View Poll Results: What's More Important - the "Right" to Discriminate, or Freedom From Discrimination?

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  • The Right to Discriminate

    38 33.04%
  • Freedom From Discrimination

    77 66.96%
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Thread: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discrimination?

  1. #1901
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Your problem is with the US Constitution and the powers it gives government that you simply pretend to not support but in practice do indeed support.
    No. My problem is not with the constitution. The constitution contains no language that denies the American people the ability to control access to their own property. My problem is with you and your ilk who wish to impose such limits on your fellow Americans.

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Your problem is with the US Constitution and the powers it gives government that you simply pretend to not support but in practice do indeed support.
    I don't believe that you've provided a direct example of this assertion. Please do so or a link to the post in which you have already done so.
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    No. My problem is not with the constitution. The constitution contains no language that denies the American people the ability to control access to their own property. My problem is with you and your ilk who wish to impose such limits on your fellow Americans.
    The Constitution authorizes the practice of eminent domain and contains a remedy when it is employed. Your position seems to want 100% absolute and total control of property by the person who has government proof to own it. Sorry - but that is not the way it works in the real USA and never has worked that way.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    I don't believe that you've provided a direct example of this assertion. Please do so or a link to the post in which you have already done so.
    Its right in the Constitution. Amendment 5.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The Constitution authorizes the practice of eminent domain and contains a remedy when it is employed. Your position seems to want 100% absolute and total control of property by the person who has government proof to own it. Sorry - but that is not the way it works in the real USA and never has worked that way.
    I note that you cannot provide any language in the constitution that requires that government force be used to deny the American people the ability to control access to their own property.

    So, as I said earlier, my problem is not with the constitution. It is with you and your ilk who wish to take and control the property of your fellow Americans.

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Its right in the Constitution. Amendment 5.
    No, I mean where Federalist "...simply pretend(s) to not support but in practice do(es) indeed support."
    Bi, Poly, Switch. I'm not indecisive, I'm greedy!

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    I note that you cannot provide any language in the constitution that requires that government force be used to deny the American people the ability to control access to their own property.

    So, as I said earlier, my problem is not with the constitution. It is with you and your ilk who wish to take and control the property of your fellow Americans.
    Amendment V authorizes the taking of private property for public use.

    Amendment V

    No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.


    We danced this dance before and it came down to your silly insistence that the government is not forced ... is not ordered .... is not mandated to exercise eminent domain and thus should not exercise a perfectly legitimate power in the Constitution. It was inane then and it is inane now. You want to harbor such a foolish idea that the government should not exercise a legitimate power given to it in the Constitution which benefits the larger community with hospitals, roads, schools, highways, airports, terminals, clinics, and all manner of government buildings providing services - you are welcome to such delusions. But it is one of the most silly and hollow and pointless arguments I have ever had the misfortune to witness.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    No, I mean where Federalist "...simply pretend(s) to not support but in practice do(es) indeed support."
    He and I have had this discussion many many many times. It is reality that Federalist
    1 - says that he is against the practice of eminent domain
    2- freely uses the results of eminent domain in his daily life
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Amendment V authorizes the taking of private property for public use.

    We danced this dance before and it came down to your silly insistence that the government is not forced ... is not ordered .... is not mandated to exercise eminent domain and thus should not exercise a perfectly legitimate power in the Constitution. It was inane then and it is inane now. You want to harbor such a foolish idea that the government should not exercise a legitimate power given to it in the Constitution which benefits the larger community with hospitals, roads, schools, highways, airports, terminals, clinics, and all manner of government buildings providing services - you are welcome to such delusions. But it is one of the most silly and hollow and pointless arguments I have ever had the misfortune to witness.
    Yes, which is why I said that my problem is not with the constitution, since the constitution does not require that any person be denied the ability to control access to his property.

    You and your ilk want to use government force to deny the American people the ability to control access to their own property.

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Federalist View Post
    Yes, which is why I said that my problem is not with the constitution, since the constitution does not require that any person be denied the ability to control access to his property.

    You and your ilk want to use government force to deny the American people the ability to control access to their own property.
    It is a silly and inane argument that denies the reality of the world we live in and necessity to NOT allow one stubborn or greedy individual to stop a communities progress or hold them up for a kings ransom - and apparently the Founders knew this and provided accordingly in Amendment language which prevents this.

    Of course - it is typical right libertarian extremism to stubbornly insist that the theoretical "rights" of one person count more than the rest of society. And you guys wonder why you cannot even get 1% in a national election?
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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