View Poll Results: What's More Important - the "Right" to Discriminate, or Freedom From Discrimination?

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  • The Right to Discriminate

    38 33.04%
  • Freedom From Discrimination

    77 66.96%
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Thread: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discrimination?

  1. #541
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Jesus..no.

    A positive right requires others to provide you with either a good or service, while a negative right only requires others to abstain from interfering with your actions. Natural rights are all negative, btw.

    The reason positive rights declarations are in conflict with peoples rights is that they require action to exist. In effect, they place people into servitude for the benefit of others.
    And you don't consider refusal of service without cause to be interfering with their actions? Of course it is, you just refuse to frame it as such because you're coming from a totally self centered and myopic perspective, entirely void of any sociological considerations.

  2. #542
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    The slaves didn't have it because people considered slaves' freedom to be a negative right. Unlike their own, which is a positive right.
    You are confusing the terms. Negative Rights do not mean "no rights".

    Here you go:


  3. #543
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    You are confusing the terms. Negative Rights do not mean "no rights".
    I'm pretty sure that's your claim.

  4. #544
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    And you don't consider refusal of service without cause to be interfering with their actions?
    That is correct - they are not being forced upon. For example, if I were to demand that you mow my lawn for $1, and you were to refuse, you would not be violating my rights by refusing me that service.

  5. #545
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    I'm pretty sure that's your claim.
    I'm pretty sure you either don't know what you are talking about, or are playing the part of clown. Enjoy the video.

  6. #546
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    That is correct - they are not being forced upon. For example, if I were to demand that you mow my lawn for $1, and you were to refuse, you would not be violating my rights by refusing me that service.
    By eliminating their freedom of choice and business association -in the public sphere-, you are interfering with their actions. You are trying to make life hard on them. You are waging economic war, you are employing aggression against a group.

  7. #547
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    By eliminating their freedom of choice and business association -in the public sphere-, you are interfering with their actions. You are trying to make life hard on them. You are waging economic war, you are employing aggression against a group.
    Now you are engaging in hyperbolic rhetoric, which is an excellent indication that you have come (belatedly) to the realization that you have no solid supporting logic to bring to bear. You also seem to be (again) confused in your terminology. For example, if you refused to mow my lawn for a dollar, you haven't "eliminated my freedom of choice and business association", you've simply chosen to exercise your own. If, however, you were to use the power of the state to keep me from being able to hire anyone to mow my lawn for a dollar, then you would be engaging in that action - because then my freedom of choice and business association would actually be "eliminated".

    Failure to make one trade does not deny either participant the ability to make any trade, else we would have no choice but war over every non-infinite resource.

  8. #548
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    And you don't consider refusal of service without cause to be interfering with their actions? Of course it is, you just refuse to frame it as such because you're coming from a totally self centered and myopic perspective, entirely void of any sociological considerations.
    No, refusing to take part in a transaction is not interfering with the other parties actions. The other party was just as free before the refusal of service as they are after it.

  9. #549
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Now you are engaging in hyperbolic rhetoric, which is an excellent indication that you have come (belatedly) to the realization that you have no solid supporting logic to bring to bear.
    You are restricting their freedom of movement and opportunity within the public sphere. This is an infringement upon their rights, an attack on the free market, fraud and blatant aggression against a group.

  10. #550
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    By eliminating their freedom of choice and business association -in the public sphere-, you are interfering with their actions. You are trying to make life hard on them. You are waging economic war, you are employing aggression against a group.
    No, it is upholding the freedom of choice as it is upholding both parties right to choose to take part in a transaction of property and service or not.

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