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Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discrimination?

What's More Important - the "Right" to Discriminate, or Freedom From Discrimination?


  • Total voters
    93
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

pirates and their actions.........are a power of the federal government.

Letters of Marque and Reprisal?

Old pirates, yes, they rob I;
Sold I to the merchant ships,
Minutes after they took I
From the bottomless pit.
But my hand was made strong
By the 'and of the Almighty.
We forward in this generation
Triumphantly.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

That does not negate the fact government protects property with man made laws.

you stated government created the right to property

government is instituted to protect property of every sort, ..by using written law to do it.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

you stated government created the right to property

government is instituted to protect property of every sort, ..by using written law to do it.

I can't claim property on my own.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

Letters of Marque and Reprisal?

Old pirates, yes, they rob I;
Sold I to the merchant ships,
Minutes after they took I
From the bottomless pit.
But my hand was made strong
By the 'and of the Almighty.
We forward in this generation
Triumphantly.

article 1 section 8....To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations; ...
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

I can't claim property on my own.

oh, so Edison had to get government approval of a right to the bulb?

so rights come at the approval of government?
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

Again, the burden of proof is on the accuser.

Thing is, should we give the stamp of legitimacy to discrimination? Or should we give the stamp of legitimacy to freedom from discrimination?

Remember, men's-only voting had the stamp of legitimacy for almost half of America's history so far. Once women's suffrage was given the stamp of legitimacy, a lot of people (almost all men) didn't like it...but look how that particular stamp of legitimacy has changed our society. How many out there would even think of restricting a woman's right to vote?

So it goes with laws either allowing or disallowing discrimination. The longer the laws are on the books, the more the society adapts to and accepts those laws...and they become a part of the social fabric.

Actually you're referring to a law that demanded discrimination. That is easily differentiated (you might say discriminated) from laws that allow or disallow discrimination.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

article 1 section 8....To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations; ...

not a Bob Marley fan? you are right though
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

so your saying government can violate a right, because other people don't like how a person exercises his rights.......even though no other person rights are being violated.

Where did I say: "...even though no other person's rights are being violated"? Not at all.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

If someone is running a business that serves the general public, I have no problem with their right to discriminate being subjugated by laws against discrimination. They can discriminate to their heart's content at home, in the streets, in other businesses...but their own business? No. That's the little bit of freedom we must give up to be a civil society.

So, to clarify, you feel as if you, yourself, have the right to violate the person or property of your neighbor in order to force him to do business against his will?

Or do you still think that blacks belong at the back of the bus?

Still think? How do you presume to pretend to know what I've ever thought?
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

oh, so Edison had to get government approval of a right to the bulb?

so rights come at the approval of government?

No, a patent is a man made law which the government protects.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

Where did I say: "...even though no other person's rights are being violated"? Not at all.


i will rephrase.

if a person exercise his right to property, and in exercising that right, he does not violate the rights of another person, or health and safety laws created by government, [which are designed to protect people], then by what authoirty does the government have to force a property owner to serve another citizen?

first ...it defines the DOI....because force is being using on a citizen..the property owner....which violates the founding principles.

second.. it violates the 13th amendment...which states no person can be forced to serve another citizen, unless convicted of a crime.......discrimination is not criminal law.......its administrative law.

p.s...... i think your a good poster...so don't take anything personal please.:)
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

So, to clarify, you feel as if you, yourself, have the right to violate the person or property of your neighbor in order to force him to do business against his will?

Still think? How do you presume to pretend to know what I've ever thought?

How about this: "Do you think that blacks still belong at the back of the bus?" (Moved a word. Less accusatory. My bad.)

I believe in Civil Rights laws that outlaw discrimination based on a variety of reasons, race being one. I have no problem with them.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

No, a patent is a man made law which the government protects.

patent law, is law which protects the natural right of property.

if law is not written, HOW DOES ONE KNOW THE LAW?
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

How about this: "Do you think that blacks still belong at the back of the bus?" (Moved a word. Less accusatory. My bad.)

Nope. Never thought they belonged at the back of the bus in the first place. I think the government laws that forced them to do so were evil.

I believe in Civil Rights laws that outlaw discrimination based on a variety of reasons, race being one. I have no problem with them.

My question is not necessarily about civil rights laws. It's more fundamental. I'm asking if you think that you, personally, have the right to violate the body or property of your neighbor in order to force him to do business against his will.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

patent law, is law which protects the natural right of property.

if law is not written, HOW DOES ONE KNOW THE LAW?

An idea is not the same thing as physical property.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

i will rephrase.

if a person exercise his right to property, and in exercising that right, he does not violate the rights of another person, or health and safety laws created by government, [which are designed to protect people], then by what authoirty does the government have to force a property owner to serve another citizen?

first ...it defines the DOI....because force is being using on a citizen..the property owner....which violates the founding principles.

second.. it violates the 13th amendment...which states no person can be forced to serve another citizen, unless convicted of a crime.......discrimination is not criminal law.......its administrative law.

p.s...... i think your a good poster...so don't take anything personal please.:)

Aww, shucks. Now I can't get mad. ;) ;)

I guess I'm not concerned by what constitutional authority we have civil rights laws. I would be ashamed of my country if we still had signs on businesses that said, "Blacks not welcome here." That was a dark period in our history, in my opinion. The famous fact that Jackie Robinson couldn't stay with the rest of his team (until they stood up for him) because the team hotels wouldn't admit blacks was pretty low down. And even that we had Negro Baseball Leagues. That, during the second world war, blacks had to move off the sidewalks in the south when whites were going by...I mean, really??
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

An idea is not the same thing as physical property.

again, did Edison own the light blub when he created it.......or did law by government give him the right of property to it?
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

No, a patent is a man made law which the government protects.

The argument was about how the labor that Edison provided towards the creation of the light bulb gave him a right to the light bulb he created. Patents are another matter all together.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

I mean do you feel the right to say to your neighbor that he may not operate a business without your permission, and then if he disobeys you to violate his person or property.

Why ask me that?
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

again, did Edison own the light blub when he created it.......or did law by government give him the right of property to it?

That property came from an idea and then he needed to buy the goods to make it. He then was able to protect his idea but needs to pay to have those bulbs manufactured.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

How about this: "Do you think that blacks still belong at the back of the bus?" (Moved a word. Less accusatory. My bad.)

I believe in Civil Rights laws that outlaw discrimination based on a variety of reasons, race being one. I have no problem with them.

One of the things I really hate is how the term Civil Rights is now associated with acts of aggression, instead of being associated with the protection of natural rights like it once was.
 
Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

That property came from an idea and then he needed to buy the goods to make it. He then was able to protect his idea but needs to pay to have those bulbs manufactured.

The idea of the light bulb is entirely different from the light bulb he put his labor towards to create. You're purposely missing the point here it seems.
 
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