View Poll Results: Are Western men becoming less masculine?

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  • Yes

    21 41.18%
  • No

    22 43.14%
  • Meatloaf Sandwich

    8 15.69%
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Thread: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

  1. #81
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by DA60 View Post
    From just the first link on Google I found about the negative effects of red meat:

    'Negative Health Effects of Red Meat
    Regardless, nutritionists hardly need more evidence about the potentially negative health effects of eating red meat. For starters, the saturated animal fat in red meat contributes to heart disease and atherosclerosis. Recent research also shows that frequent red meat eaters face twice the risk of colon cancer as those who indulge less often. Red meat is also thought to increase the risks of rheumatoid arthritis and endometriosis.

    Meanwhile, according to the American Dietetic Association, vegetarian diets can significantly reduce the risk of heart disease, colon cancer, osteoporosis, diabetes, kidney disease, hypertension, obesity, and other debilitating medical conditions. While red meat is a key source of protein and vitamin B12 in North American diets, nutritionists explain that properly planned meat-free diets easily provide these important nutrients while keeping you healthier in the long run.'

    So you cite the American Dietetic Association which is funded by ConAgra. All that article means is that ConAgra sold it's meat division so now they say vegetarian diets are good.

    There is nothing scientific about that.

  2. #82
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by German guy View Post
    I could be wrong, but I feel Muhammed is pulling your leg.
    I'm not pulling anyone's leg. I'm giving you helpful advice to keep your mind and body in great condition.

    If you don't want to take advice from an expert in nutrition like myself. Fine. It's your own body that you are poisoning. However, anyone who puts their child on some vegan diet just so they can feel smug and "envirionmentally conscious" ought to be tossed in prison for a very long time.

  3. #83
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by Muhammed View Post
    I'm not pulling anyone's leg. I'm giving you helpful advice to keep your mind and body in great condition.

    If you don't want to take advice from an expert in nutrition like myself. Fine. It's your own body that you are poisoning. However, anyone who puts their child on some vegan diet just so they can feel smug and "envirionmentally conscious" ought to be tossed in prison for a very long time.
    Oh, don't look at me. I'm eating pizza, burgers and sausages all the time, and I'm healthy as a balloon.
    "Not learning from mistakes is worse than committing mistakes. When you don't allow yourself to make mistakes, it is hard to be tolerant of others and it does not allow even God to be merciful."

  4. #84
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by German guy View Post
    Oh, don't look at me. I'm eating pizza, burgers and sausages all the time, and I'm healthy as a balloon.
    The Hindenburg?

  5. #85
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoC_T View Post
    The Hindenburg?
    Hopefully not ... :P
    "Not learning from mistakes is worse than committing mistakes. When you don't allow yourself to make mistakes, it is hard to be tolerant of others and it does not allow even God to be merciful."

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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by NoC_T View Post
    The Hindenburg?
    Those foods do tend to cause a lot of gas

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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by tacomancer View Post
    Those foods do tend to cause a lot of gas
    It's the curries I'm worried about.

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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    meatloaf sandwich for sure.

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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    I swear I left my masculinity around here somewhere, but I can't remember where.
    It's over there by your tampons.

  10. #90
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    Re: Are men in the western world losing their masculinity?

    Because this post covers so much I'm going to shorten down the responses and focus on things I disagree with or haven't already said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    First, I was making general observations in my OP, not conducting a scientific experiment.
    true.

    The type of music they listen to - The type of music someone listens to often describes the kind of person or scene they identify with. It's just an observation, but I think the music men are listening to today is less aggressive, less offensive, and generally more watered down.
    Aggressive music as in the form of heavy metal, rock, rap, punk is all modern (within the last 70 years).

    I love everything from Enya to Type O Negative, Mozart to Zombie. It doesn't add to or negate my femininity. I wager it doesn't affect masculinity in the same way. Music choices often do not dictate 'who you hang around' and 'what you do for a living' - you're resorting to stereotypes. You're making assumptions that it defines people by who they associate with and what they do in life: and it does not. Snider did not testify in front of Congress in order for you to sit her and claim that music choices dictate your gender.


    You also see male feminists, such as the one in the link by GaThomas with the male politician in Sweden who wants to make it illegal for men to urinate standing up. All of this, to me, is indicative of the "new man," which is a man who doesn't want to offend women and gays, who would gladly throw his manhood out the door, bend over and waffle around in order to avoid any hint of conflict or offending anyone. Today's man is a wet fish, not very masculine.
    You're taking a few stray outliers - some oddities - and claiming they're 'the new male'. I have 4 boys and none of them were taught to pee sitting down.

    - Again, I think your view of 'the average guy these days' is very off. You're focusing on minority groups of guys (gays and activists) and claiming they're reflective of 'a norm' and they're not. They're not *at all*


    The disinterest in beer - Drinking beer is a risk-taking activity, and being risky makes it masculine. Just like riding a motorcycle is masculine, skydiving is masculine, going to war is masculine, and so on. Today's man drinks diet 7-up and eats vitamins so he can look good in his skinny jeans.
    Beer became a common beverage when it was first invented. Women, Men, Children drank it. Why? Because they knew that drinking water was dangerous - and beer was relatively safe. What they didn't understand was that the process to make beer *disinfected the substance* so it was then purified for consumption.

    Aside that: other cultures embrace different drinks as staples and most involve heating or boiling the water to produce it. Tea, other liquors, coffee, etc. Likely: they all came into favor for the same reason. The heating process made it safe to drink.

    It's not about risk. If you think it's about risk then that's just your view, your interest. That does not reflect drinking and society in a fair or accurate light. Risk is a modern slant on an old commonplace element.

    ...and sports - Sports are competitive and aggressive, two masculine traits. Interest in sports is down in the past couple decades. And yes, competition is a masculine trait. Winning induces a dopamine surge, which raises testosterone. I'm not making stuff up half-assed, you can look it up. [...]
    You presented the idea that competition is a masculine trait - I countered with the point that competition is a HUMAN nature characteristic found in most societies and equally in both genders. HOW we are permitted to express said desire for competition is what relies on gender. I used the example of Figure Skating VS Football. There are feminine forms of competition and masculine forms.

    the sudden interest in telephones and gossip- co-dependence is a feminine trait, men are more individual. Women travel in packs and giggle and finish each other's sentences and lean on each other for support, men go our own way without needing validation from anyone else. But not today's man, today's man keeps his boyfriends on speed dial or group text so he can share instagram photos of his new skinny jeans.
    Again, more stereotypes. Who are you example for these things? It's painful to see your view of the average person these days because i only see these people on TV shows.

    I do not travel in packs, I do not giggle, I do not finish other people's sentences. Many women do not.
    Telephones and Gossip - why did you decide that communicate is masculine? Real men don't talk to people? I don't follow how you concluded this. Do you think that teens/men 50 years *did not* keep up with each other and talk about stuff they were into? They just, what, stood around silent and alone?

    the obsession with skinny jeans and metrosexual fashion- Again, a sign of a need for approval and validation from other people, not a masculine trait.
    What obsession? My god man - where do you live? I don't see this save for the OCCASIONAL outlier here and there. Hardly indicative of a society shift.

    and a general passive, whining demeanor- Aggression is a masculine trait. A man is direct and confronts problems with directness. Passive aggression is a feminine trait and it comes from not being able to impose your will, so you have to work around the side and backstab.
    More stereotypes. Women aren't direct? We can't be confrontational? What planet are you ON?

    Today's man won't stand up and say what he means and mean what he says (dominant traits, hence masculine), today's man will passively whine and nag hoping that you will solve his problems for him.
    A lot of guys do - why do you think they don't? We boast high crime, rape, murder rates that reflect that this compulsion for physical confrontation hasn't gone anywhere. If anything, it's only increased to the point of it being absurd.

    Every European/Western society encourages males to show restraint and not 'stoop to the low level of being a brute' - take note of that. No society ENCOURAGES that type of behavior.

    Anyway, back to the point of the OP... while my observations might be subjective I've seen enough in my mind to conclude that masculinity is definitely on the decline. What's worrying is that this decline might be tied to a biological decrease in testosterone, as shown by studies. Researchers speculate that the decline migh be due to chemicals in the environment. If that's true, it's concerning and the public needs to be aware.
    Well - based on my exposure to men in the world which includes a large number of college tens, men in my family of all ages and races, and my own children and their school friends, etc: masculine as *you* define it and even as *I define it* is not on a decline at all. I don't know where you are - but I don't think what you see is reflective of "the future of mankind"

    I think you're worried about things that are merely temporary trends in society - specifically: your region. Join me in Arkansas - you can drink beer and root for the Razorbacks like everyone else. "Manly men" aren't an endangered species. You're bothered for nothing.

    Many of your concepts ARE based on modern 'masculinity' and reflect males TODAY and how they view things like drinking and music.

    Masculinity, to me, is much more substantial than that. It withstands the test of time because it is not trivial things like a CHOICE of sports.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

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