whites, Asians believing that racism is the result of People of Color not being to raise themselves
    “by their own bootstraps.”

  5. #515
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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Horizontal racism: The result of people of targeted racial groups believing, acting on, or
    enforcing the dominant (White) system of racial discrimination and oppression. Horizontal
    racism can occur between members of the same racial group (an Asian person telling another
    Asian wearing a sari to “dress like an American”; a Latino believing that the most competent
    administrators or leaders are white, Native Americans feeling that they cannot be as intelligent as
    Whites, Asians believing that racism is the result of People of Color not being to raise themselves
    “by their own bootstraps.”[/I]
    That's key to each part of the definition.

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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    That's key to each part of the definition.
    Why is that key to you?

    Notice that you took that quote from a type of variation of racism. Up until now you have been just generalizing racism while using a specific definition that isnt just racism but a certain type of racism. You tried to claim that it is impossible for any minority to engage in racism. That simply isnt true at all.



    Nope no racism here because these guys are a minority.

    I do claim that racism in this country is still bad. But not all areas have a majority of European Americans as the main population. I personally live in a area where Hispanics are the majority. My kids go to school where over 80% of the students are Hispanic. I have had my share of explaining to them that it isnt their fault that other students are prejudice because of their looks. Though for the most part there isnt a lot of racism. Not bad for the location of the film 'Salt of the Earth' being only 2 miles away.

  7. #517
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Are Affirmative Action programs racist?[W:110]

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Not necessarily white, that's just US context. In order to perpetuate racism, as opposed to bigotry, one must be of the majority power (or a minority oppressing another minority). Racism against the majority is impossible due to the social factors of this social construct.
    10 definitions prove this factually wrong and every time you say it will continue to be factually wrong and a posted lie.
    Racism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary
    racism noun - definition in the American English Dictionary - Cambridge Dictionaries Online
    racism - definition of racism by Macmillan Dictionary
    Racism | Define Racism at Dictionary.com
    racism: definition of racism in Oxford dictionary (British & World English)
    American Heritage Dictionary Entry: racism
    racism - definition of racism by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.
    Collins English Dictionary | Always Free Online
    Heinle's Newbury House Dictionary of American English
    https://www.google.com/search?num=30...w=1600&bih=815

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