View Poll Results: What's More Important - the "Right" to Discriminate, or Freedom From Discrimination?

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  • The Right to Discriminate

    38 33.04%
  • Freedom From Discrimination

    77 66.96%
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Thread: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discrimination?

  1. #1611
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by maquiscat View Post
    Except they really don't care about individuals. Go back and look at all of their avoidance when asked simple up or down answers. They post a premise that no one should deny another business or resource due to an unchangeable attribute, but then they do two things that directly oppose that premise. First they include changeable attributes, such as religion and marital status (not that I believe that such are proper basis for discrimination but when you claim that unchangeable is the criteria...), and more importantly, they turn around and allow the buyer to deny the seller business and resource based upon the exact same attributes. This isn't about equality and racism. It's about them not liking what one's rights allows them to do, and instead of using their rights to impose social pressure, they instead take rights from others with laws that are hypocritical to their claimed goals.
    I think you have a good point. What has been lost is the reason why anti discrimination laws were needed in the first place. It wasn't simply to change society and the attitudes of individuals, it was to battle the institutional oppression of the day. Now the power of the institutions are overwhelming liberties and oppressing in the opposite direction. IE courts telling free people that they must serve. It's the institutional aspect that deserves battle, not individual choices of free people.
    "It is only when men contemplate the greatness of God that they can come to realize their own inadequacy." Jean Calvin

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Discrimination on the basis of skin color IS racism.
    yes it is. Do you oppose affirmative action?
    "It is only when men contemplate the greatness of God that they can come to realize their own inadequacy." Jean Calvin

  3. #1613
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    When posting a definition you should probably include all of the definition that pertains to what you are talking about.



    Merriam-Webster ~ Liberties

    A natural Right will always trump a civil right or priviledge.

    But aside from that a persons Right ends where another persons Right begins. No Right can trump another Right. And since no one has the Right to buy another persons property...or even be on another persons property, a buyers Right ends at the property owners private properties edge.
    Yep, and natural rights are also human rights. Civil rights are human rights.

  4. #1614
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    Yep, and natural rights are also human rights. Civil rights are human rights.
    You still did not address the last part of my post. You seem to ignore that part quite a bit. And just so there's no confusion as to what I'm talking about....

    "But aside from that a persons Right ends where another persons Right begins. No Right can trump another Right. And since no one has the Right to buy another persons property...or even be on another persons property, a buyers Right ends at the property owners private properties edge."
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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  5. #1615
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    You still did not address the last part of my post. You seem to ignore that part quite a bit. And just so there's no confusion as to what I'm talking about....

    "But aside from that a persons Right ends where another persons Right begins. No Right can trump another Right. And since no one has the Right to buy another persons property...or even be on another persons property, a buyers Right ends at the property owners private properties edge."
    The founders cared about natural rights to ensure that tyranny did not take over. No one said a property owner has to sell his property. As a matter of fact, if he doesn't want to sell it he simply can keep it, but he can't discriminate who he sells to. To call that tyranny, rather than the control of property itself, is insidious.

  6. #1616
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    The founders cared about natural rights to ensure that tyranny did not take over. No one said a property owner has to sell his property. As a matter of fact, if he doesn't want to sell it he simply can keep it, but he can't discriminate who he sells to. To call that tyranny, rather than the control of property itself, is insidious.
    And you still did not address what I said. Why are you avoiding it? Do you agree with it or not?

    A property owner can at anytime withdraw something for sell. They can also put it back up for sell at any time they want.

    And you're the one calling it tyranny. I'm the one saying that the owner has control of the property itself.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

  7. #1617
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    And you still did not address what I said. Why are you avoiding it? Do you agree with it or not?

    A property owner can at anytime withdraw something for sell. They can also put it back up for sell at any time they want.

    And you're the one calling it tyranny. I'm the one saying that the owner has control of the property itself.
    I agree. He can withdraw the sale if he doesn't want to sell it and keep it or decide to sell it at a later time.

  8. #1618
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    I agree. He can withdraw the sale if he doesn't want to sell it and keep it or decide to sell it at a later time.
    Even if he decides to sell it 1 second after the person he didn't want to sell it to leaves his property?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Even if he decides to sell it 1 second after the person he didn't want to sell it to leaves his property?
    It doesn't have to do with time. If it was a time reason, sure. If it was because he didn't want to sell to a black person then that is a different story.

  10. #1620
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    Re: Which Is More Important? The Right to Discriminate, or Freedom from Discriminati

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    It doesn't have to do with time. If it was a time reason, sure. If it was because he didn't want to sell to a black person then that is a different story.
    Now I'm going to put this as a direct question to you since you have continueally avoided responding to it.

    Do you believe that one persons Rights end where another persons Rights begin? Yes? Or no?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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